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tblue37

(65,227 posts)
9. Obama *is* the Democratic candidate, regardless of whom the Republicans nominate.
Mon Jan 23, 2012, 09:13 PM
Jan 2012

Are you suggesting that we should not vote for the Democratic candidate (which would, of course, lead to the election of whichever awful candidate the Republicans finally nominate)?

Yes, Obama sometimes is not as liberal as one would wish, but I still think a lot of that has to do with the mess he inherited and obstructionism not just by Republicans, but also by supposed Democrats and that idiot Lieberman.

I do wish Obama would use the bully pulpit more effectively to push more liberal policies, and I also wish he would start from a better position rather than giving too much away at the beginning of a negotiation.

Nevertheless, he has accomplished quite a lot, and he will accomplish even more if we give him a stronger, more liberal Democratic majority in both houses (not that skimpy 59.5 in the Senate (Franken wasn’t seated for a long time) that included Lieberman and a lot of DINOs).

I would like to point out, too, that the LBJ you excoriate also signed the Civil Rights Act of 1964, which he helped push through Congress, and the Great Society programs that he deserves much of the credit for have done a lot for a lot of people.

LBJ and Obama are not the enemy, no matter how much some people might try to push the meme that they are. They are on our side, but not perfect and not perfectly effective.

Eric Alterman has a wonderful book, Kabuki Politics in which he describes the institutionalized aspects of our political system that make real change away from 1%-er goals toward 99%-er goals nearly impossible to achieve, even when a president really tries hard to achieve what the people of the 99% want. The answer is not to immediately cut our guy off at the knees when he doesn't give us what we want, but rather to elect more and more liberals at the lower levels (state and local), and to pack the two houses of congress with real liberals.

That takes time and effort. The right wing didn't win overnight. They played a long game, a decades-long game, to get where they are now. Even Ron Paul takes a long view. He knows he won't be president. He knows he can't even get media attention, no matter how well he does. But he also knows that he is starting a movement that will bear fruit in time.

We also need to take the long view and stop throwing away our best guy just because he is the best we have now, not the best we could possibly have if things were better in general. I would rather have someone like Dean, Clark, Grayson, Warren, or any one of a number of other true liberals shaping our policies--but my guess is that if we did have someone like that, he or she would be hamstrung by the system and its entrenched powers, and thus not able to do any better than Obama has done. In fact, most would probably not do as much as he has for us, simply because he is playing the long game.

Furthermore, the USSC is the reason why Citizens United is allowed to deform our politics even worse than it was before--and the next president will appoint at least 2 or 3 USSC justices. It is absolutely essential that we have no more like Roberts, Alito, Scalia, Thomas on the USSC, so it is absolutely essential that Obama be re-elected. He is the only possible candidate to defeat whomever the Republicans nominate, so it is just wrong, wrong, wrong to strongly suggest that people shouldn't vote for him because LBJ escalated the Vietnam War. There are no other available choices: the next president will be Obama, or it will be some RW Republican yahoo who will appoint more like those guys to the USSC.

If we want someone more progressive than Obama to run and to have any chance of winning, then we must look to the future and lay the groundwork for such an outcome, the way Dean laid the groundwork for a nationwide race by contesting all 50 states, even though the Democratic establishment fought him tooth and nail over that plan and then rolled it back as much as they could as soon as they got rid of him as chairman. Abandoning our only presidential candidate in this cycle, as you seem to be suggesting, would not help us one iota in this cycle, but it would set us back enormously in terms of what we might achieve in future cycles.

Articles like this are just poking them with a stick jberryhill Jan 2012 #1
I'm really enjoying George Will being upset about this ... after all, he helped cause it. JoePhilly Jan 2012 #2
Yup. City Lights Jan 2012 #3
I don't eat popcorn but Responder3 Jan 2012 #43
Well said, JoePhilly. russspeakeasy Jan 2012 #4
exactly riverwalker Jan 2012 #5
Brilliant analysis of the Newt's appeal... Surya Gayatri Jan 2012 #13
They created a monster, and it's fun to watch. Odin2005 Jan 2012 #42
Getting someone like the opponent to Goldwater would be a good thing? AnotherMcIntosh Jan 2012 #6
Obama *is* the Democratic candidate, regardless of whom the Republicans nominate. tblue37 Jan 2012 #9
If you want a liberal candidate, you do not keep the candidate from knowing such views. AnotherMcIntosh Jan 2012 #10
If you want to attack LBJ on Vietnam, get your facts straight. happyslug Jan 2012 #23
If LBJ would have stuck with Civil Rights and not reversed NSAM 263 w NSAM 273, no lengthy defense AnotherMcIntosh Jan 2012 #24
No way he would have forced Congress to pass the Civil Rights Acts of 1964 or the voting act of 1965 happyslug Jan 2012 #33
Believe what you want. It's not convincing. AnotherMcIntosh Jan 2012 #37
the SCOTUS argument is specious Doctor_J Jan 2012 #18
You're right, the SCOTUS argument is specious. But if history is a guide, Reid will simply say that AnotherMcIntosh Jan 2012 #27
Obama got Sotomayor and Kagan confirmed. nt tblue37 Jan 2012 #39
You are pulling the string too hard. The comparison is as follows: Goldwater=Batshit Crazy. MADem Jan 2012 #11
No. Obama WILL BE chosen. Obama WILL WIN the general election. AnotherMcIntosh Jan 2012 #12
Six of one, half dozen of the other. He's the guy. Anyone who thinks otherwise is deep in fantasy MADem Jan 2012 #14
The "mushy middle" is a term of disparagement and contempt, not endearment or respect. AnotherMcIntosh Jan 2012 #17
The "mushy middle" wants Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, and probably single payer health care Doctor_J Jan 2012 #19
We can agree without thinking of the middle as the "mushy middle." AnotherMcIntosh Jan 2012 #22
No it isn't. It's reality. There is a big mushy mess of people in the middle. They are not like MADem Jan 2012 #26
There's a good reason why you never suggested that Obama used the term "mushy middle." AnotherMcIntosh Jan 2012 #28
Excuse me but YOU were the one who said that he never used the term "in public." MADem Jan 2012 #34
Nonsense. AnotherMcIntosh Jan 2012 #38
He had a Dem congress his first two years Doctor_J Jan 2012 #21
People like you will make SURE he doesn't have a greater majority. MADem Jan 2012 #25
ah, yes, the familiar lament from the right - "Don't tell me the truth - it's too depressing" Doctor_J Jan 2012 #29
You are entitled to your flawed opinion. Repeating it doesn't make it any more true than it was MADem Jan 2012 #30
So you are admitting that he won't have bigger majorities than he did the first time Doctor_J Jan 2012 #31
I am not "admitting" anything. And you have a bad tendency to go on with the MADem Jan 2012 #32
Absolutely right. Well said. AnotherMcIntosh Jan 2012 #36
I don't remember a Kornacki landslide back then. Kablooie Jan 2012 #7
K & R !!! WillyT Jan 2012 #8
Gingrich, the perfect first abuser of Evidence-Free Indefinite Detention of US Citizens. blkmusclmachine Jan 2012 #15
One thing to never forget DonCoquixote Jan 2012 #16
We've been reading about the Repuke suicide for at least 15 years Doctor_J Jan 2012 #20
You have to wonder what moderate Republicans are going to do if the right wing continues neverforget Jan 2012 #35
Join them on the fringe - Exhibit A Doctor_J Jan 2012 #40
This batch of crazies would call Goldwater an evil socialist, today. Odin2005 Jan 2012 #41
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