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spin

(17,493 posts)
78. Your link is dated 3/5/2000. Bill Clinton was POTUS at that time.
Fri Jun 15, 2012, 10:24 AM
Jun 2012
From page 1 of your link:


Gun Control Laws in Canada

Dateline: 3/5/2000

In his Jan. 27, 2000 State of the Union Address, President Clinton proposed a law requiring the licensing of all American handgun owners.

"Now, specifically, I propose a plan to ensure that all new handgun buyers must first have a photo license from their state showing they passed the Brady background check and a gun safety course, before they get the gun." -- President Clinton, 1/27/2000

The proposal was immediately opposed by American firearms owners, dealers, and manufacturers, as well as many members of the U.S. Congress.
http://usgovinfo.about.com/library/weekly/aa030500a.htm


More recent statistics published on: 2/23/2012 are on this page http://www.statisticbrain.com/national-rifle-association-nra-statistics/ state that in 2010 there were 300 million firearms in the U.S., 100 million of which are handguns.

Comparing crime statistics from nation to nation is a fools game but I will admit that I also often play that game in posts that I make.

Homicide rates
Murder most foul


Oct 6th 2011, 13:18 by The Economist online

A global picture of homicide rates

IT IS famously tricky to compare crime statistics across frontiers. Murder figures are the best of the bunch because the offense is usually reported. According to the first global study on homicide by the United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime, most of the world’s 468,000 intentional homicides in 2010 were in Africa (36%) and the Americas (31%), where the murder rate was 15-16 per 100,000 people, more than twice the global average of 6.9 per 100,000. Homicide in most parts of the world has been falling since 1995, but it has risen recently in Central America and the Caribbean. (There are no reliable data for Africa.) The study suggests two broad trends. The first is a link between development and crime. Countries with low scores on the United Nations Development Programme’s human-development index tend to have high murder rates and vice versa. But exceptions to this reveal a second trend. Organised crime, drug trafficking, violent gang culture and the prevalence of firearms are also correlated with higher murder rates, even in relatively developed countries. Honduras and El Salvador, which have the highest and second-highest murder rates in the world (82 per 100,000 and 66 per 100,000 respectively), are the prime examples of this. One worrying final thought: sudden dips in economic performance have also been known to increase the homicide rate, usually with a lag.



One driver for firearm violence is the illegal trafficking of drugs. The violent crime rate in Canada is increasing because of this problem.

Drug war on another border: Canada

Mexico's crackdown puts the squeeze on cocaine dealers in British Columbia. Up here, as the violence grows, bodies pile up.
By Kim MurphyJune 30, 2009

Reporting from Abbotsford, Canada—
The latest mayhem started at the end of March, when 21-year-old Sean Murphy, a popular former high school hockey player, drove into a withering blast of gunfire near Bateman Park. He was probably dead before his car coasted to a stop in the weeds.

That same night, Ryan Richards, 19, abruptly left a friend's house after getting a cellphone call. His body was found the next morning behind a rural produce store. The stab wounds on his hands told the tale of a furious fight for his life. The undertaker apologized to his family for not being able to conceal them.

***snip***

"Let's get serious. There is a gang war, and it's brutal. What we have seen are new rules of engagement for the gangsters," Vancouver's chief police constable, Jim Chu, told reporters in March.

***snip***

The Lower Mainland has become a playground for young up-and-coming gangsters, who speed around town in armor-plated Cadillac Escalades, Porsche SUVs and BMW sedans.
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-vancouver-gangs30-2009jun30,0,961295.story



Some Canadian Health Experts Have Noticed The Drug War and "Tough on Crime" Things Not Working So Well

Lucy Steigerwald | March 28, 2012

Portugal gets it; the president of Guatemala gets it; Now some Canadians are noticing that the whole be-like-the-U.S. and declare war on plants and people is not the best policy idea.

The chief medical officers of three Canadians provinces, British Columbia, Nova Scotia, and Saskatchewan have written a new paper for Open Medicine called "Improving community health and safety in Canada through evidence-based policies on illegal drugs." Its conclusions are a cautious version of the above; law and order harshness does nothing to sate appetites for drugs, marijuana in particular is not terribly bad for people, and U.S. policies are just awful so why emulate them?

***snip***

It's worth noting that Canada has a reputation for being looser about marijuana than the United States (and is certainly not known for quite the same level of draconian punishments doled out to users and sellers) but the level of support for legalization is almost exactly the same in both countries.

Here's hoping our friends to the North ignore the U.S.'s awful, inhumane example and skip over the 40 years of misery part and get right to the tentative talk of legalization. Maybe they'll get there faster than us.
http://reason.com/blog/2012/03/28/canadians-notice-drug-war-and-tough-on-c


There is no doubt that criminal gangs cause a high percentage of crime in the United States.


2011 National Gang Threat Assessment – Emerging Trends


***snip***

Gang-Related Violent Crime

Gang-related crime and violence continues to rise. NGIC analysis indicates that gang members are responsible for an average of 48 percent of violent crime in most jurisdictions and much higher in others. Some jurisdictions in Arizona, California, Colorado, Illinois, Massachusetts, Oklahoma, and Texas report that gangs are responsible for at least 90 percent of crime. A comparison of FBI Uniform Crime Reporting (UCR) 2009 violent crime data and 2010 NGIC gang data illustrates that regions experiencing the most violent crime—including southern California, Texas, and Florida—also have a substantial gang presence (see Figure 1 and Map 1). Street gangs are involved in a host of violent criminal activities, including assault, drug trafficking, extortion, firearms offenses, home invasion robberies, homicide, intimidation, shootings, and weapons trafficking. NDIC reporting indicates that gang control over drug distribution and disputes over drug territory has increased, which may be responsible for the increase in violence in many areas. Conflict between gangs, gang migration into rival gang territory, and the release of incarcerated gang members back into the community has also resulted in an increase in gang-related crime and violence in many jurisdictions, according to NGIC reporting.
http://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/publications/2011-national-gang-threat-assessment


Are Canada's gun laws effective and should we adopt similar laws? Since criminal drug gangs do not obey laws and can easily smuggle firearms into our nation, I would suggest that stronger gun laws would only effect honest citizens and do little to combat violence.

Far better would be to legalize some drugs such as marijuana in order to take some of the profit motive out of smuggling and dealing in such drugs. Our drug war was lost long ago and we are faced with a serious crime problem because of that failure. It's time to change our course and develop a more rational approach.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

B-b-b-b-b-butttttt...... PavePusher Jun 2012 #1
I am ready for some real answers. There has to be someone with a real plan! Logical Jun 2012 #3
I'm sure there is. discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2012 #73
The Plan? = "Trickle Down Gun Control" DonP Jun 2012 #79
The plan... discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2012 #81
Well, to be fair, rrneck Jun 2012 #2
Once these fail....what is the next step. ileus Jun 2012 #4
Yep, the answer is more guns everywhere for everyone.... rfranklin Jun 2012 #5
And where exactly (links) rl6214 Jun 2012 #11
If you can't see the policies that the NRA is fighting for you need to go to summer school... rfranklin Jun 2012 #70
I asked for links you gave us nada rl6214 Jun 2012 #82
Here you go Mr. Nada... rfranklin Jun 2012 #84
Nice try but not even close to rl6214 Jun 2012 #86
Mr. Nada... rfranklin Jun 2012 #88
I asked for someone to post a link with the following words rl6214 Jun 2012 #89
The sum of their actions proves the statement... rfranklin Jun 2012 #90
So they didn't ever really say that - you just naturally extrapolated it on your own. DonP Jun 2012 #91
Hilarious!!!! bongbong Jun 2012 #92
That's two! discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2012 #93
Happy to give you some small amount of joy - you obviously need it. DonP Jun 2012 #94
Every post bongbong Jun 2012 #96
So you don't mind that gun control is off the political radar, that's great ... and very big of you. DonP Jun 2012 #97
WSOW bongbong Jun 2012 #98
Does that "we" include Wayne LaPierre as well? rfranklin Jun 2012 #99
No, but I used to spend a lot of time sitting at a desk in a Ward office in Chicago ... DonP Jun 2012 #100
This message was self-deleted by its author rfranklin Jun 2012 #101
You're dealing with a Colonist- evidence is optional with them: friendly_iconoclast Jun 2012 #105
The "sum" of what "actions"? PavePusher Jun 2012 #95
So your argument is "criminals ignore laws"? Scootaloo Jun 2012 #6
It's "argument" #554 bongbong Jun 2012 #10
Logical DOES NOT LIKE the NRA so rl6214 Jun 2012 #13
Well, that may be, but his argument IS that criminals break the law Scootaloo Jun 2012 #21
The point is that these stupid laws do NOTHING to make people safer! Nothing! Except make people.... Logical Jun 2012 #103
A guy named "Logical" shouldn't froth so much Scootaloo Jun 2012 #104
So having ineffective laws works for you? Not for me! N-t Logical Jun 2012 #107
In my experience... Scootaloo Jun 2012 #108
Ineffective is no gun zones! Read about them! You sound like the one.... Logical Jun 2012 #109
LOL bongbong Jun 2012 #32
Well, technically speaking, the fewer laws, the lower the crime rate, right? Scootaloo Jun 2012 #15
Yes bongbong Jun 2012 #33
I haven't met a religion that WASN'T strange, so I won't just single out the shamans of shootin' Scootaloo Jun 2012 #59
That's because it only exists in your mind rl6214 Jun 2012 #83
LOL bongbong Jun 2012 #85
And another foolish post from the bong section rl6214 Jun 2012 #87
Looks like bongbong's alert on you was not successful: petronius Jun 2012 #102
Dosen't suprise me one bit rl6214 Jun 2012 #106
Dont ask me ask the NRA, they are the ones who want to put a gun in hands,, benld74 Jun 2012 #7
"Your right to drink stops the second someone drives drunk!" TheWraith Jun 2012 #8
I have no moral panic and I was providing my opinion, benld74 Jun 2012 #14
"Your right to financial derivatives stops when you cause the economy to collapse!" DanTex Jun 2012 #18
Probably more than that if you count the SYG by common law states like gejohnston Jun 2012 #9
Fun fact... Scootaloo Jun 2012 #17
I understand that, but gejohnston Jun 2012 #20
yes, yes in fact it does Scootaloo Jun 2012 #28
No, You don't actually understand how the laws work. gejohnston Jun 2012 #34
So then the laws was unnecessary, since it's "just the same"? Scootaloo Jun 2012 #48
they are more just changes gejohnston Jun 2012 #55
Holy shit, you're presenting arguments! Scootaloo Jun 2012 #63
you don't bother to read provided links do you? gejohnston Jun 2012 #74
"BUT your right to own guns stops the second an innocent person gets shot, killed, or worse." Clames Jun 2012 #22
Zimmerman may be standing behind "Stand Your Ground" ... spin Jun 2012 #47
Can you tell me... Scootaloo Jun 2012 #50
You'll probably get an answer... Clames Jun 2012 #57
What do you think Logical means by this, then? Scootaloo Jun 2012 #58
He's advocating for... PavePusher Jun 2012 #61
Freedom of choice? Scootaloo Jun 2012 #64
No, I put it in the message body so I could use the html italics tags for emphasis. PavePusher Jun 2012 #65
I'm not the one pulling "freedom of choice" out of my ass here, chief Scootaloo Jun 2012 #67
How many criminals does one need to enounter before one should be armed? mvccd1000 Jun 2012 #69
One encounter with a violent street criminal is enough to die from. GreenStormCloud Jun 2012 #71
I'm not pulling anything out of my ass. PavePusher Jun 2012 #80
This. Clames Jun 2012 #76
The fact remains that there is still violence in our society ... spin Jun 2012 #75
Naw... If I had nothing to do with the injury/death of the innocent person... PavePusher Jun 2012 #60
Why does MY right to own a weapon for self defense end "the second an innocent person gets shot"? Common Sense Party Jun 2012 #68
You say "Background checks do not prevent criminals from getting guns!" safeinOhio Jun 2012 #12
how well does it work in Canada? gejohnston Jun 2012 #16
DOESN'T COUNT! DOESN'T COUNT! DOESN'T COUNT! Scootaloo Jun 2012 #19
why not? gejohnston Jun 2012 #23
Here, let me show you. Scootaloo Jun 2012 #30
the FBI was not talking about registration gejohnston Jun 2012 #38
I was talking about background checks in that post about safeinOhio Jun 2012 #43
I did? gejohnston Jun 2012 #46
Sorry, I was talking about the original poster. safeinOhio Jun 2012 #52
Fair enough, my mix-up on that Scootaloo Jun 2012 #44
Good idea, lets compare safeinOhio Jun 2012 #24
like I told DanTex gejohnston Jun 2012 #31
Your link is dated 3/5/2000. Bill Clinton was POTUS at that time. spin Jun 2012 #78
I'm sorry, I should have said, safeinOhio Jun 2012 #25
Actually, it works great in Canada. Just look at their homicide rate compared to ours. DanTex Jun 2012 #27
It actually has little to nothing to do with thier homicide rate gejohnston Jun 2012 #29
Of course it does. This is criminology 101. DanTex Jun 2012 #35
you proved my point gejohnston Jun 2012 #41
Could you better explain safeinOhio Jun 2012 #45
I was using these definitions gejohnston Jun 2012 #51
OK lets compare handgun crime safeinOhio Jun 2012 #36
OK compare Thunder Bay with gejohnston Jun 2012 #42
This has been discussed before. safeinOhio Jun 2012 #53
What evidence do you have El Paso has a lot of immigrants? gejohnston Jun 2012 #56
Did their homocide rate drop after they started registration? PavePusher Jun 2012 #62
Registration does absolutely nothing. Clames Jun 2012 #26
WOW bongbong Jun 2012 #37
Once again... Clames Jun 2012 #39
2% denial rate? Logical Jun 2012 #40
I would disagree with you. safeinOhio Jun 2012 #49
"To address issues of increasing VIOLENT CRIME in the country, the NRA called for more prisons, AnotherMcIntosh Jun 2012 #54
Mostly the fact that violent crime is on a steady decrease Scootaloo Jun 2012 #66
It's all they've got. jeepnstein Jun 2012 #72
OK children, guns are bad mKay n/t Spoonman Jun 2012 #77
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