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Taverner

(55,476 posts)
Tue May 1, 2012, 01:19 PM May 2012

League of Militant Atheists - A Favorite Strawman of Many [View all]



In many arguments here, theists cite the League of Militant Atheists as proof that it the Soviet Union was a revolution FOR Atheism.

Let's do a little reading now:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/League_of_Militant_Atheists

The League of Militant Atheists (also Union of Belligerent Atheists (Russian: Союз воинствующих безбожников ; Society of the Godless (Общество безбожников ; Union of the Godless (Союз безбожников ), was an antireligious organization of workers and others that developed in Soviet Russia under the influence of the ideological and cultural views and policies of the Communist Party in 1925–1947. It "consisted of Party members, members of the Komsomol youth movement, workers and army veterans".

The League embraced workers, peasants, students, and intelligentsia. It had its first affiliates at factories, plants, collective farms (kolkhoz), and educational institutions. By the beginning of 1941, it had about 3.5 million members of 100 nationalities. It had about 96,000 offices across the country. Guided by Bolshevik principles of antireligious propaganda and party's orders with regards to religion, the League aimed at exterminating religion in all its manifestations and forming an anti-religious scientific mindset among the workers. It propagated atheism and scientific achievements, conducted 'individual work' (a method of sending atheist tutors to meet with individual believers to convince them of atheism, which could be followed up with public harassment if they failed to comply) with religious people, prepared propagandists and atheistic campaigners, published anti-religious scientific literature and periodicals, organized museums and exhibitions, conducted scientific research in the field of atheism and critics of religion. The League's slogan was "Struggle against religion is a struggle for socialism", which was meant to tie in their atheist views with economy, politics, and culture. One of the slogans adopted at the 2nd congress was "Struggle against religion is a struggle for the five year plan!" The League had international connections; it was part of the International of Proletarian Freethinkers and later of the Worldwide Freethinkers Union.


Whew!

OK - so the group was not some paramilitary organization as some here have claimed.

As per 'persecution of Christians,' their persecution amounts to:

- Going to churches and obnoxiously debating with believers

- Working (albeit unsucessfully) to purge the USSR of all belief in God

- Trying to convert Theists to Atheists in the military, at the workplace, in schools, etc.


Now under Stalin there was real persecution of the religious, but under Stalin EVERYONE was persecuted, from high ranking party members, to ditch diggers, to people wearing glasses. If you did not like somebody on your block, you placed an anonymous tip to the NKVD and nobody every saw them again.

The one time they did try to remove religion from the USSR, Operation North - where they forcibly moved Jehovas Witnesses and practitioners of non-Orthodox religions to Siberia. Were they sent to labor camps? Were they stripped of their possessions? No and no.

The idea was to just get them out of their hair. Similar to the British Exile of the Anabaptists to the 13 colonies, except it was, well, fucking Siberia.
'
So all the lies Christians state about being killed for believing in God - all of it made up.

In Stalinist times you were killed for not being Stalin or Beria.

Let me follow up with what eventually became of the League of Militant Atheists:

The climate of the campaign against religion was changing in the late 1930s and early 1940s. The regime slowly became more moderate in its approach to religion. Yaroslavsky, in 1941 warned against condemning all religious believers, but said that there were many loyal Soviet citizens still possessing religious beliefs. He called for patient and tactful individual work without offending the believers, but "re-educating" them. He claimed that religion had disappeared in some parts of the country but in other parts (especially in the newly annexed territories) it was strong, and he warned against starting brutal offensives in those areas.

He alleged that there were very few attempts to re-open churches and that this was a sign of the decline in religion. He branded those who tried to re-open churches as "former kulaks" and "falsifiers of figures". This report was contradicted, however, by the LMG's own figures (based on the 1937 census) that found perhaps half the country still held religious beliefs, even if they had no structures to worship in any longer and they could no longer openly express their beliefs.[30]

An answer to this report was found when Nazi Germany invaded in 1941, and churches were re-opened under the German occupation, while believers flocked to them in the millions. In order to gain support for the war effort (both domestic and foreign; the allies would not support Stalin if he continued the campaign ) against the German forces that were effectively "liberating" religious believers from the persecution against them, Stalin ended the antireligious persecution and the LMG was disbanded. All LMG periodicals ceased to publish by September 1941. Its official disbandment date is unknown, but traced somewhere between 1941–1947.

Yaroslavsky turned his attention to other pursuits and in 1942, he published an article on Orthodox writer Dostoevsky, for his alleged hatred of the Germans.



So much for persecution of Christians, huh?

If only Atheists had it this good in the dark ages....you know, when the CHURCH ran things...
78 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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This is just awesome Goblinmonger May 2012 #1
Are you serious? rug May 2012 #2
That's what we Atheists go through EVERY FUCKING DAY Taverner May 2012 #3
I don't think Uncle Joe is after you. rug May 2012 #4
Uncle Joe is dead Taverner May 2012 #5
Good thing we live here and now. rug May 2012 #6
Good thing we live. Period. Taverner May 2012 #10
Antireligious propaganda combined with state power has all the charm of the Inquisition. AlbertCat May 2012 #66
If you are going to tell the story then tell the whole story. humblebum May 2012 #7
Terror tactics? Taverner May 2012 #8
Those were not my words. You are dealing in partial truths to obscure facts.nt humblebum May 2012 #12
Nope. Pospielovsky could NEVER be biased.... Taverner May 2012 #9
You're sourcing wiki and accusing him of bias? LOL humblebum May 2012 #11
He is a noted historian of the Russian Orthodox Church Taverner May 2012 #13
Doubt very seriously if his approach is biased if he utilizes as many sources humblebum May 2012 #16
I could show how the Israelites were really Brits using "many sources" Taverner May 2012 #17
Which proves absolutely nothing. As a matter of fact, humblebum May 2012 #18
Because atheism is the logical scientific conclusion Taverner May 2012 #19
If your mind and method of inquiry are limited to empiricism, then yours humblebum May 2012 #20
Ah, those other ways of knowing again. darkstar3 May 2012 #21
You just can't handle those whose thinking is broader than yours, can you? nt humblebum May 2012 #23
One may be open-minded without being required to accept that darkstar3 May 2012 #24
That's what I thought. nt humblebum May 2012 #26
Oh, I'm sure it is, humblebum. eqfan592 May 2012 #28
This message was self-deleted by its author Iggo May 2012 #34
Right Click. Save Image. Iggo May 2012 #35
those whose thinking is broader AlbertCat May 2012 #67
Other ways of knowing are useless, and have no verification process Taverner May 2012 #36
This is the whole lesson of all that history. The church was in bed with the Czar for centuries. dimbear May 2012 #33
I would say the same to you. Act_of_Reparation May 2012 #27
Nice spin, but it involved much more than just Stalin (or Marx). And humblebum May 2012 #29
No, he's spot on. It's a composition fallacy... Joseph8th May 2012 #31
Actually there are some strong philosophical links between organized atheism humblebum May 2012 #32
So we edhopper May 2012 #37
Who has put Stalin around the necks of all atheists? humblebum May 2012 #40
Well then, even if we accept your wacky-ass premise, you have ONE mass killing, and no war. darkstar3 May 2012 #45
No different than your "wacky-ass" denial. I suppose if you consider the Revolutions and civil wars humblebum May 2012 #46
Sure... darkstar3 May 2012 #49
most wars or mass killings were in fact not carried out in the name of religion, AlbertCat May 2012 #68
You can't just state lies as facts... Joseph8th May 2012 #39
You said that "Soviet atheism has had NO Influence on me." Really? humblebum May 2012 #41
Watch that drift... darkstar3 May 2012 #43
Where did I mention "coincidence?" nt humblebum May 2012 #48
That you can't see it makes it even funnier. darkstar3 May 2012 #50
Why then did you use quotation marks? humblebum May 2012 #52
When you use words you've seen others use, you should look them up first. darkstar3 May 2012 #54
Far too obvious to be coincidence. Too many direct connections. nt humblebum May 2012 #58
Which you cannot document, and you cannot refute #39. Tough shit. darkstar3 May 2012 #60
"Which you cannot document?" If you say so, but definitely rises to much more than mere coincidence. humblebum May 2012 #63
Too many direct connections. AlbertCat May 2012 #69
How are "quotation marks" words? nt humblebum May 2012 #62
This message was self-deleted by its author humblebum May 2012 #56
No! None of the above... so I guess that means... Joseph8th May 2012 #64
Then I will repeat what I said. humblebum May 2012 #65
The similarities are undeniable. AlbertCat May 2012 #70
Which makes absolutely no sense. nt humblebum May 2012 #71
Which makes absolutely no sense. AlbertCat May 2012 #72
So you really think that there are no similarities humblebum May 2012 #73
About as many similarities as there are between The World Church of the Creator and the NAACP. eqfan592 May 2012 #74
So you really think that there are no similarities AlbertCat May 2012 #75
Yes. You say that one group of atheists has absolutely nothing in common humblebum May 2012 #76
Maybe you ARE that dense! AlbertCat May 2012 #77
Yes of course. Sorta like how an apple and a cucumber are similar but not even remotely the same, humblebum May 2012 #78
You yourself said that you thought atheists were a subset of Marxist-Leninist communists. eqfan592 May 2012 #38
No I did not. I specified "Marxist-Leninist communists in the USSR." Not all humblebum May 2012 #42
Those last five words? You might want to explain them to your one-man cheer squad. darkstar3 May 2012 #44
"Communism was not required. Becoming an atheist was." Yep. and I'll stand by that. nt humblebum May 2012 #47
So you contradict yourself and care not? darkstar3 May 2012 #51
And where is there contradiction? Facts are facts. nt humblebum May 2012 #53
Seriously? You want me to fucking spoonfeed it to you? darkstar3 May 2012 #55
"Not all communists are atheists" Yep. "Becoming an atheist was {required}" Yep. humblebum May 2012 #57
You contradict yourself and care not. Gotcha. darkstar3 May 2012 #59
You have failed to show any evidence of contradiction. nt humblebum May 2012 #61
Is this Alan Moore's next graphic novel edhopper May 2012 #14
If he writes it, I'll read it. Goblinmonger May 2012 #15
Facts don't stop people from enjoying the usage of fallacy. darkstar3 May 2012 #22
Amen! Taverner May 2012 #25
To revive this mighty argument! Taverner May 2012 #30
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