Police: Body found at US park is that of gunman

[iverglas]

107. but you would have to agree

-- even if you don't like the idea -- that making it mandatory to have a licence in order to acquire or possess firearms would reduce the risk in the case of people like these.

Not eliminate it -- Canada will still have its Kimveer Gills and the UK will still have its Michael Athertons on occasion; no system is perfect to start with, and no system never fails.

Licensing systems still rely on humans: honesty on the part of applicants, to some extent; cooperation and common sense on the part of spouses and family members at the time of application and any other time; the ability of authorites to detect problematic applicants; etc.

But at least there are more opportunities to detect and then deal with such people -- and fewer opportunities for them to access firearms, once a system is operating that reduces both legal sources and illegal sources of firearms for ineligible individuals, and makes it less likely that eligible but problematic individuals have legal access.

Interesting article about Loughner; not really possible to form any hypotheses from it all, is it? And apparently nothing there that would actually have resulted in him not passing a NICS check -- or that could have led to any action that would have had that effect, e.g. commitment for mental illness.

On the other hand, a licensing system might have flagged him. You've seen the Canadian application form:
http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/form-formulaire/pdfs/5592EW.pdf

It includes:

PERSONAL HISTORY (New Canadian Residents and Non-residents, see Information Sheet)

If you answer YES to any of the questions in this section, you MUST provide details on a separate page. Add your name at the top of each page you attach. If details are not provided, your application cannot be processed.
A YES answer does not mean your application will be refused but it may lead to further examination.
If you have received a pardon for any offence listed in box 16 a), you are NOT required to disclose the offence.

16. a) During the past five (5) years, have you been charged, convicted or granted a discharge for an offence:
(i) under the Criminal Code or the Youth Criminal Justice Act where violence was used, threatened or attempted;
(ii) involving the misuse, possession or storage of a firearm; or
(iii) involving trafficking or importing drugs or controlled substances?

b) During the past five (5) years, have you been subject to a peace bond, protection order or an order under section 810 of the Criminal Code?

c) During the past five (5) years, have you or any member of your household been prohibited from possessing any firearm?

d) During the past five (5) years, have you threatened or attempted suicide, or have you suffered from or been diagnosed or treated by a medical practitioner for: depression; alcohol, drug or substance abuse; behavioural problems; or emotional problems?

e) During the past five (5) years, do you know if you have been reported to the police or social services for violence, threatened or attempted violence, or other conflict in your home or elsewhere?

f) During the past two (2) years, have you experienced a divorce, a separation, a breakdown of a significant relationship, job loss or bankruptcy?

CONJUGAL STATUS (You must answer both questions 17 a) & b) or your licence application will be delayed)

17 a) Do you currently have a spouse, common-law or other conjugal partner?
b) Within the last two (2) years have you lived in a conjugal relationship other than with the person you may have referred to in question 17 a) above?

INFORMATION ABOUT CURRENT CONJUGAL PARTNER (see Information Sheet) ...
INFORMATION ABOUT FORMER CONJUGAL PARTNER ...

If the signature of your former spouse, common-law or other conjugal partner is not provided,
the Chief Firearms Officer has a duty to notify them of your application.
IF YOU HAVE ANY SAFETY CONCERNS ABOUT THIS APPLICATION, PLEASE CALL 1 800 ___.
j) Signature of former spouse, common-law partner or other conjugal partner ...

(plus requirement for the signature of two references, with the same "safety concerns" notice)

Those questions directly address known risk factors, for people at risk of committing suicide or harming others.

Now, we might say: who is going to answer "yes" to any of those questions in 16, if they really are suicidal or wanting to kill their estranged spouse, or hold up a gas bar?

Well, getting two references who aren't themselves criminals to sign a dishonest application could be a bit of a chore ... and in fact the whole exercise would be a bit of a chore, for someone who knew they were ineligible and lying (a criminal offence). A lot more of a chore (and probably with more consequences) that taking a flyer and lying on a NICS form, certainly.

There just isn't a huge problem in Canada or the UK, for example, with licensed firearms owners committing homicides or other crimes. Yes, a disturbed person whose family and friends are unwilling to acknowledge the problem can slip through - like Gill did in Canada. Or the system could fail the victims - as in the case of Atherton in the UK (and I find the police description of that case as "he said she said" appalling).

But overall, the system as a whole -- licensing and registration, and perhaps most importantly relatively stringent restrictions on handgun possession -- is very obviously a major factor in the much lower firearms homicide and crime rates in these countries. I'll offer that picture of spousal homicide in Canada over 30 years again as illustration.

http://www.statcan.gc.ca/pub/85-224-x/2010000/part-partie4-eng.htm

Chart 4.2
Spousal homicides by sex,
Canada, 1980 to 2009


Chart 4.6
Firearm-related spousal homicides
by type of firearm, Canada, 1980 to 2009


Something is happening there, and I think it would be foolish to say that the firearms licensing system is not part of it.