Gun Control & RKBA

ellisonz

(27,776 posts)

60. Sociologists disagree.

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 05:44 PM

Feb 2012

Last edited Thu Feb 9, 2012, 08:08 PM - Edit history (1)

Also, seriously, you're going to pretend I'm interjecting race here into the discussion when the article lists ethnic gangs. I'm sorry but the nexus of race and gang membership is a social fact.

I was partially incorrect - I can name exactly one predominantly White gang that is not a White supremacist gang (I'm not sure of the status of minorities in SHARP Gangs:

SHARP logo

Skinheads Against Racial Prejudice (SHARP) are anti-racist skinheads who oppose neo-Nazis and other political racists, particularly if those racists identify themselves as skinheads.

SHARPs recognise the biracial origins of the skinhead subculture, and resent what they see as the hijacking of the skinhead name by white power skinheads - who are consequently designated as "boneheads" by some SHARPs. The SHARP logo is based on the logo of Trojan Records, which originally mainly released black Jamaican ska, rocksteady and reggae artists. Beyond the issue of anti-racism, there is no official political ideology of SHARP.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skinheads_Against_Racial_Prejudice

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Highlight:

Street robberies and you [View all] Atypical Liberal Feb 2012 OP

I always hear it's the guns fault... ileus Feb 2012 #1

This sounds exactly like something Massad Ayoob would write MicaelS Feb 2012 #2

Doesn't read like his writing style. GreenStormCloud Feb 2012 #4

Good information in the article. GreenStormCloud Feb 2012 #3

Outstanding article, burrfoot Feb 2012 #5

This Principles of Personal Defense? Common Sense Party Feb 2012 #7

Yep that's the one... burrfoot Feb 2012 #18

".......most people who kill people with firearms have extensive Simo 1939_1940 Feb 2012 #6

Yup. Despite bald-face denials, most murderers have a long rap sheet. nt SteveW Feb 2012 #8

++ cbrer Feb 2012 #9

This contains some seriously stupid advice. ellisonz Feb 2012 #10

"...this guy tells you to put yourself in dangerous situations and escalate them..." discntnt_irny_srcsm Feb 2012 #11

I did quote. ellisonz Feb 2012 #13

No it doesn't. n/t discntnt_irny_srcsm Feb 2012 #15

Yes, because turning your back and trying to outrun them is such a good idea. krispos42 Feb 2012 #19

I would avoid the conflict in the first place. ellisonz Feb 2012 #20

you are assuming race gejohnston Feb 2012 #21

Race comes into play in any social analysis. ellisonz Feb 2012 #22

strange thing about growing up in the sticks gejohnston Feb 2012 #23

The author inserts all the racially charged imagery he can... ellisonz Feb 2012 #24

It seems you are the only one seeing this code. PavePusher Feb 2012 #27

The author is giving insight into 15 years of experience as a patrol officer. Atypical Liberal Feb 2012 #30

Why are you puzzled? ellisonz Feb 2012 #34

what does "G" mean? Atypical Liberal Feb 2012 #35

G means gangster. ellisonz Feb 2012 #36

Who is "we"? Atypical Liberal Feb 2012 #46

The rhetorical "we" ellisonz Feb 2012 #48

You really should do your own research DragonBorn Feb 2012 #55

Biker gangs are street gangs? ellisonz Feb 2012 #57

Moving the goal posts? DragonBorn Feb 2012 #65

Then why do many sociologists disagree dude? ellisonz Feb 2012 #73

If you are saying... Atypical Liberal Feb 2012 #56

It does not absolutely imply... ellisonz Feb 2012 #58

Race is a social fact when talking about CRIME IN GENERAL. Atypical Liberal Feb 2012 #61

When we talk of murderers in NYC, are we talking about black people? Atypical Liberal Feb 2012 #62

Wamp Wamp. ellisonz Feb 2012 #71

Wamp wamp? Atypical Liberal Feb 2012 #86

13% maybe - doesn't disrpve my claim at all since 85% are not "Caucasian" ellisonz Feb 2012 #68

My experience in living in an inner city gejohnston Feb 2012 #67

Where the heck was this? ellisonz Feb 2012 #76

could be but gejohnston Feb 2012 #78

lol - I think he was having fun with you. ellisonz Feb 2012 #81

gang task force cop or................... gejohnston Feb 2012 #82

You're making an assumption too. ellisonz Feb 2012 #83

his explanation had more to do about night when gejohnston Feb 2012 #85

You might want to rethink your last sentance. DragonBorn Feb 2012 #52

Sociologists disagree. ellisonz Feb 2012 #60

Gangs are gangs. DragonBorn Feb 2012 #66

You're showing how little you know about gangs... ellisonz Feb 2012 #74

The simple fact is, Ellison is racially biased. Atypical Liberal Feb 2012 #64

I can't believe a jury let this stand. ellisonz Feb 2012 #77

Because you're the only one who brought up accusations of racism. PavePusher Feb 2012 #79

Bite me. ellisonz Feb 2012 #80

No, you continue to propagate the stereotype of "gangster" = "person of color". Atypical Liberal Feb 2012 #99

And you continue to deny the stereotype exists... ellisonz Feb 2012 #101

I don't deny the stereotype exists, but it is not relevant to this conversation. Atypical Liberal Feb 2012 #102

How is this not possibly relevant to the conversation? ellisonz Feb 2012 #103

Obviously they recognized what I recognized. Atypical Liberal Feb 2012 #87

Racial minorities are 85% of gang members according to the Federal Government. ellisonz Feb 2012 #90

that was his beat gejohnston Feb 2012 #91

Do they? ellisonz Feb 2012 #92

social identity goes beyond race gejohnston Feb 2012 #93

That's actually a good point. ellisonz Feb 2012 #104

Brings back memories... Marengo Feb 2012 #124

Of course not. Atypical Liberal Feb 2012 #100

Thus 15% of gang members are not. Atypical Liberal Feb 2012 #96

Not in South Boston or Charlestown hack89 Feb 2012 #37

And generally Irish, no? n/t ellisonz Feb 2012 #38

Americans of Irish descent. nt hack89 Feb 2012 #39

Are the Irish generally seen as "different" from the WASPs in today's Boston? n/t ellisonz Feb 2012 #40

No hack89 Feb 2012 #41

Oh really? ellisonz Feb 2012 #42

The subject of the OP is street violence hack89 Feb 2012 #43

You just made my point... ellisonz Feb 2012 #49

So when in those areas it makes sense to sometimes carry a gun. nt hack89 Feb 2012 #53

There's ample evidence, just in the Gungeon, krispos42 Feb 2012 #94

Individuals should take precautions to avoid such situations. ellisonz Feb 2012 #95

You have been lucky. Twice my wife wasn't lucky. GreenStormCloud Feb 2012 #105

I have no issue with any of that... ellisonz Feb 2012 #108

It has to considered in the context of the situation. GreenStormCloud Feb 2012 #110

You do understand the concern... ellisonz Feb 2012 #111

He is obviously not an experienced writer. GreenStormCloud Feb 2012 #112

I understand what he means when he says fan out... ellisonz Feb 2012 #113

So why did you ask that silly question about "passing in the street"? GreenStormCloud Feb 2012 #116

Because most situations... ellisonz Feb 2012 #118

Nor does he teach "shoot first and ask questions later". GreenStormCloud Feb 2012 #119

That is what he is saying. ellisonz Feb 2012 #121

Again you change what he says. GreenStormCloud Feb 2012 #123

Race-baiting? Not really. krispos42 Feb 2012 #114

I would like to see a comparison... ellisonz Feb 2012 #122

I think I'll take the word of a seasoned street cop over yours. dizbukhapeter Feb 2012 #12

lol ellisonz Feb 2012 #14

"What this guy is saying to do is unlawful." PavePusher Feb 2012 #28

To be fair, he does imply it here Atypical Liberal Feb 2012 #31

Not to mention pulling a gun... ellisonz Feb 2012 #32

My bad, I thought he was refering only to the part he quoted, above. PavePusher Feb 2012 #47

And you have how much experence to back that opinion up? oneshooter Feb 2012 #16

How much experience do you have to validate an anonymous internet posting? n/t ellisonz Feb 2012 #17

Post removed Post removed Feb 2012 #25

The level of arrogance and self-deception Simo 1939_1940 Feb 2012 #29

I believe that it is more ignorance and self deception. oneshooter Feb 2012 #84

Haha... ellisonz Feb 2012 #33

His advice is consistent with the literature. GreenStormCloud Feb 2012 #106

Shoot as soon as you think you see a gun? ellisonz Feb 2012 #109

Here are some references: GreenStormCloud Feb 2012 #115

There are a lot of ambiguous situations. n/t ellisonz Feb 2012 #117

Some, but not as many as you would think. GreenStormCloud Feb 2012 #120

As he said, that is not likely to happen. Atypical Liberal Feb 2012 #63

It doesn't happen because it's pure fantasy. ellisonz Feb 2012 #72

I'm willing to take the author at his word. Atypical Liberal Feb 2012 #88

I try to read with a critical mind. ellisonz Feb 2012 #89

Me too. Atypical Liberal Feb 2012 #97

That "fantasy" happens almost a million times a year. N/T GreenStormCloud Feb 2012 #107

great post....thanks for sharing. lots of great info. ileus Feb 2012 #26

This is from a radical right wing/NRA website SecularMotion Feb 2012 #44

Unfortunately... ellisonz Feb 2012 #45

The genetic fallacy? Really? Four words for you, then: Michael Bloomberg and MAIG. friendly_iconoclast Feb 2012 #50

I found it from reddit. Atypical Liberal Feb 2012 #51

We don't need a link to DU from AR15.com SecularMotion Feb 2012 #54

There are plenty of left-wing gun nuts here, too. Atypical Liberal Feb 2012 #59

Not for long SecularMotion Feb 2012 #70

why? gejohnston Feb 2012 #75

I'll take my backwater. :) Atypical Liberal Feb 2012 #98

gun nut does not always equal right wing gejohnston Feb 2012 #69

Already enough? Marengo Feb 2012 #125