Gun Control & RKBA

BiggJawn

(23,051 posts)

35. So we now need a MSW to sell guns?

Reply to The Straight Story (Original post)

Tue Jan 10, 2012, 06:38 PM

Jan 2012

The guy either lied on the 4473 or he had never been adjudicated mentally defective nor confined. And some guy who works in a pawn shop is supposed to play Psychiatrist.
That's the bailiwick of Barbers, Taxi drivers, and Bartenders, not Gun sellers.

Edit history

Please sign in to view edit histories.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

195 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

Family Blames Gun-Seller for Murderous Rampage [View all] The Straight Story Jan 2012 OP

well duh...there's a law suit lottery to be won here. ileus Jan 2012 #1

Yeah, crappy psych analysis is done in this Group all the time. nt SteveW Jan 2012 #98

Did you know that having to stand in line is grounds for negligence? X_Digger Jan 2012 #2

A perfect example of why every state should pass Spoonman Jan 2012 #3

It would make people think twice about the shotgun approach to frivelous law suits. Remmah2 Jan 2012 #15

in theory it sounds good pipoman Jan 2012 #79

Amen to that !!! DWC Jan 2012 #95

How would it level the playing field? pipoman Jan 2012 #127

That's just ambulance-chasing. The suit has no merit whatsoever. slackmaster Jan 2012 #4

Just shows how the system is ineffective... ellisonz Jan 2012 #24

What would you propose to prevent someone who isn't legally disqualified from buying a gun... slackmaster Jan 2012 #30

The Justice system already plays that role... ellisonz Jan 2012 #32

in most states gejohnston Jan 2012 #43

What wrong with it? We_Have_A_Problem Jan 2012 #87

Yes, it is called "due process," as in the 5th Amendment. SteveW Jan 2012 #100

Should we have to be interviewed to exercise other Constitutional rights? Atypical Liberal Jan 2012 #85

It almost sounds like you're proposing police interviews and psych evaluations for someone to own a Wistful Vista Jan 2012 #113

Was he adjudicated mentally ill? MicaelS Jan 2012 #5

Why didn't his family or doctor report it? Remmah2 Jan 2012 #16

I too, accurately diagnose people's mental health at a glance. AtheistCrusader Jan 2012 #6

Hey, what's the problem? Bill Frist diagnosed Terri Schiavo without ever even SEEING her! Wistful Vista Jan 2012 #115

I find the title somewhat inflammatory. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #7

"Might teach sellers of guns to be more responsible." Glassunion Jan 2012 #8

Well, ST has no problem diagnosing mental illness based on internet posts.. X_Digger Jan 2012 #9

Apparently it was pretty obvious with this guy Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #10

What if you were a legal seller? ileus Jan 2012 #11

I'm not following you? Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #12

And if you refused to sell a gun to someone legally qualified you could be sued for that. GreenStormCloud Jan 2012 #13

Jeez GSC, now peddler is a pejorative. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #21

Peddler Glassunion Jan 2012 #36

Hey, you are absolutely right. My mistake. Shopkeepers. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #37

A merchant has the right to refuse service to anyone at his discretion Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #27

You miss the point. PavePusher Jan 2012 #17

I don't think so. Glassunion Jan 2012 #20

My questionnaire would be a follow-up Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #22

Lol, what about other 'potentially dangerous, especially in the wrong hands' substances / items, eh? X_Digger Jan 2012 #28

Those things have already been prescribed by a doctor Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #40

But each item is 'potentially dangerous, especially in the wrong hands'- your criteria, not mine. X_Digger Jan 2012 #46

Are you being intentionally obtuse? Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #49

So the seller of the 'dangerous item' has no onus to perform an assessment, yes? X_Digger Jan 2012 #55

My mind is a work in progress Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #59

Perhaps you should wait until you've moved past the design stage.... We_Have_A_Problem Jan 2012 #88

Such a charmer aren't you WHAP? Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #90

Your ideas are not being thoughtlessy dismissed We_Have_A_Problem Jan 2012 #91

So I need a doctor's approval to exercise a right? jeepnstein Jan 2012 #96

"So I need a doctor's approval to exercise a right?" Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #97

So the 2nd Amendment isn't really the law of the land? jeepnstein Jan 2012 #130

I'm afraid that you are quite ignorant on the subject of psychology. Glassunion Jan 2012 #34

My knowledge or "ignorance" of psychology is irrelevant. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #38

Personally, I would force NICS compliance by the states. Glassunion Jan 2012 #92

Thanks for a constructive post. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #104

Loughner slipped through many cracks. Glassunion Jan 2012 #108

Regarding the MMPI test Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #111

Actually its pretty damned relevant. We_Have_A_Problem Jan 2012 #94

Actually I do. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #99

The law requires a form 4473 be filled out by the purchaser rl6214 Jan 2012 #29

Well, isn't that brilliant? Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #39

I asked a simple question, why the snark? rl6214 Jan 2012 #47

No snark intended. I'm pointing out the flaw in the system. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #52

If he lies on the form, the subsequent check will pick it up. Straw Man Jan 2012 #56

How about psychological screening by mental health professionals. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #58

Are you asking for a positive verification of mental health... Straw Man Jan 2012 #170

You bring up excellent points. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #171

One more question. Straw Man Jan 2012 #180

Who would pay for this evaluation? Would it be necessary for each purchase, or... Marengo Jan 2012 #82

It takes years of training in addition to medical school to qualify a person to identify a paranoid slackmaster Jan 2012 #31

This is not the responsibility of gun dealers. Atypical Liberal Jan 2012 #86

A complete circumvention of the 5th... SteveW Jan 2012 #101

How could they be more responsible within the laws? ObamaFTW2012 Jan 2012 #18

New laws/rules. Read my other posts. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #42

I didn't write the headline, hell I don't even read what I post The Straight Story Jan 2012 #19

I never suggested that you wrote the headline. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #23

The system as is undoubtedly invades our rights. She should have had a gun too... ellisonz Jan 2012 #25

More nonsense from you ProgressiveProfessor Jan 2012 #48

OK more nonsense from me Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #50

Fairly straight forward ProgressiveProfessor Jan 2012 #61

My CHL in Texas covers that. oneshooter Jan 2012 #62

What prevents a forgery from being used? ProgressiveProfessor Jan 2012 #63

Don't know. They are just like a Texas DL oneshooter Jan 2012 #65

Works for me ProgressiveProfessor Jan 2012 #69

"voting, free press, or assembly? They are on the same level" Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #67

Yes, they are. beevul Jan 2012 #68

Serious bad analogy... ProgressiveProfessor Jan 2012 #70

Oh sorry. My mistake again. Meant airline pilots. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #72

Actually you are still wrong there ProgressiveProfessor Jan 2012 #74

" My answer to the problem is to first enforce and standardize the laws we have" Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #134

The general answer to violations of the law is punishment ProgressiveProfessor Jan 2012 #137

"Brings a warm feeling to my heart." Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #144

More specious comments ProgressiveProfessor Jan 2012 #148

Hardly a capricious system, but rather a smart one. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #162

Using guns to shoot and kill people is not evil in and of itself. We_Have_A_Problem Jan 2012 #165

Of course they need to be able to defend themselves. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #166

Who the fuck are YOU to decide what the answer is? We_Have_A_Problem Jan 2012 #167

Did I ever suggest that it wasn't their call? Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #169

I have slight issue with the data presented Glassunion Jan 2012 #168

I always have slight issues with data too Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #173

"I wish them luck." Simo 1939_1940 Jan 2012 #150

And if you asked a lot of people back in the 50s and 60s.... We_Have_A_Problem Jan 2012 #154

I'm sure that mindset still exists in Texas and much of the south. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #157

WOW! We_Have_A_Problem Jan 2012 #158

Are you suggesting it doesn't still exist? Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #161

I think you missed the point We_Have_A_Problem Jan 2012 #163

I didn't miss a thing WHAP Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #174

Most every state that has concealed carry requires a license rl6214 Jan 2012 #129

What am I doing to get it done? Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #133

Your "common sense" is not the same as my common sense rl6214 Jan 2012 #191

Fortunately, I wasn't counting on you or any other individual Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #192

Ain't that the truth... rl6214 Jan 2012 #195

With a gun one might be able to kill a few dozen people. PavePusher Jan 2012 #84

Improve system by funding (if you can afford it) the bureaucracy to pass-on mental cases. SteveW Jan 2012 #102

Nonsense Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #106

BIG difference between.... We_Have_A_Problem Jan 2012 #109

Now you are being silly Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #119

"Poor people can't afford guns... Too busy putting food on the table and no valuables to protect" X_Digger Jan 2012 #120

How about their lives? Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #123

The poor are more likely to be in neighborhoods with high crime and little opportunity to leave.. X_Digger Jan 2012 #126

You need to chill, especially if you carry a gun. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #132

Your suggestions are specious and not possible under our current legal structure ProgressiveProfessor Jan 2012 #138

I expected better from you. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #142

I am clearly discussing gun onwership in a self defense and urban context ProgressiveProfessor Jan 2012 #146

Brilliant! Just fucking brilliant! Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #147

Empowering individuals is indeed quite progressive ProgressiveProfessor Jan 2012 #149

Sorry, but encouraging people to carry guns is not empowering them Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #185

sorry gejohnston Jan 2012 #187

Providing people with options and knowledge is indeed progressie ProgressiveProfessor Jan 2012 #194

And now you insinuate mental instability. Speaking of "engage in insults"... n/t PavePusher Jan 2012 #140

WTF are you insinuating? What mental instability? Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #141

Your words: "You need to chill, especially if you carry a gun." n/t PavePusher Jan 2012 #151

You equate anger with mental instability? Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #160

Hahahahah! It was you that made the insinuation.... PavePusher Jan 2012 #181

No my friend, you connected those little dots all on your own Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #184

You don't have the power to make me angry. X_Digger Jan 2012 #189

Very glad to hear that. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #190

"I guess poor is a relative term." -- fucking duh. X_Digger Jan 2012 #188

No, sir. SteveW Jan 2012 #117

What is more important to you? Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #145

You can try to be more respectful than "patsy for the NRA and extreme RW..." SteveW Jan 2012 #193

No. If you want it, you get to help pay for it. n/t PavePusher Jan 2012 #139

If and when I buy a gun I'll be happy to pay my share. Why not? Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #143

Nice dodge. PavePusher Jan 2012 #153

Your analogies get funnier by the day Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #159

Let's finance the Coast Guard by taxing boat and ship owners. Why not? friendly_iconoclast Jan 2012 #155

Boats and ships are taxed and do help fund the Coast Guard. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #156

Most of their funding comes via the DHS appropriation. friendly_iconoclast Jan 2012 #164

The USCG performs many functions, as does the fire department Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #172

Gun owners *already* pay the taxes you call for friendly_iconoclast Jan 2012 #177

"They help to fund" oneshooter Jan 2012 #175

Why? Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #176

Why not? A 10-11% excise tax on marine related items would be a start. friendly_iconoclast Jan 2012 #178

We have plenty of those taxes/fees and they are justified. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #179

You misunderstand, I have no problem with Pittman-Robertson taxes. friendly_iconoclast Jan 2012 #182

No assumption on my part. I had no idea. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #183

The Robertson was gejohnston Jan 2012 #186

2005 PLCAA will take care of that suit. N/T GreenStormCloud Jan 2012 #14

what a crock of shit rl6214 Jan 2012 #26

This whole thing is obviously the fault of the negligent seller and the manufacturer. TPaine7 Jan 2012 #33

So we now need a MSW to sell guns? BiggJawn Jan 2012 #35

Now why would a mentally ill person lie? Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #41

I dunno, let's ask my first ex-wife... BiggJawn Jan 2012 #44

So would you believe her if you were selling her a gun? Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #45

"She did a pretty good job of hiding it while we were married." rl6214 Jan 2012 #51

On our second martini are we? Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #53

No, I don't drink rl6214 Jan 2012 #54

Congrats on your marriage. Sorry about the Type 1 diabetes. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #60

I really think that it is unworkable. oneshooter Jan 2012 #64

It may be expensive. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #66

"I don't see how it could be illegal" ProgressiveProfessor Jan 2012 #71

Wrong again. The system needs to be fixed, if you want a system. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #73

The system needs to execute under the existing framework ProgressiveProfessor Jan 2012 #76

And what of purchasers of other potential lethal implements? Marengo Jan 2012 #83

You're not talking about fixing a system We_Have_A_Problem Jan 2012 #89

Maybe... discntnt_irny_srcsm Jan 2012 #93

Why? Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #107

Why not? We_Have_A_Problem Jan 2012 #110

Apples and oranges. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #112

How do you figure? We_Have_A_Problem Jan 2012 #114

Actually, a printer's ink / paper tax was already ruled unconstitutional.. X_Digger Jan 2012 #116

I know it was We_Have_A_Problem Jan 2012 #131

If you can be... discntnt_irny_srcsm Jan 2012 #121

No right would be denied anymore than at present. Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #122

True enough! discntnt_irny_srcsm Jan 2012 #124

I'm talking about firearms Starboard Tack Jan 2012 #135

Wait a minute. discntnt_irny_srcsm Jan 2012 #136

There's the key word: Mental Health PROFESSIONAL. BiggJawn Jan 2012 #81

That's what the phone call is for. Straw Man Jan 2012 #57

Do not confuse the bubba with facts and logic ProgressiveProfessor Jan 2012 #78

No need. Use the volunteer psychs right in this thread. nt SteveW Jan 2012 #103

family is even suing the rotary club sponsor who dropped off the victim at the club. aikoaiko Jan 2012 #75

More than just them ProgressiveProfessor Jan 2012 #77

Somewhere in there the right numbers for this lottery... ileus Jan 2012 #80

Sue! Sue! A Boy named Sue! The whole Sioux Nation! nt SteveW Jan 2012 #105

I see J. Randolph Pickett recovered from his injuries when that ambulance backed over him. Wistful Vista Jan 2012 #118

re: "...gun shop should have trained their people to recognize depression..." discntnt_irny_srcsm Jan 2012 #125

Plantiff is crazy. E6-B Jan 2012 #128

I predict treble damages awarded to the pawn shop. Tejas Jan 2012 #152