Religion

Yorktown

(2,884 posts)

58. I share your doubts

Wed Oct 28, 2015, 05:31 PM

Oct 2015

I am not a nationalist either, my allegiance is to basic values. And I'm an atheist.
And I personally dislike the quasi automatic childishness of the lyrics of anthems.

However I note the practical value of exercices in nation building like anthems.

- they help multiracial countries like India or Singapore build some feeling of commonality
- their absence leads to a feeling of split communities like in Europe

It might be childish, but it seems to help create harmony among the groups of the great apes we are.

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Highlight:

Australia: Fury as Muslim students allowed to walk out of assembly during national anthem [View all] Yorktown Oct 2015 OP

How you define religious beliefs as "whims" and "fancies" using Muslims as example, is so cute. Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #1

I did not make the title. Does it change the issue? Yorktown Oct 2015 #2

If by "shared secular values" you mean the national anthem at a school then....YES! Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #4

You assume wrongly, I do not have a great regard for Christianity either Yorktown Oct 2015 #7

Freedom of speech also includes the freedom to remain silent. Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #8

It is not speech Yorktown Oct 2015 #13

I get the confused emoticon response a lot....my work here is done. Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #14

. rug Oct 2015 #17

.. Yorktown Oct 2015 #20

... rug Oct 2015 #22

.... Yorktown Oct 2015 #24

..... rug Oct 2015 #25

...... Yorktown Oct 2015 #27

Your 'work' here is to sow confusion? Yorktown Oct 2015 #19

Oh goody, combatting religion with nationalism. rug Oct 2015 #3

LOL another rug-ian strawman Yorktown Oct 2015 #5

What is more interesting is how easily the right wing source you excerpted rug Oct 2015 #6

One in particular. Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #9

I have no 'bias against religions'. I have a bias against the religions that are harmful Yorktown Oct 2015 #10

"I have no 'bias against republicans. I have a bias against the republicans that are harmful" rug Oct 2015 #12

Yet another rug-ian deflection from the discussion into an ad hominem Yorktown Oct 2015 #18

I don't know how you feel about republicans at all. rug Oct 2015 #21

Then your comparison is totally off the mark Yorktown Oct 2015 #23

Ah, you consider Muslims and Christians to be worse than republicans. rug Oct 2015 #26

No. Islam and Christianity are worse than 'Republicanism' Yorktown Oct 2015 #28

My, who knew! The Democratic Party mst trn its sights on Muslims and Christians immediately! rug Oct 2015 #31

No. You are voluntarily wrong. Again. Yorktown Oct 2015 #33

Is the RNC platform worse than the Quran? rug Oct 2015 #34

Read both texts. The RNC platform does not call for stonings and beheadings. Yorktown Oct 2015 #36

So, you prefer the RNC platform to the Quran? rug Oct 2015 #37

Do you prefer the Quran to the RNC platform? Yorktown Oct 2015 #38

A lot of prattle but nowhere near an answer. rug Oct 2015 #39

No. I question your religion. You have no answers. Simple as that. Yorktown Oct 2015 #41

I question your xincerity. Particlarly when you spend five paragraphs avoiding an answer. rug Oct 2015 #45

Coming from you? Really? Yorktown Oct 2015 #48

And you still continue to provide no answer. rug Oct 2015 #62

That's pretty rich from someone who called my reasoning garbage Yorktown Oct 2015 #63

Tu quoque is a fallacy. Most often, a signal the discussion is over. rug Oct 2015 #64

Learn your Latin, it's not a "tu quoque". Yorktown Oct 2015 #65

. rug Oct 2015 #66

non sequitur Yorktown Oct 2015 #67

Ineptias. rug Oct 2015 #68

Garbage, inept, your choice of words about me could not be more civil.. Yorktown Oct 2015 #69

Your translation is awful. rug Oct 2015 #70

No, Sir. Yorktown Oct 2015 #71

"silliness, folly, absurdity". Yep. And you translated it as "inept"/ rug Oct 2015 #72

Garbage, absurd, your epithets about my reasoning could not be more civil Yorktown Oct 2015 #73

Do you prefer vinagrette or ranch with your salad? rug Oct 2015 #74

What is vinagrette? And when was Moses born? Yorktown Oct 2015 #75

Which ones are not "suspects"? Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #15

Benevolent and godless spiritualities can be Yorktown Oct 2015 #29

They are not required to sing. They could have simply stood silently. snagglepuss Oct 2015 #11

So you would recommend cancelling Christmas holidays, in this ideal secular state? Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #16

Why not? You have my vote on that. Yorktown Oct 2015 #30

Ummm, who gives a crap? gcomeau Oct 2015 #32

It's a simple matter of precedence Yorktown Oct 2015 #35

What??? gcomeau Oct 2015 #40

Well, school attendance is mandatory. Any problem with that? Yorktown Oct 2015 #42

Bullshit it is. gcomeau Oct 2015 #43

I do not see what core value you are trying to defend? Yorktown Oct 2015 #44

So do you think Jehovah's Witnesses and Atheists should be forced to recite the Pledge of... Humanist_Activist Oct 2015 #47

Tricky issue Yorktown Oct 2015 #49

I'm going to have to strongly disagree, mandatory pledges, anthems, whatever, they serve as... Humanist_Activist Oct 2015 #60

I think allowing people to take a day off for a religious holiday is acceptable, why be angry... Humanist_Activist Oct 2015 #46

Exceptions made on religious grounds are a slippery slope Yorktown Oct 2015 #50

You seem needlessly alarmist. There are such things as reasonable accomodations... Humanist_Activist Oct 2015 #59

I hope you are right and that I am an alarmist Yorktown Oct 2015 #61

We impose Sharia Law here in the US school system HassleCat Oct 2015 #51

I am all for rescinding any such 'rights' to Christian fundies Yorktown Oct 2015 #52

As an Australian citizen, I have absoluely no idea how I feel about it. There's so many points.. BlueJazz Oct 2015 #53

Granted, it a tricky question Yorktown Oct 2015 #54

Oh yes, I know what you're saying. I'm an Atheist but am hesitant to force just about anything on... BlueJazz Oct 2015 #55

But if I create the Holy Church of don't-tax-me? Yorktown Oct 2015 #56

You say you think the anthem should be mandatory. F4lconF16 Oct 2015 #57

I share your doubts Yorktown Oct 2015 #58

Diversity JonathanRackham Oct 2015 #76

Ironic you should mention the golden rule and a two-way respect about Islam Yorktown Oct 2015 #77

The Fundamentalist Fury of Nationalism. stone space Nov 2015 #78

Aw, did the nationalists get mad at the religionists again? Iggo Nov 2015 #79