Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News Editorials & Other Articles General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

Environment & Energy

Showing Original Post only (View all)
 

GliderGuider

(21,088 posts)
Tue Jan 22, 2013, 07:51 AM Jan 2013

AGW: a bigger issue than overpopulation? [View all]

It's not considered good form in activist circles to say, "Oh, don't worry about overpopulation - that was last century's problem. Climate change will fix that before we can even intervene." Still, this is a position I adopted in the last year as I began to realize just how soon AGW could take a bite out of the world's fresh water and food supplies - and how big that bite could be.

To demonstrate my reasoning visually I created the graph below. It shows two lower UN world population scenarios, called the Medium and Low Fertility Variants. The world is currently on the Medium Fertility curve, and most population activists would call it a win if we could get moved over onto the Low Fertility curve.

Branching off from each of the UN variants I show a second path that incorporates a gradually increasing downward pressure on population growth, caused by climate change, beginning in 2025. In each case the pressure starts at 0.0% and reaches -1.0% by 2050.

As you can see, this degree of climate change pressure inflects the Medium Fertility scenario down over time until it comes close to matching the Low Fertility scenario by 2050. The same degree of pressure applied to the Low Fertility scenario causes the world's population to begin falling quite rapidly beginning in 2030 - culminating in a drop of half a billion in the final six years.



Is pressure like this within the realm of possibility? It doesn't take much imagination to see the impact of long-term droughts in Russia, Australia, the USA and China on the world's wheat and rice supplies, and glacier-fed rivers are already running dry here and there. It seems quite possible that concerns about overpopulation will be seen as quaint relics within a few decades.

53 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
What's AGW? tama Jan 2013 #1
Sorry, it's "Anthropogenic Global Warming" GliderGuider Jan 2013 #2
Urban consumer myopia tama Jan 2013 #3
Lots of emotive drama GliderGuider Jan 2013 #6
Emotive drama? tama Jan 2013 #8
Oedipus is not "emotive drama"? GliderGuider Jan 2013 #9
Nice meal, tummy full, good woman, tama Jan 2013 #13
My grumpy friend tama Jan 2013 #46
Thank you so much for that. GliderGuider Jan 2013 #47
Let's not underestimate intellect tama Jan 2013 #48
Yes - both/and instead of either/or. GliderGuider Jan 2013 #49
And courage nt tama Jan 2013 #50
Toujours courage, mon vieux! nt GliderGuider Jan 2013 #53
AGW without a doubt, ... CRH Jan 2013 #4
Good point. copare the two scenarios... Speck Tater Jan 2013 #17
To me any one issue isn't really bigger or smaller than the next The2ndWheel Jan 2013 #5
If not bigger or smaller, how about "more or less urgent"? nt GliderGuider Jan 2013 #7
Nobody can agree on that either The2ndWheel Jan 2013 #10
That's pretty much my take on it. GliderGuider Jan 2013 #11
Both issues are important, but, ... CRH Jan 2013 #12
Perhaps both are mutually correcting in a feedback loop? GliderGuider Jan 2013 #14
That is the scenario I perceive, ... CRH Jan 2013 #15
So it goes... nt GliderGuider Jan 2013 #16
Or homo sapiens more clever than wise NoOneMan Jan 2013 #24
Tool monkeys GliderGuider Jan 2013 #26
Tool Monkeys fuck yeah! indeed. n/t CRH Jan 2013 #34
AGW. But then, I've always held nature & wildlife in higher regard than people. nt raouldukelives Jan 2013 #18
Me too. truebluegreen Jan 2013 #51
Self organizing systems... NoOneMan Jan 2013 #19
Mmmhmm. GliderGuider Jan 2013 #21
‘Population Bomb’ scientist: ‘Nobody’ has the right to ‘as many children as they want’ Judi Lynn Jan 2013 #20
I read this, and I'm still a bit in the dark on one thing. GliderGuider Jan 2013 #22
If no couple had more than two children wtmusic Jan 2013 #27
This message was self-deleted by its author wtmusic Jan 2013 #29
Actually, I might try and claim that. GliderGuider Jan 2013 #30
This message was self-deleted by its author wtmusic Jan 2013 #32
Nope, no special powers. And I'm just as human and illusion-ridden as the next schmoe. GliderGuider Jan 2013 #35
This thing is quite the mind fuck, eh? NoOneMan Jan 2013 #37
Thank you. Yes, it is. GliderGuider Jan 2013 #41
I have a question for you on the two child family, ... CRH Jan 2013 #36
No, thats not quite right NoOneMan Jan 2013 #38
Yeah that is what I am wrestling with, ... CRH Jan 2013 #39
There is a finite number of generations alive at any given time. NoOneMan Jan 2013 #42
No, two is the right number. GliderGuider Jan 2013 #43
Ok I guess, but my brain still resists, ... CRH Jan 2013 #44
Yes, you got it. Plus... GliderGuider Jan 2013 #45
I went through this same process on DU a few years ago. wtmusic Jan 2013 #52
Your scenario (roughly double the death rate) would still be 'overpopulation' muriel_volestrangler Jan 2013 #23
I don't think it "solves" it - and there's one twist to my scenario GliderGuider Jan 2013 #25
You said "Climate change will fix that (overpopulation)" is your position muriel_volestrangler Jan 2013 #33
Oh dear. GliderGuider Jan 2013 #40
Anthropogenic Climate Change is an overriding priority OKIsItJustMe Jan 2013 #28
So stipulated, your Honor. GliderGuider Jan 2013 #31
Latest Discussions»Issue Forums»Environment & Energy»AGW: a bigger issue than ...»Reply #0