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longship

(40,416 posts)
27. Straw man speaking there. Updated.
Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:58 PM
Jan 2013

Science does inform with facts. But what science does most importantly, is ask questions. Both the facts -- the data -- and the questions are equally important.

Please resist the temptation to portray science as some monolithic, unchanging enterprise. It just isn't so.

I cannot think of any expression of the ideals of science more than those expressed by humanist-mathematician Jacob Bronowski in his BBC/PBS series, The Ascent of Man. It forms the capstone of the episode entitled, Knowledge or Certainty. Here it is:



And, for those who cannot view it all, here is what he said:

“There are two parts to the human dilemma. One is the belief that the ends justifies the means, that push button philosophy, that deliberate deafness to suffering has become the monster in the war machine. The other is the betrayal of the human spirit, the assertion of dogma that closes the mind and turns nations and civilizations into a regiment of ghosts -- obedient ghosts or tortured ghosts.

It's said that science will dehumanize people and turn them into numbers. That's false, tragically false. Look for yourself. This is the concentration camp and crematorium at Auschwitz. This is where people were turned into numbers. Into this pond were flushed the ashes of some four million people. And that was not done by gas. It was done by arrogance, it was done by dogma, it was done by ignorance. When people believe that they have absolute knowledge, with no test in reality, this is how they behave. This is what men do when they aspire to the knowledge of gods.

Science is a very human form of knowledge. We are always at the brink of the known; we always feel forward for what is to be hoped. Every judgment in science stands on the edge of error and is personal. Science is a tribute to what we can know although we are fallible. In the end, the words were said by Oliver Cromwell: "I beseech you in the bowels of Christ: Think it possible you may be mistaken."

I owe it as a scientist to my friend Leo Szilard, I owe it as a human being to the many members of my family who died here, to stand here as a survivor and a witness. We have to cure ourselves of the itch for absolute knowledge and power. We have to close the distance between the push-button order and the human act. We have to touch people.”


That, DUers, expresses what science is about.

On edit: I am tempted to post this as an OP, given the lesson that Bronowski is relating here, is one we should never forget. Even here, I see ones who do not see what's important.

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More from the article: PearliePoo2 Jan 2013 #1
When exactly is this going to be deemed a global threat? Wonder when the cancer rates will show mother earth Jan 2013 #2
One quick comment MAD Dave Jan 2013 #3
No Flaming but... PearliePoo2 Jan 2013 #5
Fukushima Radiation Found In California Tuna PearliePoo2 Jan 2013 #6
Many fish are migratory so the dilution is not going to help there flamingdem Jan 2013 #7
Sure it would. FBaggins Jan 2013 #62
That formula is only viable for a gamma point source. Sirveri Jan 2013 #10
Mercury is a different bird altogether. MAD Dave Jan 2013 #64
Sounds like you'd be a great help to the Japanese gov't...dump everything into the ocean, our work mother earth Jan 2013 #14
Was that really what was said? No. Buzz Clik Jan 2013 #26
You are assuming that ocean currents don't exist and sea life does not move around. kestrel91316 Jan 2013 #51
Rep. Markey wrote an excellent letter to NOAA and the FDA asking pertinent questions... PearliePoo2 Jan 2013 #4
Let's hope Markey continues his work from the Senate! He's great n/t flamingdem Jan 2013 #8
"Everybody RELAX." bvar22 Jan 2013 #9
No scientist is saying there's nothing to worry about. wtmusic Jan 2013 #11
Maybe, maybe not. bvar22 Jan 2013 #13
It may be true! PamW Jan 2013 #17
Sad, really chervilant Jan 2013 #22
A picture is worth a thousand words. PamW Jan 2013 #25
Condescension chervilant Jan 2013 #39
Pot calling the kettle black.. PamW Jan 2013 #41
Again? chervilant Jan 2013 #44
It's NOT presumption PamW Jan 2013 #46
OIC chervilant Jan 2013 #47
Why would I be lucky.. PamW Jan 2013 #48
Wow, Pam chervilant Jan 2013 #53
Bvar was correct kristopher Jan 2013 #56
Indeed chervilant Jan 2013 #57
WRONG AGAIN!!! PamW Jan 2013 #59
Self-serving propaganda? chervilant Jan 2013 #63
Damn it, Kris - I said PWR!!! PamW Jan 2013 #58
You've been pitching that strawman for about a year now. - Correction FBaggins Jan 2013 #60
Straw man speaking there. Updated. longship Jan 2013 #27
Actually, YOUR post is the Strawman. bvar22 Jan 2013 #28
It didn't come off like that. longship Jan 2013 #29
Revisionist History - INCORRECT!!! PamW Jan 2013 #30
Well, you are selective in your history here. longship Jan 2013 #33
More REVISIONIST history PamW Jan 2013 #34
A Clarification longship Jan 2013 #35
If you don't like the response; don't make the mistake. PamW Jan 2013 #36
Mea culpa for my early morning post. longship Jan 2013 #38
Wonder how the fish survived? wtmusic Jan 2013 #12
Another WTF???!!? Adding radiation into the deadly mix isn't helping the planet or humanity. mother earth Jan 2013 #15
Perspective is important wtmusic Jan 2013 #16
Continuing the math.... PamW Jan 2013 #19
Maybe your number is applicable today, but the worst of it is yet to be realized IMHO. I think mother earth Jan 2013 #20
Whether people invest in solar, wind or nuclear, the profit motive is always involved wtmusic Jan 2013 #23
The risks for nuclear power are far too great, and the companies in charge of the sites are mother earth Jan 2013 #24
You've fallen for the anti-nuclear screed, hook, line, and sinker. PamW Jan 2013 #31
You forgot how "scientists" can be stifled & paid off, or must answer to the corporate sponsor or mother earth Jan 2013 #40
That's CRAP and you should know it. PamW Jan 2013 #42
BS, tell that to those that GWB enlisted for his agenda, climate deniers...sorry, YOU have it wrong. mother earth Jan 2013 #43
BALONEY!!! PamW Jan 2013 #45
Spare me your long winded comparisons & try to be succinct. You are writing off alternatives when mother earth Jan 2013 #49
Ignorance of Science doesn't cut it. PamW Jan 2013 #50
Alternative energy is within the realms of science. You are just being ignorant to say it isn't. mother earth Jan 2013 #52
Getting the physics and math right does matter... caraher Jan 2013 #54
McKay's presentation can be very misleading kristopher Jan 2013 #55
Thanks, kristopher caraher Jan 2013 #61
Perspective... PamW Jan 2013 #18
I probably have, but since this OT is about Fukushima, I didn't bring up these other issues as you mother earth Jan 2013 #21
Tradeoffs... PamW Jan 2013 #32
I don't normally get into these wrangles GliderGuider Jan 2013 #37
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