Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search
 

Demeter

(85,373 posts)
30. The Bitcoin Blasphemy Joe Nocera
Sat Mar 1, 2014, 10:33 AM
Mar 2014
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/03/01/opinion/nocera-the-bitcoin-blasphemy.html?_r=0

Whenever I read a story about bitcoin, the virtual currency that has been so much in the news these days, I think about a man named Dee Hock. In the early 1970s, Hock created the credit card system that we now know as Visa. Hock was a man who liked to think grandiose thoughts. When it came to Visa, and credit cards in general, Hock used to describe them not just as a way to get a short-term loan but as a new kind of payment system, an exchange of value that was on par with, and that competed with, cash. As it turns out — and the bitcoin experience is helping to illustrate this — Hock’s description of credit cards was more than a little hyperbolic. Yes, you could now use a small plastic card instead of cash to buy something, but that card had value because it connected both the buyer and the seller to a fiat currency. People trusted it because they believed in their country’s currency and financial institutions. The exchange of value was never the credit card itself; it was still the dollar, the pound, the yen.

Bitcoin, on the other hand, is truly a new form of payment system, unconnected to any currency or any government. Its libertarian proponents in Silicon Valley love that about it; they talk about it as a potential disrupter of traditional financial institutions. It has value not because a government has decreed and backed its value — the classic definition of a fiat currency — but because a community of users has decided to give it value. Its current travails, however, suggest that may also be its inherent flaw: that however much we say we mistrust governments and banks, when it comes to our money, we trust them a lot more than we trust some clever lines of computer code.

The Internet, I should note, could really use a digital currency. For starters, it would make transactions on the web much easier while cutting down on the rampant credit card fraud and identity theft that exists online. It is also true that there have been many unsuccessful attempts to create a digital currency. Bitcoin is by far the most ingenious attempt, and it solves numerous problems. It allows for anonymity, just like cash, while also rendering transactions public, which ensures against double spending (that is, using the same bitcoins for multiple transactions). It is virtually impossible to counterfeit. And, as Felix Salmon pointed out last year, “to all intents and purposes, bitcoins are invisible to law enforcement and the taxman.” But so far bitcoins have less resembled a currency than a commodity. Up until now, they have mostly been used for pure speculation. Indeed, because there are only a limited number of bitcoins in circulation, the speculative ride has been pretty wild. In February, the bitcoin dropped in value from around $880 to the mid-$5oos.Bitcoin’s gyrations hardly engender trust among potential users. And the recent bitcoin-related news isn’t exactly reassuring either. First, a well-known bitcoin entrepreneur was arrested for allegedly laundering criminals’ money on an underground website called Silk Road, which traffics in, among other things, illegal drugs. Then, Mt. Gox, the leading bitcoin exchange, went out of business — and nobody knows what happened to the hundreds of millions of dollars worth of bitcoins it was holding for customers.

The country’s most prominent bitcoin backer, the venture capitalist Marc Andreessen, whose firm is funding bitcoin-related start-ups, raced to CNBC to claim that the Mt. Gox failure was just part of the growing pains for bitcoins. And maybe it is. But who in his right mind, whether merchant or customer, is going to engage in commerce with a currency so seemingly unstable, or one that can so quickly disappear? The great irony of bitcoin is that its anonymous creator (or creators), who goes by the name Satoshi Nakamoto, believed that people would want his new currency because they had learned to mistrust financial institutions. As Salmon notes, when Nakamoto introduced bitcoin, in February 2009, he wrote:

“ ‘The root problem with conventional currency is all the trust that’s required to make it work. The central bank must be trusted not to debase the currency, but the history of fiat currencies is full of breaches of that trust. Banks must be trusted to hold our money and transfer it electronically, but they lend it out in waves of credit bubbles with barely a fraction in reserve. We have to trust them with our privacy, trust them not to let identity thieves drain our accounts.’ ”


All of which is true. But however angry we might be at bank compensation or at the role of financial institutions in the financial crisis, we still trust banks to safeguard our money, and we still trust government to back our currency. For bitcoin to succeed, it will have to embrace the one thing it was most intended to avoid: government.


THAT'S ONE MAN'S OPINION....I EXPECT, IF WE ALL TRADED WITH GOLD, THERE WOULD BE NO GOVERNMENT NEEDED. OR FOOD. OR ALCOHOL. OR OIL. OR MARIJUANA. IN OTHER WORDS, COMMODITY-BASED TRADING WOULDN'T NEED A GOVT. EXCEPT TO DEAL WITH CONTRACT VIOLATIONS CAUSED BY NON-DELIVERY AND FRAUD (SELLING SHIT AS SHINOLA, FOR EXAMPLE, OR ADULTERATED PRODUCT).

GOVERNMENT ISSUES AND ENFORCES FIAT CURRENCY. IF IT REGULATED BITCOIN, THEN BITCOIN WOULD BECOME FIAT CURRENCY.

THE SOLUTION HAS NOT BECOME OBVIOUS, YET.
Speaking of money, we have not one but TWO failed banks this evening (so far) Demeter Feb 2014 #1
Calvin was an evil bastard, IMHO. Democracyinkind Feb 2014 #2
You won't get any argument from me about Calvin Demeter Feb 2014 #4
The Creditanstalt: the bank that started the Great Depression and WWII Demeter Feb 2014 #3
Gold Fix Study Shows Signs of Decade of Bank Manipulation (repost with different emphasis) Demeter Feb 2014 #5
Gaius Publius: Are Democrats who Propose Cuts to Social Security “Stupid” or Just Doing Risk-Analys Demeter Feb 2014 #6
National Endowment for Democracy in Venezuela Demeter Feb 2014 #7
Is It Time for a New Church Committee? Demeter Feb 2014 #8
The Whole Bitcoin Blowup Continues--Tiresome As It Is Demeter Mar 2014 #9
ABBA KNOWS THE SCORE Demeter Mar 2014 #16
The Bitcoin Blasphemy Joe Nocera Demeter Mar 2014 #30
Is the Next Big Economic Bubble About to Pop? Demeter Mar 2014 #10
The Erosion of the U.S. Constitution ... and It Starts in the White House By Peter Van Buren Demeter Mar 2014 #11
Snowden's Lesson: Govt. Carries Out Constitutional Crimes, While the Public Is Legally Powerless Demeter Mar 2014 #13
NSA robots are 'collecting' your data, too, and they're getting away with it Demeter Mar 2014 #17
10 Reasons to Call for MORE Than $10.10 as a Minimum Wage Demeter Mar 2014 #12
How Govt. Hides the Poor: Formula for Measuring Poverty Dates to When a Loaf of Bread Cost 22 Cents Demeter Mar 2014 #15
This one I know about--Musical interlude Demeter Mar 2014 #14
MONTY PYTHON CHIMES IN--How young Eric Idle looks! Demeter Mar 2014 #18
I think I'm going to have to do a Monty Python Weekend Soon Demeter Mar 2014 #19
And then, there's what passes for entertainment these days Demeter Mar 2014 #20
The Threat Of A Full-Blown Russian Military Intervention In Ukraine Is Mounting xchrom Mar 2014 #21
Russian legislators vote unanimously to approve the use of military force in Ukraine DemReadingDU Mar 2014 #32
WORLD BANKER MAKES STUNNING CONFESSION Demeter Mar 2014 #22
Tim Cook Erupts After Shareholder Asks Him To Focus Only On Profit xchrom Mar 2014 #23
I KNOW IT INHIBITS MY PURCHASES--ESPECIALLY WHEN THE CHOICES ARE ALL WRONG Demeter Mar 2014 #24
DROP A TEAR, IF YOU WILL, FOR THE GOP Demeter Mar 2014 #26
Iraqi Oil Production Surges xchrom Mar 2014 #25
A Little History Lesson On Ukraine And Crimea May Help Put Things Into Perspective xchrom Mar 2014 #27
Chinese Manufacturing PMI Falls To 8-Month Low xchrom Mar 2014 #28
I'll give you all a chance to catch up, and let X and others handle posts for a bit! Demeter Mar 2014 #29
The TBFT? MattSh Mar 2014 #47
No, just dyslexic Demeter Mar 2014 #48
STAR UPDATE Demeter Mar 2014 #31
Musical Interlude hamerfan Mar 2014 #33
I don't think I ever heard that one before Demeter Mar 2014 #37
Musical Interlude II hamerfan Mar 2014 #34
Wow! That's better than the one I had Demeter Mar 2014 #39
Musical Interlude III hamerfan Mar 2014 #35
But of course! Demeter Mar 2014 #42
Musical Interlude IV hamerfan Mar 2014 #36
Good music for the asking! Demeter Mar 2014 #43
Here's something I posted earlier this week about the economic situation in Ukraine... MattSh Mar 2014 #38
Hope you and yours are safe Demeter Mar 2014 #41
Here's something out of Hungary... MattSh Mar 2014 #44
That's Our Global World Order Demeter Mar 2014 #46
PCR has posted lyrics to this song DemReadingDU Mar 2014 #49
Spent a few hours inside the barricades today... MattSh Mar 2014 #50
PCR is describing a classic American Clusterfuck ala Reagan Demeter Mar 2014 #62
We've got a couple of possibilities already MattSh Mar 2014 #52
MoveON is patting itself on the back for "Stopping a war with Iran" (with Putin's help) Demeter Mar 2014 #69
Musical Interlude V hamerfan Mar 2014 #40
What's This? the BFEE anthem of Imperialism? Demeter Mar 2014 #45
"Romanian Song (Blood and Gold)" - Andy Irvine Ghost Dog Mar 2014 #51
42nd Street: "We're in the Money" antigop Mar 2014 #53
Donna Summer: "She Works Hard for the Money" antigop Mar 2014 #54
Arrowsmith: "Eat the Rich" antigop Mar 2014 #55
Shania Twain: "Ka-ching" antigop Mar 2014 #56
Tony Bennett: "With Plenty of Money and You" antigop Mar 2014 #57
Willie Nelson: "If You've Got the Money, I've Got the Time" antigop Mar 2014 #58
Dire Straits: "Money for Nothing" antigop Mar 2014 #59
Burl Ives: "Silver and Gold" antigop Mar 2014 #60
Cyndi Lauper: "Money Changes Everything" antigop Mar 2014 #61
You go, antigop! Demeter Mar 2014 #63
oh, you want more? I thought I was taking over the thread so I stopped nt antigop Mar 2014 #64
If it gets too long, we start a second thread Demeter Mar 2014 #65
just didn't want to hijack your thread (smile) nt antigop Mar 2014 #66
Amy Winehouse: "Hey, Little Rich Girl" antigop Mar 2014 #67
A natural performer. Ghost Dog Mar 2014 #72
hey, the rules didn't state it had to be a great performance! :smile: nt antigop Mar 2014 #76
Steve Miller Band: "Take the Money and Run" antigop Mar 2014 #68
Patti Smith: "Free Money" antigop Mar 2014 #70
U.S. 6th Circuit Court to consider Detroit bankruptcy eligibility appeal Demeter Mar 2014 #71
Russia's Seizure of Crimea Is Making Former Soviet States Nervous xchrom Mar 2014 #73
Imagine Getting 30 Job Offers a Month (It Isn't as Awesome as You Might Think) xchrom Mar 2014 #74
Here's What Is Going To Happen With Ukraine xchrom Mar 2014 #75
Do you want to know what REALLY just happened? Demeter Mar 2014 #99
Clint Eastwood, "Paint Your Wagon": "Gold Fever" antigop Mar 2014 #77
Oh, Yes! Can't forget that one Demeter Mar 2014 #81
Apple Tree: "Wealth" antigop Mar 2014 #78
CITIGROUP LOWERS 2013 PROFIT ON MEXICO FRAUD xchrom Mar 2014 #79
Be sure to see Doonesbury antigop Mar 2014 #80
Oh, the humanity! Demeter Mar 2014 #82
Annie: "Easy Street" antigop Mar 2014 #83
Candide: Kristin Chenoweth: "Glitter and Be Gay" antigop Mar 2014 #84
Thanks for the great collection of money tunes! DemReadingDU Mar 2014 #85
"Fiddler on the Roof", Zero Mostel: "If I Were a Rich Man" antigop Mar 2014 #86
This message was self-deleted by its author antigop Mar 2014 #87
Musical Interlude VI hamerfan Mar 2014 #88
Sweet Charity: "Hey, Big Spender" antigop Mar 2014 #89
Curtains: "It's a Business" (one of my favs) antigop Mar 2014 #90
1776: "Molasses to Rum (to Slaves)" antigop Mar 2014 #91
Oliver: "You've Got to Pick a Pocket or Two" antigop Mar 2014 #92
Ah, yes, the Goldman Sachs Theme Demeter Mar 2014 #93
you read my mind...exactly what I thought when I posted it. nt antigop Mar 2014 #95
You see, they can deal with this kind of crook Demeter Mar 2014 #96
Thoroughly Modern Millie: "How the Other Half Lives" antigop Mar 2014 #94
Annie: "We'd Like to Thank You, Herbert Hoover" antigop Mar 2014 #97
"The Producers" -- the whole show -- scamming investors antigop Mar 2014 #98
Is Your Medication Making You Sick? kickysnana Mar 2014 #100
Latest Discussions»Issue Forums»Economy»Weekend Economists Examin...»Reply #30