Religion

BillZBubb

(10,650 posts)

113. Look, I'm not going to go after you on this, but you are wrong.

Mon Oct 13, 2014, 11:03 PM

Oct 2014

If you make the claim that life does or has existed on other planets the total onus is on you to prove existence--it is not on me to prove non-existence. I am not saying life is unique to earth, what I am saying is that is all we can say for certain given the evidence on hand. Notice the difference?

We may find evidence later, but we don't have it now. So that line of reasoning falls short as supporting evidence.

As for your probability argument, it is entirely unpersuasive. We simply do not know, at this time, that even given the materials required for life what exact conditions and sequence of events is required for life to arise. There may be 10 to the 10th (just a random big number) planets with the basic materials for life, but the necessary sequence of events and conditions may only occur once every 10 to the 20th years. We simply don't know.

My guess is that life does pop up from time to time in other places. How common it is, I couldn't say. But that isn't based on any more than a hunch.

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Would Finding Alien Life Change Religious Philosophies? [View all] cbayer Oct 2014 OP

Any reasonably objective person knows there are "aliens" Cary Oct 2014 #1

The incomprehensible size of the universe virtually guarantees it. trotsky Oct 2014 #2

Yes, and more Cary Oct 2014 #11

Check out "The Fabric of Reality" bvf Oct 2014 #116

I agree that they are out there, but the question cbayer Oct 2014 #3

If we survive as a species an encounter is perhaps inevitable Cary Oct 2014 #12

Adaptations can be successful only for a certain environment. cbayer Oct 2014 #13

Except our adapatation of our intelligence altered our environment Cary Oct 2014 #14

I think all adaptations have the potential to alter the environment. cbayer Oct 2014 #15

There are many, many times more unsuccessful adaptations than there are successful ones Cary Oct 2014 #16

I'm not convinced that it is that simple. cbayer Oct 2014 #32

True, our intelligence is our only hope Cary Oct 2014 #34

Nobody knows their are aliens. edhopper Oct 2014 #17

There is no direct evidence Cary Oct 2014 #35

I think we would have to agree on a definition for evidence edhopper Oct 2014 #40

I'm not going to agree that circumstantial evidence isn't evidence Cary Oct 2014 #41

Yes Einstien had evidence edhopper Oct 2014 #42

Belief in aliens may be reasonable, but the belief is not objective. ZombieHorde Oct 2014 #29

The term is "reasonably objective" Cary Oct 2014 #36

However that requires an assertion that life on earth is unique in the universe. Warren Stupidity Oct 2014 #93

NONSENSE!!!!! You have totally wrong. BillZBubb Oct 2014 #105

again, the claim that life is unique to earth is the extraordinary claim. Warren Stupidity Oct 2014 #108

Give up while you're still not that far behind. rug Oct 2014 #111

Look, I'm not going to go after you on this, but you are wrong. BillZBubb Oct 2014 #113

In my opinion, the default position ZombieHorde Oct 2014 #114

Hahahaha, no. Religion is independent from fact. DetlefK Oct 2014 #4

That is an excellent question!! Peacetrain Oct 2014 #5

Have you ever been to the Very Large Array? cbayer Oct 2014 #6

Hey I had just signed off and was reading the entire article. Peacetrain Oct 2014 #9

If you read The Sparrow, let me know what you think. cbayer Oct 2014 #10

There's another story regarding first contact and a Jesuit Fumesucker Oct 2014 #117

Never heard of this. Will read it later. Thanks. cbayer Oct 2014 #118

Religion has adapted to lots of things. safeinOhio Oct 2014 #7

I would love to call the 700 club and get their take on this! cbayer Oct 2014 #8

It depends on whether the life was intelligent and conscious or not. rug Oct 2014 #18

Actually we have found water-bearing worlds in the 'goldilocks' zone in other star systems. AtheistCrusader Oct 2014 #19

The "goldilocks zone" refers to the distance from a star and atmospheric pressure. rug Oct 2014 #21

That's why I mentioned water-bearing. AtheistCrusader Oct 2014 #23

Yes, and there was a paper in 2010 that said complex life probably only evolved once in the universe Jim__ Oct 2014 #20

Very interesting paper. rug Oct 2014 #22

That fact that it did happen edhopper Oct 2014 #24

Do you have any evidence to back your claim? Or, is it purely based on faith? Jim__ Oct 2014 #25

It's all speculation edhopper Oct 2014 #26

I'd imagine a curious, technological, fast-spreading species would be even more rare. arcane1 Oct 2014 #31

Religion would adapt. bravenak Oct 2014 #27

Probably not. Feral Child Oct 2014 #28

Such a broad brush statement. cbayer Oct 2014 #33

You asked a question about "religious philosophies" Feral Child Oct 2014 #37

Just FTR - I didn't ask anything, only posted the article. cbayer Oct 2014 #39

You chose the article to post skepticscott Oct 2014 #45

I would... 3catwoman3 Oct 2014 #30

If God created the universe, well that would include everyone in it. TheNutcracker Oct 2014 #38

Doubt it. Scientific discoveries seem to have no impact. mmonk Oct 2014 #43

Scientific discoveries have not impact on religious beliefs? cbayer Oct 2014 #44

Please enlighten us as to how science skepticscott Oct 2014 #46

Philosophy disproved them. rug Oct 2014 #56

Because Christianity got seriously organised to suppress and terrorise its opponents muriel_volestrangler Oct 2014 #47

No disagreeing with that, but there were also scientific findings and explanations that cbayer Oct 2014 #48

Sometimes but generally no. mmonk Oct 2014 #49

I agree that people sometimes cling to religious explanations despite cbayer Oct 2014 #51

Almost every scientific finding has had no impact Curmudgeoness Oct 2014 #96

That is not the point though. cbayer Oct 2014 #97

I was only answering the last question in your post. Curmudgeoness Oct 2014 #98

I see your point and perhaps I worded it poorly. cbayer Oct 2014 #100

Some religions adapt to certain scientific findings, but grudgingly muriel_volestrangler Oct 2014 #50

I think creationism is a good example, but there are also large numbers of people cbayer Oct 2014 #52

The Bible claims its God throws lightning around too muriel_volestrangler Oct 2014 #54

Yes, but no one believes that literally. Do you? cbayer Oct 2014 #55

My answer was #50 muriel_volestrangler Oct 2014 #58

So while you see that some people still hang on to their cbayer Oct 2014 #60

The overall change is small (nt) muriel_volestrangler Oct 2014 #63

Baloney. cbayer Oct 2014 #65

How much has Christianity changed over 2000 years? Or Islam? muriel_volestrangler Oct 2014 #70

They've been changed a great deal by advances in knowledge. cbayer Oct 2014 #72

People could apply the standards of evidence they use for real life to religion muriel_volestrangler Oct 2014 #73

But they are very different things and can't be evaluated using the same methods. cbayer Oct 2014 #74

Exactly skepticscott Oct 2014 #79

Invisible gods do have a believability advantage. immoderate Oct 2014 #59

That's correct. cbayer Oct 2014 #61

As long as there will be "the gaps," there will be gods. immoderate Oct 2014 #64

And there will always be the gaps. cbayer Oct 2014 #66

Mutations, if significant are generally maladaptive. immoderate Oct 2014 #69

Mutations are what drives evolution. cbayer Oct 2014 #71

Yes I would like to see the reference that says that all natural variation results from mutation. immoderate Oct 2014 #76

Whoa, you really do need to take an introductory course. cbayer Oct 2014 #82

Darwin uses the word "mutation" about a half dozen times in "Origins." immoderate Oct 2014 #83

Serious, imm. I like you and I think you generally speak from cbayer Oct 2014 #86

I'm glad we cleared this up. immoderate Oct 2014 #90

Your english is much superior to my handle on any other language, cbayer Oct 2014 #92

Uhm. English is my native tongue, (depending on how you view Brooklyn...) immoderate Oct 2014 #99

Oh, I completely misunderstood what you said earlier. cbayer Oct 2014 #101

Shows to go ya! immoderate Oct 2014 #110

If you're going to be snarky and condescending skepticscott Oct 2014 #80

Yes, the god of the gaps. mmonk Oct 2014 #68

God of the gaps is not such a bad thing. cbayer Oct 2014 #75

"God did it" is not an explanation. It is a deflection, a lack of an explanation. immoderate Oct 2014 #77

It's as good an explanation as any when there is no other explanation available. cbayer Oct 2014 #81

Yes I do. It's called being honest. immoderate Oct 2014 #85

When there is no definitive answer, saying you believe something is not cbayer Oct 2014 #88

Well, there's bullshit... immoderate Oct 2014 #91

Indeed it does. okasha Oct 2014 #115

Many early scientists were Catholic mmonk Oct 2014 #84

I agree that church doctrine remains unchanged, at cbayer Oct 2014 #87

um, uh, just about everyone was catholic, unless they were protestant Warren Stupidity Oct 2014 #109

Yes, perhaps. trotsky Oct 2014 #89

other than being intellectually dishonest, not bad at all. Warren Stupidity Oct 2014 #104

I think science as well as society at large is reflected in religion. Sometimes ironically. pinto Oct 2014 #67

No, there weren't. That's utter nonsense skepticscott Oct 2014 #78

Which ones were those circa 200-1200 AD? Warren Stupidity Oct 2014 #95

No, it collapsed because it lost its usefulness to the state. rug Oct 2014 #57

And in any case, okasha Oct 2014 #62

WTF? the greek and roman gods are no longer believed in because science? Warren Stupidity Oct 2014 #94

I guess when you spend your days skepticscott Oct 2014 #103

No. Phlem Oct 2014 #53

Interestingly the Catholic Church has pondered this question. gordianot Oct 2014 #102

There would have to be some tweaking on interpreting religious dogma. BillZBubb Oct 2014 #106

The more interesting question is what if alien life came to us? BillZBubb Oct 2014 #107

IIRC from Hebrew school, many years ago... MannyGoldstein Oct 2014 #112