Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News Editorials & Other Articles General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

Maslo55

(61 posts)
24. specifics are in the links
Tue Jan 3, 2012, 04:25 AM
Jan 2012

"I thought the two designs were compared adequately at the wiki link, so here I'm asking what problems found in the current once-through fuel cycle do you expect this version of the reactor to solve? Would you mind addressing that?"

Read the advantages section in the Wiki, there is a good summary.
- increased safety and proliferation resistance
- nuclear waste issue would be essentially solved (waste from a LFTR reaches safe levels after just 300 years, it can also burn current waste)
- far cheaper fuel which is longterm sustainable (not hundreds but thousands of years)
- no refueling outages due to continual refueling (increased capacity factor)
- far better load following
- various economic advantages during construction (it does not need the most expensive item in a light water reactor, a high-pressure reactor vessel for the core, containment structure only slightly bigger than the reactor vessel can be used, instead of a thousandfold bigger in volume like in LWR, due to high temperature operation efficient and simple Brayton cycle turbines can be used, which reduces the cost of auxiliary equipment (major capital expenses) by 50% or more
- low waste heat - it can be air-cooled, which is critical for use in many regions where water is scarce (does not need huge cooling towers)
- fission products stable after 10 years include many valuable elements (rare earths and medically valuable products)

"The known economics of the technologies that ARE presently available tell us that within the next 30 years renewable energy sources are going to dominate the world energy systems"

And the physics tell us that without significant world grid overhaul and massive amounts of storage, intermittent renewables can never supply more than 1/3 of grid electricity reliably. The step from 0% to 15% of intermittent energy sources in a grid is just not comparable in terms of grid dynamics to the step from 30% to 45%, or 45% to 60%. LFTR and other nuclear delivers continuous power always with nameplate capacity independent of weather, 24/7. We already have a grid with almost 80% nuclear and it is very stable (France).
http://bravenewclimate.com/2009/11/03/wws-2030-critique/
Simple extrapolation of current trends (caused by huge government subsidies per TWh compared to competition btw) 30 years into the future is a poor way of prediction.

"Thanks, but I was aware of that. What I'm asking is specifically what advantage do you see they have in common? Size is a characteristic; for it to be an advantage it has to aid in achieving a goal. What is the advantage or advantages that you think the LFTR will have that you think are exemplified by the SMR of today?"

I have already answered that. SMR LFTRs can be mass produced in a factory and then brought where needed, decreasing construction cost per unit.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

Great idea! Bob Wallace Jan 2012 #1
LFTR power Maslo55 Jan 2012 #2
Geeezzeeeee - here we go again... Bob Wallace Jan 2012 #3
Its like asking Maslo55 Jan 2012 #4
Doesn't make sense... Bob Wallace Jan 2012 #6
You do not understand NIMBYism... Bob Wallace Jan 2012 #8
A whole lot of assumptions there bob txlibdem Jan 2012 #10
And then they'll look at the solar panels on their roof... Bob Wallace Jan 2012 #11
Without adequate excess capacity *and* energy storage, wind / solar will never get us off fossils txlibdem Jan 2012 #14
You have zero basis on which to make that claim... Bob Wallace Jan 2012 #19
Which claim are you even talking about? Do you have proof? txlibdem Jan 2012 #27
Without existing, gen IV nuclear will never get us off fossils FSSF Jan 2012 #23
What is the title of this OP? Is it "Let's talk about what we have now?" No. txlibdem Jan 2012 #28
Because if LFTR performs as expected Maslo55 Jan 2012 #16
And if elephants could fly... Bob Wallace Jan 2012 #20
Never saw the movie "Operation: Dumbo Drop?" txlibdem Jan 2012 #34
Around the corner... Bob Wallace Jan 2012 #36
The failure of a 1960s design is the basis of your argument? txlibdem Jan 2012 #41
There are 104 nuclear reactors running fully-insured in the US right now wtmusic Jan 2012 #43
Please be specific kristopher Jan 2012 #9
Two fluid Maslo55 Jan 2012 #17
I'm sorry, I thought I asked for specifics. kristopher Jan 2012 #21
specifics are in the links Maslo55 Jan 2012 #24
Some things. FSSF Jan 2012 #25
FSSF has already provided some important points for you to consider... kristopher Jan 2012 #30
There are far more problems Maslo55 Jan 2012 #32
Actually there aren't. kristopher Jan 2012 #37
LFTR Maslo55 Jan 2012 #38
Prove it. kristopher Jan 2012 #39
here you go Maslo55 Jan 2012 #40
That doesn't support your claim. kristopher Jan 2012 #42
People in the solar industry think they can get solar at or less than the cost of coal much faster. FSSF Jan 2012 #22
"to build the largest manufacturing industry in the history of mankind" kristopher Jan 2012 #29
K&R. wtmusic Jan 2012 #5
Road apples... Bob Wallace Jan 2012 #7
So you think it's ok to villainize people just for disagreeing with your anti-nuke views? txlibdem Jan 2012 #12
Nut jobs... Bob Wallace Jan 2012 #13
Your post is offensive txlibdem Jan 2012 #15
You haven't noticed all the people... Bob Wallace Jan 2012 #18
So you're not against misleading people, just as long as it's not toward the pro-nuclear side txlibdem Jan 2012 #26
You are doing the math wrong... Bob Wallace Jan 2012 #31
And Maslo55 Jan 2012 #33
Yep. Some of it is really expensive... Bob Wallace Jan 2012 #35
Latest Discussions»Issue Forums»Environment & Energy»Obama primary opponent Bo...»Reply #24