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Environment & Energy
In reply to the discussion: Sky-High Radiation Found in Fukushima Fish [View all]kristopher
(29,798 posts)55. McKay's presentation can be very misleading
This blog link is worth reading fully:
http://energynumbers.info/british-energy-demand-and-professor-mackays-estimate-of-it-an-explanation-of-the-differences
...The numbers in the first third of Professor MacKays book all lead to the conclusion on page 103 that even if we used all of our renewable resource to its technical maximum, ignoring economic, social and environmental constraints, then it is not enough to meet our energy demand. And that (as he writes later in the book) this applies to Europe too he writes: Europe, like Britain, cannot live off its own renewables.
And yet the figures on 103 are wrong we all agree on that you, me, David, the official statistics. So any conclusion based on them must be in doubt.
Indeed, there are plenty of reasons for doubt because in addition to the inflated demand, the first third of the book also contains economic, social, and environmental constraints on supply, despite the statement to the contrary (Ill write a bit more about the supply side in a new article, later). So those are not about the physics of the thing at all theyre opinions. So, we have an inflated demand, and a set of political opinions on supply. Thats not (in Professor MacKays words) what the laws of physics say about the limits of sustainable energy.
As it turns out, Britains renewable resource is an order of magnitude higher than our energy demand.
And so Britain, (just like Europe and the whole world) can get 100% of its energy from renewable resources.
And yet the figures on 103 are wrong we all agree on that you, me, David, the official statistics. So any conclusion based on them must be in doubt.
Indeed, there are plenty of reasons for doubt because in addition to the inflated demand, the first third of the book also contains economic, social, and environmental constraints on supply, despite the statement to the contrary (Ill write a bit more about the supply side in a new article, later). So those are not about the physics of the thing at all theyre opinions. So, we have an inflated demand, and a set of political opinions on supply. Thats not (in Professor MacKays words) what the laws of physics say about the limits of sustainable energy.
As it turns out, Britains renewable resource is an order of magnitude higher than our energy demand.
And so Britain, (just like Europe and the whole world) can get 100% of its energy from renewable resources.
A much better approach is demonstrated by work such as this:
Cost-minimized combinations of wind power, solar power and electrochemical storage, powering the grid up to 99.9% of the time
Abstract
We model many combinations of renewable electricity sources (inland wind, offshore wind, and photovoltaics) with electrochemical storage (batteries and fuel cells), incorporated into a large grid system (72 GW). The purpose is twofold: 1) although a single renewable generator at one site produces intermittent power, we seek combinations of diverse renewables at diverse sites, with storage, that are not intermittent and satisfy need a given fraction of hours. And 2) we seek minimal cost, calculating true cost of electricity without subsidies and with inclusion of external costs. Our model evaluated over 28 billion combinations of renewables and storage, each tested over 35,040 h (four years) of load and weather data. We find that the least cost solutions yield seemingly-excessive generation capacityat times, almost three times the electricity needed to meet electrical load. This is because diverse renewable generation and the excess capacity together meet electric load with less storage, lowering total system cost. At 2030 technology costs and with excess electricity displacing natural gas, we find that the electric system can be powered 90%99.9% of hours entirely on renewable electricity, at costs comparable to today'sbut only if we optimize the mix of generation and storage technologies.
We model many combinations of renewable electricity sources (inland wind, offshore wind, and photovoltaics) with electrochemical storage (batteries and fuel cells), incorporated into a large grid system (72 GW). The purpose is twofold: 1) although a single renewable generator at one site produces intermittent power, we seek combinations of diverse renewables at diverse sites, with storage, that are not intermittent and satisfy need a given fraction of hours. And 2) we seek minimal cost, calculating true cost of electricity without subsidies and with inclusion of external costs. Our model evaluated over 28 billion combinations of renewables and storage, each tested over 35,040 h (four years) of load and weather data. We find that the least cost solutions yield seemingly-excessive generation capacityat times, almost three times the electricity needed to meet electrical load. This is because diverse renewable generation and the excess capacity together meet electric load with less storage, lowering total system cost. At 2030 technology costs and with excess electricity displacing natural gas, we find that the electric system can be powered 90%99.9% of hours entirely on renewable electricity, at costs comparable to today'sbut only if we optimize the mix of generation and storage technologies.
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0378775312014759
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When exactly is this going to be deemed a global threat? Wonder when the cancer rates will show
mother earth
Jan 2013
#2
Sounds like you'd be a great help to the Japanese gov't...dump everything into the ocean, our work
mother earth
Jan 2013
#14
You are assuming that ocean currents don't exist and sea life does not move around.
kestrel91316
Jan 2013
#51
Rep. Markey wrote an excellent letter to NOAA and the FDA asking pertinent questions...
PearliePoo2
Jan 2013
#4
Another WTF???!!? Adding radiation into the deadly mix isn't helping the planet or humanity.
mother earth
Jan 2013
#15
Maybe your number is applicable today, but the worst of it is yet to be realized IMHO. I think
mother earth
Jan 2013
#20
Whether people invest in solar, wind or nuclear, the profit motive is always involved
wtmusic
Jan 2013
#23
The risks for nuclear power are far too great, and the companies in charge of the sites are
mother earth
Jan 2013
#24
You forgot how "scientists" can be stifled & paid off, or must answer to the corporate sponsor or
mother earth
Jan 2013
#40
BS, tell that to those that GWB enlisted for his agenda, climate deniers...sorry, YOU have it wrong.
mother earth
Jan 2013
#43
Spare me your long winded comparisons & try to be succinct. You are writing off alternatives when
mother earth
Jan 2013
#49
Alternative energy is within the realms of science. You are just being ignorant to say it isn't.
mother earth
Jan 2013
#52
I probably have, but since this OT is about Fukushima, I didn't bring up these other issues as you
mother earth
Jan 2013
#21