Welcome to DU!
The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards.
Join the community:
Create a free account
Support DU (and get rid of ads!):
Become a Star Member
Latest Breaking News
Editorials & Other Articles
General Discussion
The DU Lounge
All Forums
Issue Forums
Culture Forums
Alliance Forums
Region Forums
Support Forums
Help & Search
Economy
In reply to the discussion: STOCK MARKET WATCH -- Thursday, 29 March 2012 [View all]Demeter
(85,373 posts)45. Goldman Ex-Prop Traders Flopping on Their Own
http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2012/03/goldman-ex-prop-traders-flopping-on-their-own.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+NakedCapitalism+%28naked+capitalism%29
John Whitehead is being proven right. The former Goldman co-chairman took the unheard of step of excoriating Lloyd Blankfein for Goldmans shocking pay levels of 2006. As anyone who has been following Wall Street knows, compensation levels were even higher in 2007, 2009, 2010 and last year. Per an interview with Bloomberg:
Whitehead went even further, recommending the unthinkable, that Goldman cut pay:
The Galtian traders who carry on as if they are solely responsible for their profits are being shown to be more dependent on the franchise, in particular, the concentrated information flows from dealing with lots of customers and counterparties, than they had persuaded themselves and management. Bloomberg today tells us that the prop traders who have decamped from Goldman, convinced that theyd be able to rack up stellar returns, are floundering. It isnt just that they arent racking up huge wins; they are losing money and falling short of hitting the average for their trading strategy. As the report notes:
Weve long been skeptical of the idea that big firm traders are worth their outsized pay packages. Of course, it nevertheless make sense for management to play along, since higher pay levels for traders justify robust pay for everyone senior to them in the hierarchy (yes, a top trader will often be paid more than the top brass, but its an anchoring issue. And pay in banks at the senior levels has become more hierarchical than it was in the 1980s and 1990s).
MORE HISTORICAL DETAIL AT LINK
John Whitehead is being proven right. The former Goldman co-chairman took the unheard of step of excoriating Lloyd Blankfein for Goldmans shocking pay levels of 2006. As anyone who has been following Wall Street knows, compensation levels were even higher in 2007, 2009, 2010 and last year. Per an interview with Bloomberg:
Im appalled at the salaries, the retired co-chairman of the securities industrys most profitable firm said in an interview this week. At Goldman, which paid Chairman and Chief Executive Officer Lloyd Blankfein $54 million last year, compensation levels are shocking, Whitehead said. Theyre the leaders in this outrageous increase.
Whitehead went even further, recommending the unthinkable, that Goldman cut pay:
Whitehead, who left the firm in 1984 and now chairs its charitable foundation, said Goldman should be courageous enough to curb bonuses, even if the effort to return a sense of restraint to Wall Street costs it some valued employees. No securities firm can match the pay available in a good year at the top hedge funds.
I would take the chance of losing a lot of them and let them see what happens when the hedge fund bubble, as I see it, ends, Whitehead, 85, said .
I would take the chance of losing a lot of them and let them see what happens when the hedge fund bubble, as I see it, ends, Whitehead, 85, said .
The Galtian traders who carry on as if they are solely responsible for their profits are being shown to be more dependent on the franchise, in particular, the concentrated information flows from dealing with lots of customers and counterparties, than they had persuaded themselves and management. Bloomberg today tells us that the prop traders who have decamped from Goldman, convinced that theyd be able to rack up stellar returns, are floundering. It isnt just that they arent racking up huge wins; they are losing money and falling short of hitting the average for their trading strategy. As the report notes:
Ex-Goldman Sachs (GS) Group Inc. traders led by Pierre-Henri Flamand and Morgan Sze raised more than $4.5 billion for their own hedge funds..
So far, none of them has made money for clients.
The two are among at least six traders who have left Goldman Sachss biggest proprietary-trading group in the past two years, which the New York-based bank shuttered in response to new U.S. regulations. All, including Daniele Benatoff and Ariel Roskis, trailed this years stock market rally after losing money in 2011, investors said
Flamand, 41, who was the global chief of Goldman Sachss principal strategies group before he quit two years ago to start Edoma Capital Partners LLP in London, has lost about 2.4 percent through February since his $1.8 billion hedge fund started in November 2010, according to investors.
Edoma is an event-driven fund, which invests in companies undergoing events such as mergers, spinoffs and bankruptcies. Such funds returned an average 3.9 percent in the same 16-month period
Sze, 46, who ran Goldman Sachss principal strategies team in Asia before briefly replacing Flamand as global head, left the bank in 2010 to start Azentus Capital Management Ltd. in Hong Kong, hiring 13 former Goldman Sachs traders. His event- driven fund lost about 4.8 percent through February since its April 2011 inception, said a person with knowledge of its returns.
Event-driven funds declined 2.4 percent in the same period
So far, none of them has made money for clients.
The two are among at least six traders who have left Goldman Sachss biggest proprietary-trading group in the past two years, which the New York-based bank shuttered in response to new U.S. regulations. All, including Daniele Benatoff and Ariel Roskis, trailed this years stock market rally after losing money in 2011, investors said
Flamand, 41, who was the global chief of Goldman Sachss principal strategies group before he quit two years ago to start Edoma Capital Partners LLP in London, has lost about 2.4 percent through February since his $1.8 billion hedge fund started in November 2010, according to investors.
Edoma is an event-driven fund, which invests in companies undergoing events such as mergers, spinoffs and bankruptcies. Such funds returned an average 3.9 percent in the same 16-month period
Sze, 46, who ran Goldman Sachss principal strategies team in Asia before briefly replacing Flamand as global head, left the bank in 2010 to start Azentus Capital Management Ltd. in Hong Kong, hiring 13 former Goldman Sachs traders. His event- driven fund lost about 4.8 percent through February since its April 2011 inception, said a person with knowledge of its returns.
Event-driven funds declined 2.4 percent in the same period
Weve long been skeptical of the idea that big firm traders are worth their outsized pay packages. Of course, it nevertheless make sense for management to play along, since higher pay levels for traders justify robust pay for everyone senior to them in the hierarchy (yes, a top trader will often be paid more than the top brass, but its an anchoring issue. And pay in banks at the senior levels has become more hierarchical than it was in the 1980s and 1990s).
MORE HISTORICAL DETAIL AT LINK
Edit history
Please sign in to view edit histories.
Recommendations
0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):
72 replies
= new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight:
NoneDon't highlight anything
5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
RecommendedHighlight replies with 5 or more recommendations
Sheila Bair Told Administration Its Housing Programs Would Bomb, Was Rebuffed on Better Solutions
Demeter
Mar 2012
#47
Foreclosure Fraud 101: A Step-By-Step Look at One of the Most Common Fixes for Securitization Fail
Demeter
Mar 2012
#48