Religion

okasha

(11,573 posts)

170. It started off as a Jewish sect,

Sat Apr 4, 2015, 08:22 PM

Apr 2015

on the same footing as the Pharisees and Sadducees. Until the fall of Jerusalem in 70 CE, it was very much a part of the mainstream religion of its time and place.

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�Going Clear:� Scientology�s coverup efforts against the HBO documentary [View all] hrmjustin Mar 2015 OP

I want to see it... cbayer Mar 2015 #1

It was the most in dept documentary I ever saw on them. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #3

No one has dared to do this previously cbayer Mar 2015 #5

It shows the cowardice of the IRS, FBI, and prosecutors in this nation. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #6

Is this a cult? PassingFair Mar 2015 #53

From a picture? I can't make a judgement. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #54

What definition of cult are you using? cbayer Mar 2015 #55

I wasn't the one making the assertion, justin was. PassingFair Mar 2015 #62

As your wiki past shows, the word cult has had many iterations and cbayer Mar 2015 #64

Was I even talking to YOU? Justin said that Scientology was a cult, but not a religion. PassingFair Mar 2015 #65

No i am advocating that the abuses be investigated and prosecuted. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #66

Should this same standard be applied to all religions? PassingFair Mar 2015 #72

If there are allegations yes. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #74

Absolutely. The IRS has been flagrantly asleep at the wheel in terms of cbayer Mar 2015 #77

you are right Justin. samsingh Mar 2015 #95

Thanks. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #96

By your definition, the women you picture would be a cult. cbayer Mar 2015 #67

The women in the pic would probably still qualify. PassingFair Mar 2015 #70

Do you think the women would qualify for both definitions? cbayer Mar 2015 #75

Only by your private definition. okasha Apr 2015 #168

in cults members are not allowed to freely leave - either through force or shunning. samsingh Mar 2015 #84

So...Jehovah's Witnesses and groups like the Amish are cults? nt PassingFair Mar 2015 #97

POSSIBLY samsingh Mar 2015 #109

A group that makes people work for 40 cents an hour for movie starts, a group that NoJusticeNoPeace Apr 2015 #157

Who are they? Are we supposed to make such judgements based solely on appearance? stone space Mar 2015 #78

I looked them up, but I agree that just posting their picture and asking if they cbayer Mar 2015 #80

"Blue Cloister Cult" NYC_SKP Apr 2015 #167

i don't know. what do they believe in? samsingh Mar 2015 #83

Is that the knitting club? Starboard Tack Apr 2015 #172

Is there a predictable criteria by which one might reliably interpret whether hostile material about AtheistCrusader Mar 2015 #25

I posted about it in entertainment, I dont like to post in religion. NoJusticeNoPeace Mar 2015 #2

Boycotting his movies is a good idea. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #4

I'll watch a Tom Cruise movie the day he stands next to a female lead without standing on a crate. AtheistCrusader Mar 2015 #26

I'll watch "Eyes Wide Shut" bvf Mar 2015 #28

They got their non-profit designation through sheer bullying. cbayer Mar 2015 #7

And here's the straw man! Lordquinton Mar 2015 #99

The churches have already gained their status by applying as non-profits. cbayer Mar 2015 #101

Yes, they file as 501 as a religious orginization Lordquinton Mar 2015 #104

The only "religious exemption" is in their needing to regularly file, and cbayer Mar 2015 #107

Religious organizations are tax-exempt as charitable orgs under IRS 501(c)3 regulations. pinto Mar 2015 #103

Scientology is a religion like any other. bvf Mar 2015 #8

The fact that they regularly abuse their members physically and emotionally. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #9

Do you donate money to your church? bvf Mar 2015 #10

Yes. I have to pledge to be a voting member. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #11

I see. bvf Mar 2015 #13

Although to be fair there is an option not to give money if you can't afford to. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #14

Wonderful. bvf Mar 2015 #18

Of course. We do a lot of outreach to the neighborhood. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #19

Which obviously you would be unable to do bvf Mar 2015 #27

No. We have secular agencies that do great work here. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #29

Good. So I assume 100% of your donations bvf Mar 2015 #30

No. My donations to my church go to upkeep, salaries, outreach, and grants. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #31

Wouldn't it be a more efficient use bvf Mar 2015 #33

You are assuming I don't give money to them. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #34

I'm assuming no such thing, bvf Mar 2015 #36

your points are not clear to me. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #37

But you specifically mentioned bvf Mar 2015 #41

Ok. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #42

Does your parish vote on the annual budget, Justin? okasha Apr 2015 #169

Yes. the vestry approves the budget and it is published for all to see. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #173

Who do you donate money to? You don't have to answer that because ... cbayer Mar 2015 #38

Asking a question is rude? bvf Mar 2015 #39

Ok, so who do you donate your money to? I'd like to look into whatever organizations cbayer Mar 2015 #40

That's none of your business. bvf Mar 2015 #43

My apologies. It is indeed none of my business. cbayer Mar 2015 #46

All religions have pockets of "abuse"...it comes with POWER PassingFair Mar 2015 #56

It is not a religion in my view. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #57

It is in the minds of the adherents... PassingFair Mar 2015 #58

Not in my mind. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #61

Yes I understand that. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #90

Then why did you post this in the Religion group? bvf Mar 2015 #88

Because some do consider it a religion. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #91

We discuss cults and non-religious groups here all the time. cbayer Mar 2015 #92

Right here, because it's a religion. bvf Mar 2015 #93

Sure all of those could be posted here, unless someone alerted and the host said no. cbayer Mar 2015 #94

"Where you have power, you will find abuses. " cbayer Mar 2015 #59

Oops. Sorry, I thought I was posting in the Religious Group. PassingFair Mar 2015 #60

You were and the ability to discern the differences between cbayer Mar 2015 #63

"Funny to see a religious non-believer only noting when it happens in religious groups." Warren Stupidity Mar 2015 #98

Excuse me while I fight the impulse... gcomeau Apr 2015 #115

Go ahead. Why would you think that would bother me? hrmjustin Apr 2015 #117

Well, unless you also claim Catholicism isn't a religion... gcomeau Apr 2015 #118

I will apply any standard I want. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #119

Yes, clearly. And as inconsistently as you want too. -eom gcomeau Apr 2015 #122

Thank you for your permission. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #123

Oh it wasn't permission. gcomeau Apr 2015 #124

Nothing has been shown to me that this is nothing but a money making gimmick. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #125

Well I certainly won't be the one to do that... gcomeau Apr 2015 #126

There are certainly other gimmicks out there. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #127

You realize the Catholic Church is the single most valuable private entity on the planet right? AtheistCrusader Apr 2015 #129

There is no question that the finances of the ch6rch deserves more scrutiny. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #130

But my point was more around clarifying AtheistCrusader Apr 2015 #131

i think the RCC has problems but the religion itself is not a scam. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #133

Have you seen the movie? cbayer Mar 2015 #12

Wouldn't waste my time. bvf Mar 2015 #15

OK, I thought you had seen the movie and were basing your comments on that. cbayer Mar 2015 #20

No, I'm not. Don't have to. bvf Mar 2015 #24

I never understood angryvet Mar 2015 #16

I don't think they are allowed to check out non-approved news sources. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #17

They have tremendous expertise on identifying and preying on their targets. cbayer Mar 2015 #22

just another religion, no more idiotic or venal than the norm for the genre. nt. Warren Stupidity Mar 2015 #21

They don't beat me in my church or send me to a hole. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #23

yes well scientology doesn't have a rep for pederasty either Warren Stupidity Mar 2015 #32

I tend to think they are out of the norm and not a religion. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #35

yeah well how marvelously tolerant of you. Warren Stupidity Mar 2015 #44

Spare me Warren! Spare me your judgements! hrmjustin Mar 2015 #45

Cool. You just judged all the believers in scientology as not religious but you don't wish to be Warren Stupidity Mar 2015 #47

I have a problem with secretive and abusive belief sysems. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #48

Like the Vatican? Act_of_Reparation Mar 2015 #49

I have many issues with the vatican. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #50

So the RCC is also not a religion? Warren Stupidity Mar 2015 #51

No they are a religion. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #52

well that is quite magnanimous of you Warren Stupidity Mar 2015 #68

It was a gimmick by Hubbard. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #69

Christianity was a gimmick by Paul. Warren Stupidity Mar 2015 #71

Warren I use my common sense. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #73

So you should self delete your op and repost it in GD. Warren Stupidity Mar 2015 #76

You're funny. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #82

It was actually very funny, but, like the best of all humor AtheistCrusader Apr 2015 #132

use your imagination. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #134

Assume I don't have one. AtheistCrusader Apr 2015 #135

You have one. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #137

I do, but it has so far not led me to anything that seems to satisfy the question. AtheistCrusader Apr 2015 #139

restate your question. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #140

This begs the question Alittleliberal Mar 2015 #79

All a matter of opinion. there are cults in mainstream religions. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #85

"you know it when you see it." Act_of_Reparation Mar 2015 #87

No it doesn't surprise me. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #89

Then perhaps it is worth pointing out that "you know it when you see it"... Act_of_Reparation Mar 2015 #105

And I care why? hrmjustin Mar 2015 #106

Why should you care what learned people think of the subject at hand? Act_of_Reparation Mar 2015 #110

thats nice. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #111

Is religion itself a cult. AlbertCat Apr 2015 #112

When i say cult I mean in the negative tone. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #113

Cults have tones? AlbertCat Apr 2015 #114

Everyone has an o9inion. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #116

Everyone has an o9inion. AlbertCat Apr 2015 #120

I don't find criticism outrageous. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #121

It started off as a Jewish sect, okasha Apr 2015 #170

OMG! The outrage! cleanhippie Apr 2015 #136

Enjoy you holiday weekend Cleanhippie! hrmjustin Apr 2015 #138

Thanks, I will. I've que'd every zombie movie and show I can find on Netflix to watch. cleanhippie Apr 2015 #141

Church tonight, tomorrow, Saturday, and Sunday. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #142

That sounds like loads of fun. Do you participate in any zombie festivities? cleanhippie Apr 2015 #143

I going to your house to eat your brains. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #144

Careful now, that's powerful medicine. cleanhippie Apr 2015 #145

I will chew slowly. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #146

Is there any other way to eat brains but slowly? cleanhippie Apr 2015 #147

We will be turning Jesus into a cocktail. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #148

That's a twist; the living eating the dead. cleanhippie Apr 2015 #149

We don't believe he is dead. hrmjustin Apr 2015 #150

Well, zombies aren't really dead. cleanhippie Apr 2015 #151

Have a great Sunday! hrmjustin Apr 2015 #161

Enjoy! hrmjustin Apr 2015 #162

This message was self-deleted by its author okasha Apr 2015 #171

scientologies rebuttal is cruel, stupid and classic attempts at diversion from the truth samsingh Mar 2015 #81

What do you think the longer term effect might be? cbayer Mar 2015 #86

100'th post! LostOne4Ever Mar 2015 #100

lol. hrmjustin Mar 2015 #102

It's probably an omen. cbayer Mar 2015 #108

That's risky, though. stone space Apr 2015 #128

One more time for those not paying attention. TM99 Apr 2015 #152

I find the whole cult vs. religion debate to be pretty useless. cbayer Apr 2015 #153

But that's the thing. TM99 Apr 2015 #154

I think there actually is debate outside this group. cbayer Apr 2015 #155

I disagree. TM99 Apr 2015 #156

Isn't saying that Scientology meets some of the requirements of a Cult, as defined today... Humanist_Activist Apr 2015 #158

No, and here is why. TM99 Apr 2015 #159

Neil deGrasse Tyson: If you believe in the Christian story of Jesus, AlbertCat Apr 2015 #160

He's really making the case for people being able to believe whatever they want. cbayer Apr 2015 #163

Oh, come on. beam me up scottie Apr 2015 #165

I just watched the documentary. mnhtnbb Apr 2015 #164

I agree that many religious organizations, including scientology, need to be audited cbayer Apr 2015 #166