Religion

cpwm17

(3,829 posts)

71. God is huge step away from an explanation for existence.

Thu Nov 12, 2015, 04:12 PM

Nov 2015

Last edited Fri Nov 13, 2015, 01:51 AM - Edit history (1)

God explains nothing. A god explanation is equivalent to claiming the unknown is explained by magic. Where would that get you?

God or no god, there is some level that just exists as a brute fact. Theists claim that brute fact is a god(s), the most complicated thing imaginable. And it can only be imagined since there is zero evidence of its existence.

Others may claim the brute fact is matter, energy, and some laws of nature. This is far simpler than any god, plus we know that matter, energy, and the laws do exist.

Since all of existence could very well be infinite, including possibly infinite worlds outside our Universe, a lot is going to happen in such a large reality. Asking why (as you are using the word) in this context is meaningless. All one can say is tons of shit happens, including evolution and us. The huge world out there has given us great odds of existing right now.

Edit history

Please sign in to view edit histories.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

114 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

Atheism not really a religion but a belief system, says creationist Ken Ham [View all] Warren Stupidity Nov 2015 OP

That's the great thing about atheism: No suspension of disbelief is necessary. DetlefK Nov 2015 #1

Someone's going out kicking and screaming... gelatinous cube Nov 2015 #12

At least he is honest about calling all the other religions false edhopper Nov 2015 #2

That guy is such a fucking doofus. Goblinmonger Nov 2015 #3

Of course, just like Evolution is a fairy story with no basis in reality, mr blur Nov 2015 #4

I wonder how our resident apologists feel about being in the same camp as Ham? cleanhippie Nov 2015 #5

I think they are speechless. Warren Stupidity Nov 2015 #6

Speechless, but always watching... trotsky Nov 2015 #8

That makes me so angry! mr blur Nov 2015 #9

LMAO!!! n/t trotsky Nov 2015 #10

I had understood YOUR view to be that only the ignorant thought "Atheism is a religion" struggle4progress Nov 2015 #7

In your world where up is down, your opinion makes sense. cleanhippie Nov 2015 #11

I was number 5 guillaumeb Nov 2015 #13

Juror 2 must have been using hermeneutics Warren Stupidity Nov 2015 #15

How many layers of meaning ARE there in the text? guillaumeb Nov 2015 #20

Thanks. I love how #2 loves the Google too! cleanhippie Nov 2015 #16

Some here are very quick on the alert button. guillaumeb Nov 2015 #21

I agree, but I didn't call anyone names. Some have sensibilities like delicate snowflakes... cleanhippie Nov 2015 #22

What a poetic metaphor! guillaumeb Nov 2015 #23

You misunderstand - Ham says atheism is a religion; Christianity Today got the headline wrong muriel_volestrangler Nov 2015 #18

Frankly, I can't make heads or tails of this. I have no use for Ham, but his statement that struggle4progress Nov 2015 #19

BEst line ever, and true randys1 Nov 2015 #76

I find Ken Ham touching Yorktown Nov 2015 #14

Cute. Dumb, but cute. AlbertCat Nov 2015 #17

Ham, "as impenetrable as marble"? Yorktown Nov 2015 #24

And believes every word and uses every word to generate hate and intolerance randys1 Nov 2015 #77

No, no, no, no, no... PatrickforO Nov 2015 #28

Ken -box jellyfish- Ham Yorktown Nov 2015 #33

Well, he's half right. Iggo Nov 2015 #25

Atheism and cosmology HassleCat Nov 2015 #26

Never thought about that. old guy Nov 2015 #29

And the ark was built by Halliburton HassleCat Nov 2015 #30

You don't know that either. Leontius Nov 2015 #35

Being that there is zero evidence for it, Goblinmonger Nov 2015 #36

Nope Leontius Nov 2015 #37

That's good. Goblinmonger Nov 2015 #39

Depends on your definition of "creationism"? Leontius Nov 2015 #41

wiki gives a pretty simple definition Yorktown Nov 2015 #42

Well, there are different myths about creation Goblinmonger Nov 2015 #43

Some folks have other ways of googling Lordquinton Nov 2015 #44

Hoped to see some evidence of really wanting to engage in a discussion and this is how you respond. Leontius Nov 2015 #45

OK. Fair enough. I'll own that. My apologies. Goblinmonger Nov 2015 #47

I believe that God created the Universe and has and still does interact with us. Leontius Nov 2015 #49

But the "why" is irrelevant, and presupposes the existence of a creator god... Humanist_Activist Nov 2015 #52

We disagree on the relevance of the "why" Leontius Nov 2015 #54

"It just happened" (or it just is) is the answer regardless if you believe in a god or not. cpwm17 Nov 2015 #59

God is hard so let's just ignore it as an a possible answer. Leontius Nov 2015 #60

What we have is no evidence for god and some mad 'holy' books Yorktown Nov 2015 #61

Do you believe that dark matter exists? Leontius Nov 2015 #62

We have evidence for 'dark matter' and 'dark energy' Yorktown Nov 2015 #63

No there is no evidence of either. Leontius Nov 2015 #64

You are either disingenuous or ill informed Yorktown Nov 2015 #66

Do you believe they exist? Leontius Nov 2015 #70

OK, done, you are willfully deaf to what I am telling you Yorktown Nov 2015 #73

Tell me again if you want it will not change the fact that dark matter is an unkown, unexplained Leontius Nov 2015 #78

The key word you try hard not to read is observable effect Yorktown Nov 2015 #82

I've seen your problem from the start . Leontius Nov 2015 #83

Someone's definitely holding their blankie tight here. trotsky Nov 2015 #85

Yes, the blanket of facts and empiracle evidence is one that should be held tightly. cleanhippie Nov 2015 #94

Tell yourself that Yorktown Nov 2015 #104

I have no problem that there is no generaly accepted scientific evidence or observation for God. Leontius Nov 2015 #105

Because you use weasely speech Yorktown Nov 2015 #106

Even your favorite wiki calls them 'unknowns'. Leontius Nov 2015 #109

No, the best way is skepticscott Nov 2015 #65

I disagree. God is the easy way out. Goblinmonger Nov 2015 #67

I agree with you that God can be used in that way by some people. Leontius Nov 2015 #69

God is huge step away from an explanation for existence. cpwm17 Nov 2015 #71

Which God are you talking about? cleanhippie Nov 2015 #72

you seem to have abandoned your interrogatory on the evidence for dark matter. Warren Stupidity Nov 2015 #74

At what point did you reach such a ridiculous conclusion? Leontius Nov 2015 #79

Do you think flying invisible space unicorns are an equally valid hypothesis? n/t Act_of_Reparation Nov 2015 #80

Right so nobody chomped down on your bait. Warren Stupidity Nov 2015 #81

It seems the only thing hard about the god concept you are describing Goblinmonger Nov 2015 #88

Other. Ways. Of. Knowing. mr blur Nov 2015 #95

I don't understand how you get that I am saying "well dark matter means there is a god" Leontius Nov 2015 #102

This message was self-deleted by its author cleanhippie Nov 2015 #107

Post #88 by Goblinmonger says exactly that Leontius Nov 2015 #108

Tell a lie then self delete the next day to avoid admitting you're lying and avoid apologizing. Leontius Nov 2015 #112

24 hours and still silence. cleanhippie Nov 2015 #96

But God has been disproved many times as a cause for things Lordquinton Nov 2015 #84

I guess that's true HassleCat Nov 2015 #38

Ken Hamm, is that you? cleanhippie Nov 2015 #40

There is evidence contrary to a Biblical creation, the Universe is... Humanist_Activist Nov 2015 #46

Contrary to a literal Biblical Creation, we both agree to that. Leontius Nov 2015 #48

If a god interacts with the universe in any way, its in a way that never... Humanist_Activist Nov 2015 #50

I'm not sure how you arrive and your definition that prevents God to interact. Leontius Nov 2015 #55

If that's the case, then why presuppose that a god exists in the first place? n/t Humanist_Activist Nov 2015 #56

Runs both ways though so the ground you stand on is no more or no less solid than where I stand. Leontius Nov 2015 #57

Not so, my position is to not make assumptions, I certainly don't claim that any deity... Humanist_Activist Nov 2015 #58

Ahh, the old 'you can't prove it doesn't exist' fallacy. cleanhippie Nov 2015 #68

Ah, the old "You can't prove it exists fallacy" stone space Nov 2015 #86

So do you just take aim at cleanhippie because you don't like him? Goblinmonger Nov 2015 #87

Sorry, but I don't talk gunspeak. stone space Nov 2015 #89

So metaphors are offensive? Goblinmonger Nov 2015 #90

Why do you keep calling yourself an unbeliever? Act_of_Reparation Nov 2015 #91

It's an obsessive-compulsive need, GM. cleanhippie Nov 2015 #97

It clearly has to be Goblinmonger Nov 2015 #98

Or in this case, words that mean nothing at all. cleanhippie Nov 2015 #99

Pointing and laughing real classy behavior for some one who claims to be an educator. Leontius Nov 2015 #103

I was talking about how a militant atheist Goblinmonger Nov 2015 #110

You seemed to me to imply that that was your whole attitude about what I've been saying. Leontius Nov 2015 #111

Not at all. It was a reaction to the person who continues to claim to be a militant atheist. Goblinmonger Nov 2015 #113

Ah, the old incoherent, unintelligible response. cleanhippie Nov 2015 #92

Jeez man, put your weapons down. trotsky Nov 2015 #101

So your claim is that your god interacts in this universe but that it does so Warren Stupidity Nov 2015 #75

I think he's using those 'other ways of knowing' again. cleanhippie Nov 2015 #93

Well that and his theory adds an additional Warren Stupidity Nov 2015 #100

Ken Ham is a pretty dangerous guy. PatrickforO Nov 2015 #27

That's a happy Australian accent. (nt) mr blur Nov 2015 #32

I'm glad he's not here any more... uriel1972 Nov 2015 #34

Ken, old buddy, I just believe in one less God than you do. nt Erich Bloodaxe BSN Nov 2015 #31

No, numbnuts, it's the absence of any belief system. Warpy Nov 2015 #51

>>> What Warpy said >>> Grey Nov 2015 #53

It's not a "belief system". It's called "science". Manifestor_of_Light Nov 2015 #114