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DanTex

(20,709 posts)
49. ...
Wed May 30, 2012, 06:56 AM
May 2012
In your post, you made a claim, but did not point anything about his methodology. About false positives, that would be one percent of positives, not one percent of all responses. Out of 100 people, 10 say yes, a one percent false positive would mean 0.1 instead of 1. Correct?

One percent false positive rate means that, among all people for whom the true answer is "no", one percent of those people say "yes".

external validation checks, such as?

Look, I've had long debates about this, in which I've responded to the points Kleck is making several times. Briefly, in order for Kleck to be right, not just one but several measurements of crime rates from NCVS have to be wrong by an order of magnitude. Also the FBI numbers have to be wrong. And NCVS is a much higher quality survey than KG -- teams of sociologists have spent years refining the NCVS methodology and testing it to ensure it is as accurate as possible. On the other hand, there is no reason to believe that KG kept their false positive rate below 1%, which would be necessary for his results to be valid, since many (most) phone surveys have an FP rate above 1%. Etc. I've been over this before, and all you seem to do is cut and paste Kleck's words that I've already replied to.

Here is honest question, who were these judges? Were the familiar with the laws with that place at that time for individual gun use? What exactly was deemed illegal?
How was "socially desirable" defined? What basis did they define what was and what was not socially desirable? What information did they have to come to these conclusions?

I don't know. But I think it's pretty safe to assume the judges were familiar with the laws in place. The whole point is that, unlike Kleck, H actually went out to recruit other people who were not involved with the research to decide what was legal or socially desirable. Yes, "socially desirable" is not a precisely defined concept, but then neither is "defensive", and K just took the word of the survey respondents about the defensiveness of their DGUs. Funny how that doesn't seem to bother you at all, and yet you get all nitpicky when it comes to H's methodology, which, while imperfect, is clearly better.

Did I go in depth, no. Hemenway's speculation is a problem. And no, I was not lying about your willingness or ability to have civil conversations. You had one with one person or two. Big fucking deal. Can you do it with most of the folks here? Me specificlly? No. Not once. Every post of yours to me has been anything but civil or reasoned. In DU2, you posts directed at me specifically, were deleted because of personal attacks directed at me specifically. Can you show one or even two posts to me that were civil and reasoned? I seriously doubt it. Granted I responded in kind. Then it was my intellect, and now my honesty. Of course you will demand to see the DU2 deleted posts as evidence, and then claim I was lying when the impossible can't be done.
So I think your hero is a shill and not the "respected scientist" you claim he is. Fucking deal with it. So some Criminologists came up with results they did not expect and you don't like. Fucking deal with it. Science should have no ideology.

Blah blah blah. I don't doubt your intelligence or your integrity. But you do have a habit of posting things that aren't true. And you seem to know a lot about the circumstances surrounding the science, but not so much about the content. That's what makes me think you are approaching the issue ideologically.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

Yes, as long as there's full disclosure to everyone concerned, elleng May 2012 #1
but is it science? gejohnston May 2012 #2
I think a better question to consider: truedelphi May 2012 #4
You just made my point gejohnston May 2012 #6
Except gun control is not an "industry". There's no profit motive. DanTex May 2012 #8
Those in charge of gun control do have a profit motive. truedelphi May 2012 #9
LOL. Yeah, you better stock up on "guns" to protect you from the "man"... DanTex May 2012 #11
Bears are the #1 threat to America. ellisonz May 2012 #59
you missed the point gejohnston May 2012 #12
How is it different than climate change denialists? DanTex May 2012 #16
you have it backwards gejohnston May 2012 #19
Do you ever say anything that's true? I mean even by accident? DanTex May 2012 #21
what I said was true gejohnston May 2012 #23
As usual, you provide no proof of anything you say. DanTex May 2012 #25
Gee I don't know...... gejohnston May 2012 #26
LOL. I guess this is what passes for backing your statements with proof in pro-gunner land... DanTex May 2012 #27
kind like falsly claiming that gejohnston May 2012 #29
Change of subject to a different false allegation. You lose. DanTex May 2012 #31
nope gejohnston May 2012 #32
Must be fun living in that fantasy world of yours... DanTex May 2012 #34
That was an example and you do know gejohnston May 2012 #35
Finally, something true! DanTex May 2012 #36
your post regurgated something a UK paper said gejohnston May 2012 #37
No, mine was correct! Mine is based on more evidence! DanTex May 2012 #38
fuck if I know gejohnston May 2012 #39
The people in it seem to be in it for political points... krispos42 May 2012 #42
I agree with some of what you said. DanTex May 2012 #43
Oops, forgot about this discussion we were having krispos42 Jun 2012 #61
Interesting comment from you Lurks Often May 2012 #58
And I assume you're equally opposed to scientists working with the American Cancer Society... DanTex May 2012 #3
show me evidence Hemenway is actually valid gejohnston May 2012 #5
LOL. "Evidence that Hemenway is actually valid"? DanTex May 2012 #7
let me repprase that gejohnston May 2012 #10
Now you're doing that thing you always do... make false statements. DanTex May 2012 #14
that is not a false claim gejohnston May 2012 #18
And it continues... No substance. Joyce! Something you made up! Kleck is your hero! DanTex May 2012 #20
as soon as you do gejohnston May 2012 #22
Still waiting for you to make a single substantive point. DanTex May 2012 #24
that would require a long post gejohnston May 2012 #47
... DanTex May 2012 #49
and gejohnston May 2012 #50
LOL! A good job of backing up what you claim! DanTex May 2012 #52
that is the truth gejohnston May 2012 #56
Sometimes patience does not lead to resolution... ellisonz May 2012 #60
OK, other than gejohnston May 2012 #46
Wow, you're linking to something by Gary Kleck! Shocking! DanTex May 2012 #48
really? gejohnston May 2012 #51
Blah blah blah. DanTex May 2012 #55
I suggest you read some older posts gejohnston May 2012 #57
"gun violence charities"? PavePusher May 2012 #13
Yes, that's what right-wingers say about global warming advocacy groups also... DanTex May 2012 #15
I noticed that you did not refute what he said, but chose to play the "right-winger" card friendly_iconoclast May 2012 #40
Well done, thanks! PavePusher May 2012 #54
I refer you back to your own words.... PavePusher May 2012 #53
No - it is absolutely **not** proper. Simo 1939_1940 May 2012 #17
I don't see a problem with an interest group in a particular area honoring a researcher petronius May 2012 #28
Not being a scientist gejohnston May 2012 #30
That's certainly the risk an academic takes in this situation - but a free dinner petronius May 2012 #33
You ask this question ... GeorgeGist May 2012 #41
Please explain gejohnston May 2012 #45
Research on gun control is not really science. Remmah2 May 2012 #44
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