Gun Control & RKBA

Starboard Tack

(11,181 posts)

46. I'm not sure what exactly you think is absurd.

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 05:17 PM

Nov 2012

But, to answer your question "if a safe is "reckless", then what is reasonable?", I would say that a safe can be reasonable, when the safe itself is not easily transportable. There are many ways to accomplish that, probably the best being a secure installation, such as reinforced concrete on all sides except the door. A safe is only as secure as where you place it. If it can be wheeled in, it can be wheeled out, unless you build around it after wheeling it in. In general safes are designed to resist fire/heat. The more serious ones are designed to prevent entry, but if the safe itself is portable then all these qualities are irrelevant.

The safe itself is never reckless. People are reckless. Some are just dunn, I mean dumb. But I'll settle for careless if you prefer.

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Thieves break into Springfield home, steal 500-pound gun safe containing 15 weapons [View all] trouble.smith Nov 2012 OP

They should Berserker Nov 2012 #1

if they had no idea what was inside... ileus Nov 2012 #3

No, I'm thinking the theives knew exactly what they were getting Blue_Tires Nov 2012 #8

My gun safe weighs 1,200 pounds empty slackmaster Nov 2012 #2

The thing about bolting a gun safe to the floor is that trouble.smith Nov 2012 #5

It's not possible to stop a thief who is very determined and has time slackmaster Nov 2012 #6

unless they're the safe cracking variety of thieves trouble.smith Nov 2012 #7

Dogs are easy for a thief to get rid of. GreenStormCloud Nov 2012 #19

it's all part of the deterrent package trouble.smith Nov 2012 #54

A husband and wife team safeinOhio Nov 2012 #83

Locks and safes are only intended to keep honest people out. Remmah2 Nov 2012 #35

Mine are anchored to both the floor and the wall. oneshooter Nov 2012 #50

And yet this safe is far in excess of the CDOJ minimum like mine. Atypical Liberal Nov 2012 #4

Isn't this how most criminals acquire their guns? Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #9

What "level of accountability"? friendly_iconoclast Nov 2012 #10

That would depend on individual circumstances. Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #14

The guns were in a not-insubstantial safe. I see no negligence here. friendly_iconoclast Nov 2012 #16

I guess the exception sometimes proves the rule. Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #20

Circular logic, casual bigotry and assumption of facts not in evidence friendly_iconoclast Nov 2012 #72

To correct the analogy AlexSatan Nov 2012 #22

Possibly, if the owner intended to boobytrap the room. Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #24

Circular logic AlexSatan Nov 2012 #30

You are just never happy are you? Clames Nov 2012 #55

But if the dog is secured in your house and someone breaks in and gets all bit up by said dog trouble.smith Nov 2012 #37

Exactly AlexSatan Nov 2012 #40

I don't think you are getting it. Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #41

So by your logic, if somebody steals your car tonight are you responsable for the damage they do? Travis_0004 Nov 2012 #76

Bad analogy Glassunion Nov 2012 #97

OK, it wasn't the best analogy. Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #102

There should be. jeepnstein Nov 2012 #11

Silly jeepnstein, you're not blaming the victim! friendly_iconoclast Nov 2012 #12

Of course the thieves should be held accountable. Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #17

that isn't relevent in this case gejohnston Nov 2012 #18

The owner went above and beyond to properly store his firearms. jeepnstein Nov 2012 #59

If thinking is silly, then you're right. Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #62

Guns in safe = guns on porch? Straw Man Nov 2012 #77

Guns on porch? Sounds silly, but you said it, not me. Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #82

Yes I did. jeepnstein Nov 2012 #84

Nice conflation of 2 completely different things. Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #91

Right. Straw Man Nov 2012 #90

That's what extreme hypotheticals are - SILLY Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #92

A point? Straw Man Nov 2012 #93

And precisely WHAT " level of accountability" do you want? MicaelS Nov 2012 #13

Well yes the gun owner has damaged society. Glassunion Nov 2012 #15

I assume the same holds true AlexSatan Nov 2012 #23

You definitely need some analogy lessons. Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #28

Why does it matter what it is designed for? AlexSatan Nov 2012 #32

Enjoy your sojourn Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #33

Have you noticed that a lot of folks do that on here AlexSatan Nov 2012 #34

Cars and guns have a lot in common. Remmah2 Nov 2012 #36

Talk to AlexSatan. You guys have a lot in common. Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #39

What a load of crap. Clames Nov 2012 #58

Nope Glassunion Nov 2012 #38

I blame the thieves for stealing and the owner for reckless storage. Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #25

but that was not reckless storage, gejohnston Nov 2012 #29

Apparently, it was reckless Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #42

that's absurd, gejohnston Nov 2012 #44

I'm not sure what exactly you think is absurd. Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #46

it isn't easily moved gejohnston Nov 2012 #47

Sorry, but you are wrong. Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #48

seriously? gejohnston Nov 2012 #53

I already acknowledged careless rather than reckless. Both fall under stupid. Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #60

it isn't careless either. gejohnston Nov 2012 #63

Going beyond legal steps obviously wasn't enough. Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #67

how was he arrogant? gejohnston Nov 2012 #70

Understand the mindset- 'He's a gun owner, therefore he's wrong' friendly_iconoclast Nov 2012 #75

This message was self-deleted by its author Glassunion Nov 2012 #98

So what would be sufficient? Glassunion Nov 2012 #99

Not my job to keep your guns safe. Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #101

Remember their agenda is a ban on private citizens owning firearms. ileus Nov 2012 #66

I've moved things that have weighed >500 pounds. It ain't as easy as you make it out to be. friendly_iconoclast Nov 2012 #73

Banks accumulate lots of money, have security and get robbed, who's fault? Remmah2 Nov 2012 #85

and they accuse us of being the "nuts". What nerve. trouble.smith Nov 2012 #31

Who would "they" be? And who would "us" be? Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #45

the term "gun nut" is regularly used as broad brush smear attack against anyone who supports the 2A trouble.smith Nov 2012 #52

Apparently it was moved quite easily. Successful burglars tend to be stealthy. Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #65

I used to handle office furniture for a living rrneck Nov 2012 #68

Well, I disagree, but so what, they took it. Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #71

Lots of maybes, and I've seen 'em all. rrneck Nov 2012 #78

Out of a (probably) older house, to boot. friendly_iconoclast Nov 2012 #80

Yep. rrneck Nov 2012 #81

personally, I like a bigger safe but I think this gun owner did all that we could expect of him trouble.smith Nov 2012 #69

Of course. shadowrider Nov 2012 #49

You hit the nail on the head right there. trouble.smith Nov 2012 #57

"Shouldn't rights come with some level of accountability?" Remmah2 Nov 2012 #87

1A comes with accountability. They call it libel and slander. Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #89

How much does it cost to watch your tongue? trouble.smith Nov 2012 #94

Obviously more than Mr. Dunn was prepared to spend. Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #95

Is the violence in Mexico America's fault then-since we "walked" all those guns into Cartel hands? trouble.smith Nov 2012 #96

Depends how you assess fault. I don't ascribe blame for the actions of others. Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #100

unless they stored their guns in a measly little 500 lb safe which was then stolen? trouble.smith Nov 2012 #103

Check the local hospital emergency rooms for men with hernias, strained backs, etc. N/T GreenStormCloud Nov 2012 #21

There are other tools available besides guns. See post 25 Starboard Tack Nov 2012 #26

I doubt you've ever moved anything that large into or out of a house. friendly_iconoclast Nov 2012 #74

You seem to have intricate knowledge of stealing things. Remmah2 Nov 2012 #86

I helped a friend move and it took 5 of us and a piano dolly to move his gun safe. nt Speck Tater Nov 2012 #27

Inside job mikeysnot Nov 2012 #43

This is obviously done by "friends" or it's inside. MrSlayer Nov 2012 #51

that is not at all obvious though it is possible of course. trouble.smith Nov 2012 #56

My point is that it was someone that knew it was there. MrSlayer Nov 2012 #61

yeah, that much seems fairly obvious. trouble.smith Nov 2012 #64

Doesn't have to be an inside job gejohnston Nov 2012 #79

Look at the bright side, only 15 guns were stolen plus the safe. Remmah2 Nov 2012 #88