Religion

Albertoo

(2,016 posts)

20. It is obvious you do not know Charlie Hebdo

Mon Oct 31, 2016, 11:34 PM

Oct 2016

Charlie Hebdo was created by members of the Flower Power generation: anti-war, anti-establishment, anti-racism, etc. And politically to the left of Sanders: Charlie Hebdo has always had a far left anti-capitalist stance.

So to say Charlie Hebdo was "not satire directed at the powerful" is a complete mistake.

Charlie Hebdo regularly spoke up against police racial profiling and steadfastly advocated for complete amnesty of all undocumented migrants in France.

So to call Charlie Hebdo racist is another complete mistake.

Now, as part of the French Left cultural heritage, Charlie Hebdo has always been anticlerical, building on the long tradition of blaspheming against the Roman Catholic Church. When Islam became visible and militant around the 90's, Charlie Hebdo extended its anticlericalism to Islam.

Anticlericalism is not racism, and Islam is not a race, it's a superstition like other religions.

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'Islam no longer religion of peace' Muslim Charlie Hebdo journalist hits out at extremists [View all] trotsky Oct 2016 OP

Very brave lady. patsimp Oct 2016 #1

The cartoonists of Charlie Hebdo practiced their own brand of racism and hate. guillaumeb Oct 2016 #2

Did anyone deserve to be killed for those cartoons? n/t trotsky Oct 2016 #3

Did anyone suggest that, besides you? rug Oct 2016 #5

Of course not. guillaumeb Oct 2016 #7

What does it prove about violent Islamists? trotsky Oct 2016 #9

What was said? guillaumeb Oct 2016 #10

You do realize it's not just one person, right? trotsky Oct 2016 #13

Your agenda is again showing. guillaumeb Oct 2016 #15

I hope he posts a quote without the author. rug Oct 2016 #16

My bet is Sam Harris. The tone is too moderate for Geller's type of hate. eom guillaumeb Oct 2016 #18

Again? Half the world's Muslims support death sentences for imaginary crimes Albertoo Oct 2016 #21

If the mere existence of the death penalty proves a predisposition for violence, guillaumeb Nov 2016 #36

Again, that same old confusion? A poor diversion from the quantification of Islam's violence Albertoo Nov 2016 #46

Atheistic countries... Russia... Lordquinton Nov 2016 #90

Yes, I had noted that Albertoo Nov 2016 #96

My evidence is the large number of people - Muslims, ex-Muslims, non-Muslims who report so. trotsky Nov 2016 #23

More innuendo? guillaumeb Nov 2016 #37

Would you care to actually discuss the issue... trotsky Nov 2016 #40

Your invitation to ride the endless carousel of accusation and selective verse mining guillaumeb Nov 2016 #41

"Selective verse mining" is what all believers - including yourself - do. trotsky Nov 2016 #49

Absolutely never not ever Dorian Gray Nov 2016 #22

What I object to is the immediate response whenever the Charlie Hebdo murders are mentioned... trotsky Nov 2016 #24

And who said this, that you might object to it? guillaumeb Nov 2016 #42

You did, in your very first post on this thread. trotsky Nov 2016 #50

What you said in post 24: guillaumeb Nov 2016 #67

Why did you immediately bring up that people were offended by the cartoons? Goblinmonger Nov 2016 #68

Refer back to # 50, read the entire thread, guillaumeb Nov 2016 #70

I fully understand what trotsky was saying before he spelled it out to you step by step Goblinmonger Nov 2016 #71

My response was: guillaumeb Nov 2016 #72

But I didn't say that it was your position. trotsky Nov 2016 #69

You're absolutely right.... Dorian Gray Nov 2016 #45

It is obvious you do not know Charlie Hebdo Albertoo Oct 2016 #20

I have read Charlie Hebdo many times. Not in translation. guillaumeb Nov 2016 #38

The fact you do not understand gallows humor does not prove anything about Charlie Hebdo Albertoo Nov 2016 #47

A "cultural imperialist" and a "north American campus PC lens" person? guillaumeb Nov 2016 #66

your answer #66 is a strange salad Albertoo Nov 2016 #92

"Je suis malade" is a well known song. guillaumeb Nov 2016 #101

I know the song, doesn't relate to our discussion Albertoo Nov 2016 #103

There is nothing neutral about your characterization of Muslims. guillaumeb Nov 2016 #104

My view is parfectly neutral, yours is not Albertoo Nov 2016 #105

Your view is filtered through the lens of your own beliefs. guillaumeb Nov 2016 #112

I try to believe as few things as possible, I'm an empiricist Albertoo Nov 2016 #123

A fan of empire? guillaumeb Nov 2016 #124

There are considerable examples of continental french being unable to understand canadian french AtheistCrusader Nov 2016 #116

I sometimes have problems with "Southern" pronounciation. guillaumeb Nov 2016 #118

I don't speak any flavor of french. AtheistCrusader Nov 2016 #120

I had no idea about the Clinton incidents. Interesting and ironic. guillaumeb Nov 2016 #121

Seems like it's in their job description... AtheistCrusader Nov 2016 #122

Albertoo did refer to this, but you don't seem to have picked it up muriel_volestrangler Nov 2016 #107

Thank you for the link. A very interesting article. guillaumeb Nov 2016 #114

But it was using a specific story from that month about Boko Haram holding girls/women muriel_volestrangler Nov 2016 #125

Nice points, and I agree that your first point about this one specific cartoon is correct. guillaumeb Nov 2016 #126

You do know that those cartoons were satirizing the racism of France, right? Goblinmonger Nov 2016 #30

Facts have no place on this topic, GM. You and I both know that by now. trotsky Nov 2016 #31

So using the images and memes of the far right is attacking the right? guillaumeb Nov 2016 #39

"Try explaining that to the rightists who love CH"??? Albertoo Nov 2016 #48

If we ask the people whose lives were affected by terrorism, trotsky Nov 2016 #51

There were RW idiots that loved them some Archie Bunker, too. Goblinmonger Nov 2016 #54

Like this? rug Nov 2016 #43

Both of those are rough, for sure Goblinmonger Nov 2016 #55

"Rough"? A rather subtued adjective for rank anti-semitism. rug Nov 2016 #56

I presume it's the top one you're talking about, then muriel_volestrangler Nov 2016 #57

And a damn good parody it is. Couldn't even tell the difference. rug Nov 2016 #59

But it wasn't drawn by a CH artist, or published by them muriel_volestrangler Nov 2016 #61

No, it isn't. But there are dozens that were. rug Nov 2016 #62

So you tried to hijack the thread by posting something not from CH? muriel_volestrangler Nov 2016 #63

Oh, get off your high horse, muriel. rug Nov 2016 #74

"hijack this story when it appeared over the weekend"? This is the first thread about it muriel_volestrangler Nov 2016 #78

Oh, have you forgotten already, muriel? rug Nov 2016 #83

That's a story about the SPLC and Maajid Nawaz. muriel_volestrangler Nov 2016 #84

I have a question for people of faith... Fix The Stupid Nov 2016 #73

Why don't you point out where that happened. rug Nov 2016 #75

And the 'Google gish' was to explain to you, and anyone else, who the artist was muriel_volestrangler Nov 2016 #64

Charlie Hebdo is still an anti-semitic rag. rug Nov 2016 #76

Your posts are just name calling. You can't ever admit when you're wrong. muriel_volestrangler Nov 2016 #79

That is one of the more ludicrous things you've typed in here. rug Nov 2016 #81

Oooh, are you going to change your post Goblinmonger Nov 2016 #58

Change it of course. There are so many others to pick from. rug Nov 2016 #60

Are you familiar with the movie the first one is referring to? Goblinmonger Nov 2016 #65

Except the movie has no anti-semitic references. rug Nov 2016 #77

Yeah, but it does deal with classism Goblinmonger Nov 2016 #82

It's a play on words. The cartoonist is saying religions claim they are 'untouchable' muriel_volestrangler Nov 2016 #89

That must explain the large noses and hitleresque caricatures. rug Nov 2016 #95

Large noses are a typical feature of cartoons muriel_volestrangler Nov 2016 #98

In certain quarters. rug Nov 2016 #99

So, utterly different styles, then muriel_volestrangler Nov 2016 #100

Oh, yes, utterly different. rug Nov 2016 #102

I don't think religion is above mocking, or should get special protection muriel_volestrangler Nov 2016 #106

Who does? rug Nov 2016 #108

Again, the black woman is saying she is being treated like a slave muriel_volestrangler Nov 2016 #109

Ah, the same Gallican humor that reveres Jerry Lewis. rug Nov 2016 #110

That one is racist, yes muriel_volestrangler Nov 2016 #111

NYC_SKP is that you? AtheistCrusader Nov 2016 #113

I do not understand your reference. eom guillaumeb Nov 2016 #115

First person I noticed that liked to attack Hebdo with bullshit claims of racism AtheistCrusader Nov 2016 #117

Thank you. I understand your reference. guillaumeb Nov 2016 #119

I always thought it was a stupid way to describe it exboyfil Oct 2016 #4

Seriously? Silly logic - and a divisive & inflammatory OP. jonno99 Oct 2016 #6

You'll have to direct your comments at the journalist who wrote it. trotsky Oct 2016 #8

It's truly great to see you being so open-minded. jonno99 Oct 2016 #11

So, no answer, but instead a personal attack. trotsky Oct 2016 #14

I join you in this praise. Tolerance is always to be encouraged. eom guillaumeb Oct 2016 #19

Then you're saying she's writing from a position of her grief and victimhood. procon Nov 2016 #87

�ISIL is not Islamic." - Barack Obama mwrguy Oct 2016 #12

Uh-oh...our President is about to get a lesson on internet memes. stone space Oct 2016 #17

Not really. trotsky Nov 2016 #25

Post removed Post removed Nov 2016 #32

That's it. trotsky Nov 2016 #33

You are upset because I disagree with ISIS? Seriously? stone space Nov 2016 #34

Say hi to mr blur. rug Nov 2016 #44

President Obama is right and ISIS is wrong. stone space Nov 2016 #35

Local fallacy of hasty generalization no_hypocrisy Nov 2016 #26

And you've just committed a straw man fallacy. trotsky Nov 2016 #27

Damn, point taken. no_hypocrisy Nov 2016 #28

It's why this topic is so hard to discuss, yet so important. trotsky Nov 2016 #29

Pick a religion, henny religion - in the name of religion asiliveandbreathe Nov 2016 #80

On a run with the anti-Muslim threads today, yeah? nt procon Nov 2016 #85

Post removed Post removed Nov 2016 #86

You keep using that phrase. Are you going to delete this thread too? nt procon Nov 2016 #88

There is no such thing as a religion of peace Lordquinton Nov 2016 #93

I have no sympathy with far-right murderous nutcases of any religion... LeftishBrit Nov 2016 #124

There is no religion of peace. Iggo Nov 2016 #125

Dec 1969 #