Gun Control & RKBA

gejohnston

(17,502 posts)

94. duty to retreat results in more innocent lives

Mon Mar 19, 2012, 08:25 PM

Mar 2012

who are put in greater danger by retreating or not resisting. Even if they do defend themselves, they are financially ruined by the legal system and the robber's/rapest's family looking for a payday with false cries of "injustice."
This is not a typical case at all. The thing is, your side is contradicting yourselves. First you claim it is a "way to get away with murder" and now it is being charged with murder. Which is it? The one in Flagler County is being charged with murder, so the system is working.
You know who is missing? The one that claims that the Florida law disallows any investigation, and the Florida law would allow someone to blow away a sleeping 12 year old kid who fell asleep in the wrong house. She even provided blog links by lawyers claiming that. Guess what? We now know that is total bullshit.

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The Trayton Martin shooter had a concealed weapons permit [View all] jpak Mar 2012 OP

But, but but..... baldguy Mar 2012 #1

You must have also thought... krispos42 Mar 2012 #2

How many teenagers do not wear hoodies? jpak Mar 2012 #3

Exactly. Hoyt Mar 2012 #9

Perhaps you should ask your former LEO relative what to look for. PavePusher Mar 2012 #24

Well, he's no longer alive. But, I bet he would have arrested Zimmerman -- unlike you guys Hoyt Mar 2012 #27

I'd like you to cite to where anyone has defended Zimmerman. PavePusher Mar 2012 #35

"Social Cleansers" have different standards of truth- like Rick Santorum talking about contraception friendly_iconoclast Mar 2012 #40

The "pro-choice" side? LOL Starboard Tack Mar 2012 #87

Your obvious insinuation is obvious. PavePusher Mar 2012 #88

OMG, my obvious is obvious? Starboard Tack Mar 2012 #92

There are a few... discntnt_irny_srcsm Mar 2012 #112

And what would the third option be? Starboard Tack Mar 2012 #113

The third option... discntnt_irny_srcsm Mar 2012 #115

It's pretty easy to discriminate a 'bad guy' from the general populace. AtheistCrusader Mar 2012 #116

A percentage greater than zero. krispos42 Mar 2012 #50

Your post is just on the edge of overt racism. Warren Stupidity Mar 2012 #5

The OP is just on the edge of overt racism and my post here will likely get hidden for pointing out Tuesday Afternoon Mar 2012 #6

I assume his point is half-white people shouldn't be allowed 2A rights. ileus Mar 2012 #7

My point was quite clear. Warren Stupidity Mar 2012 #14

Why would that be racist? All those black bloc little farts in the black hoodies MADem Mar 2012 #18

that was not the intent of the post Warren Stupidity Mar 2012 #21

Maybe I'm "hoodie-inoculated." MADem Mar 2012 #23

Actually, pipoman Mar 2012 #96

WTF? PavePusher Mar 2012 #36

A good dog whistle is always deniable. Warren Stupidity Mar 2012 #38

So is a baseless accusation. Put that card back in the deck, you'll need it later. n/t PavePusher Mar 2012 #39

WTF is that supposed to mean? Starboard Tack Mar 2012 #86

I'm noting the use of broad brushes to paint people. krispos42 Mar 2012 #99

No, CCW holders HARDLY EVER break the law. Atypical Liberal Mar 2012 #12

The statement is true ... spin Mar 2012 #17

technically, we don't know how often anyone BREAKS the law... Scout Mar 2012 #67

So, what, they're supah-dupah ninjas at not getting caught?!? X_Digger Mar 2012 #68

nope. try reading for comprehension. n/t Scout Mar 2012 #77

What leads you to believe that their breaking the law to getting caught ratio is any different? X_Digger Mar 2012 #78

i didn't say that. and it's not a useless point. Scout Mar 2012 #98

Hmm! Let's think about that Starboard Tack Mar 2012 #102

*rather* *might* *heard of*.. so you got squat, that about the size of it? n/t X_Digger Mar 2012 #110

Of course. Anything else would be speculation. Atypical Liberal Mar 2012 #71

Cite or retract the mendacious hyperbole, please. n/t PavePusher Mar 2012 #26

Tht's perfect satire of a ridiculous strawman argument so many anti-CCWers make aikoaiko Mar 2012 #28

Good thing you put the sarcasm thingy cuz as usual rl6214 Mar 2012 #59

It's a good thing SOME gunners understand what "sarcasm" means. baldguy Mar 2012 #61

That doesn't mean that you know anything about what you're talking about. oneshooter Mar 2012 #74

Rude part Minority Racist Toter....only full minorities should own firearms. ileus Mar 2012 #4

And your link to prove the OP is where, exactly? shadowrider Mar 2012 #8

You can look it up, rather than continuing to support the man who murdered an unarmed teenager. Hoyt Mar 2012 #10

Can you show me where I supported him? shadowrider Mar 2012 #31

It appears your factose intolerance is acting up again... friendly_iconoclast Mar 2012 #41

It was reported on NBC news last night jpak Mar 2012 #19

I am confident charges are coming DrDan Mar 2012 #11

Another case of a stupid guntoter hiding behind the stupid stand-your-ground-law jpak Mar 2012 #22

Murder is the unlawful killing, with malice aforethought, of another human rl6214 Mar 2012 #60

Second degree murder JonLP24 Mar 2012 #101

Zimmerman got OUT OF HIS CAR HockeyMom Mar 2012 #111

Yes, when everyone has the right to defend themselves, some people will abuse that right. Atypical Liberal Mar 2012 #13

so a little collateral damage is acceptable . . . . DrDan Mar 2012 #15

it sounds like you are gejohnston Mar 2012 #16

there was no self defense Warren Stupidity Mar 2012 #25

not what I said at all gejohnston Mar 2012 #48

self-defense? not shown in either case - and 2 innocents are dead DrDan Mar 2012 #30

then what was your point about "collateral damage being acceptable?" gejohnston Mar 2012 #49

How much "collateral damage" is acceptable in the practice of medicine? oneshooter Mar 2012 #42

no idea - I can say there is not much DrDan Mar 2012 #44

Most docs carry insurance to cover damages -- howsabout the gun-carrying culture do same. Hoyt Mar 2012 #46

So what price do you put on a persons life? oneshooter Mar 2012 #47

not sure many in this culture consider their damage as "damage" DrDan Mar 2012 #52

I do, but it is insanely cheap because it is so rare. Atypical Liberal Mar 2012 #64

Wait until more and more yahoos carry, more police wannabees, more Zimmermans and Loughners, etc. Hoyt Mar 2012 #73

Oh yes, I'll keep waiting. Atypical Liberal Mar 2012 #76

We accept it with other rights. krispos42 Mar 2012 #51

No matter what you do there will be innocents hurt. GreenStormCloud Mar 2012 #56

let's be clear in the context of this thread - this was far from self-defense on Zimmerman's part DrDan Mar 2012 #58

But you seem to be wanting to do away with ALL armed self-defense. GreenStormCloud Mar 2012 #62

NO one is claiming that Zimmerman acted in self-defense. Atypical Liberal Mar 2012 #65

Yes, a little collateral damage IS acceptable. Atypical Liberal Mar 2012 #63

actions by a "tiny minority" lead to legislation frequently DrDan Mar 2012 #69

Which is why I am part of an organization that defends my rights. Atypical Liberal Mar 2012 #70

the NRA certainly has had success the past few years - much to the detriment of the rest of us DrDan Mar 2012 #72

In what way has it been a detriment? Atypical Liberal Mar 2012 #75

so gun laws are causing a decrease in violent crime - link please DrDan Mar 2012 #79

I did not say gun laws are CAUSING a decreasing in violent crime. Atypical Liberal Mar 2012 #81

of course you were implying that DrDan Mar 2012 #84

Right. Like you clearly implied that conditions were getting worse.... PavePusher Mar 2012 #89

No, as I have said many times... Atypical Liberal Mar 2012 #90

no way you can make that conclusion DrDan Mar 2012 #91

LOL, it's not a "conclusion", it is a plain old fact. Atypical Liberal Mar 2012 #95

bull DrDan Mar 2012 #97

Ah, but that's *not* what he said friendly_iconoclast Mar 2012 #100

it is exactly what he said DrDan Mar 2012 #106

but he did not say gejohnston Mar 2012 #107

and I never said he did DrDan Mar 2012 #108

You are correct. Atypical Liberal Mar 2012 #114

as to the "detriment to the rest of us" - I wonder what Trayvon Martin's family DrDan Mar 2012 #80

The people now have a right to stand up to violence without a duty to retreat. Atypical Liberal Mar 2012 #82

not when it results in loss of innocent lives . . . but then again, guns are not my priority DrDan Mar 2012 #85

duty to retreat results in more innocent lives gejohnston Mar 2012 #94

Yes, a few dead black kids is small price to pay to pack heat and use it jpak Mar 2012 #20

he was in danger of getting away . . . according to the 911 tapes DrDan Mar 2012 #33

Toters like Zimmerman have spent too much time preparing for an opportunity to shoot some kid. Hoyt Mar 2012 #43

I agree with that completely! This guy was waiting for this "opportunity" DrDan Mar 2012 #45

Race is irrelevant. People have the right to self-defense. Atypical Liberal Mar 2012 #66

The Martin shooting is deeply troubling based on initial press, but I'm waiting ... aikoaiko Mar 2012 #29

Agreed shadowrider Mar 2012 #32

thread winner. Tuesday Afternoon Mar 2012 #34

I'm reminded of a Monty Python skit. Warren Stupidity Mar 2012 #37

So he's guilty based on newspaper reports shadowrider Mar 2012 #53

In my opinion he should have been arrested and charged with murder. Warren Stupidity Mar 2012 #54

I'm not denying police conduct is suspect shadowrider Mar 2012 #55

Agreed. eqfan592 Mar 2012 #93

His version is likely to be bullshit JonLP24 Mar 2012 #103

"Likely" to be bullshit shadowrider Mar 2012 #104

I'm not advocating for what you say in your first sentence JonLP24 Mar 2012 #105

We won't hear Martins side shadowrider Mar 2012 #109

On the basis of what one person does you want... GreenStormCloud Mar 2012 #57

Hmm. Where to start on this hyperbolic composition fallacy? montanto Mar 2012 #83