Religion

Bretton Garcia

(970 posts)

30. Barron argues as I do that Christianity DOES make empirical claims

Sun Apr 16, 2017, 11:18 AM

Apr 2017

Or as he says, it often claimed to make true statements about physical, historical facts.

And if so, I add? Then we might be able to go back to find physical evidence in history, and so forth. To see if it was true or not.

Edit history

Please sign in to view edit histories.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

141 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

'The Case for Christ' and a stubbornly historical religion [View all] rug Apr 2017 OP

Is the virgin birth in the same category? greymattermom Apr 2017 #1

In the Catholic and Orthodox traditions, and some other Christian groups. rug Apr 2017 #4

Happily embraces reason Cartoonist Apr 2017 #2

I really doubt you're laughing. rug Apr 2017 #5

It made my day Cartoonist Apr 2017 #27

Your confusion between Ken Ham and Robert Barron explains your confusion about religion. rug Apr 2017 #36

Confusion? Cartoonist Apr 2017 #61

con�fu�sion rug Apr 2017 #62

In what way? Cartoonist Apr 2017 #64

What is in your head does not always translate to reality. rug Apr 2017 #65

He is risen Cartoonist Apr 2017 #68

Define the proof you say he is needed. rug Apr 2017 #69

Not that line of BS again. Cartoonist Apr 2017 #71

And you never answer it. rug Apr 2017 #72

Biblical scholarship Cartoonist Apr 2017 #73

The ultimate closed, prejudiced mind. rug Apr 2017 #74

Open it then Cartoonist Apr 2017 #75

I'm not your rabbi. rug Apr 2017 #82

The hate manual Cartoonist Apr 2017 #85

It'c clearly a manual you hate. rug Apr 2017 #94

Jesus tells us to "hate" our family, quote. Bretton Garcia Apr 2017 #103

If I had a talking snake like the one in the Bible.... Vinnie From Indy Apr 2017 #3

You'd also be as far from the topic as Uranus. rug Apr 2017 #6

I've read three of Strobel's books Orrex Apr 2017 #7

His book doesn't convince me either but he frames the question squarely. rug Apr 2017 #8

I agree that he frames the questions reasonably well Orrex Apr 2017 #9

Your second paragraph is illogical. rug Apr 2017 #10

"Nothing about religious belief can be stated with certainty." Orrex Apr 2017 #11

Incorrect. rug Apr 2017 #14

No, that's not the first thing to know about religious belief Orrex Apr 2017 #18

"believers"? Are you standing by that broad brush statement? rug Apr 2017 #38

"Religious beliefs can easliy be supported by logic after the datum is stated." Orrex Apr 2017 #43

You haven't answered my question about your broad brush. rug Apr 2017 #45

So your insults are ok, but mine are intolerable? Got it. Orrex Apr 2017 #50

By all means, "proactively witness". rug Apr 2017 #54

But here's the thing: Orrex Apr 2017 #55

I invited comment and debate, niot tired, repetitive antitheist slurs (like thatbetter than meme?) rug Apr 2017 #57

But your debates are tired from the outset Orrex Apr 2017 #66

Not nearly as tired as this: rug Apr 2017 #70

Rug, why do you do this? potone Apr 2017 #77

Thanks for yor concern, potone. rug Apr 2017 #81

Broad-brush Orrex Apr 2017 #120

Oh, I very clearly see where you two diverge. rug Apr 2017 #122

Similarly, I see where you diverge from people who can formulate an argument Orrex Apr 2017 #124

See, here's the thing Orrex Apr 2017 #121

For one who hates prosetylites you you give a fair mimicry. rug Apr 2017 #123

Where have I preached the good news about atheism? Orrex Apr 2017 #125

QED. rug Apr 2017 #126

LOL Orrex Apr 2017 #136

It's clear you don't realize you just demonstrated the point. rug Apr 2017 #137

Yes, some religionists are very fond of that tactic Orrex Apr 2017 #138

LOL rug Apr 2017 #139

QED Orrex Apr 2017 #140

EOD rug Apr 2017 #141

Barron argues as I do that Christianity DOES make empirical claims Bretton Garcia Apr 2017 #30

Actually, he states that classic Christianity is based on fact, not empiricism. rug Apr 2017 #39

Religion twists words around dishonestly, Peter warned Bretton Garcia Apr 2017 #46

Are you quoting an Epistle in support of your argument? rug Apr 2017 #49

Yes. I believe the Bible warns about itself. Bretton Garcia Apr 2017 #53

"Nothing about religious belief can be stated with certainty." AtheistCrusader Apr 2017 #118

Here is a take on Strobel's view of the resurrection, by Brent Landau still_one Apr 2017 #101

That, ultimately, is true. For both sides. rug Apr 2017 #102

We should thank Rug sincerely here. Bretton Garcia Apr 2017 #104

That's not framed, it's a low slow softball over the plate, designed to be hit by a believer. AtheistCrusader Apr 2017 #117

At least the reviewer edhopper Apr 2017 #12

Oh, Barron is no hack at all. rug Apr 2017 #15

didn't say he was a hack edhopper Apr 2017 #17

Sorry, I call a lot of clergy hacks, usually based on their insincerity and cynicism. rug Apr 2017 #20

I think he is biased edhopper Apr 2017 #21

I don't find Strobel's arguments convincing either. rug Apr 2017 #23

biased yes edhopper Apr 2017 #26

I've talked with Robert Barron. And Strobel's son Kyle. Bretton Garcia Apr 2017 #13

I'm dubious. rug Apr 2017 #16

Blog Kyle. Bretton Garcia Apr 2017 #19

Metamorpha. rug Apr 2017 #22

That's Kyle Bretton Garcia Apr 2017 #24

Here's his blog. rug Apr 2017 #25

When he called me "friend" at EWTN he was an up and coming priest Bretton Garcia Apr 2017 #28

He would still call you friend. rug Apr 2017 #37

So, does he uncover irrefutable physical proof of the Resurrection? PoindexterOglethorpe Apr 2017 #29

He's referring to the hearsay account written years after the purported fact, Orrex Apr 2017 #32

Sounds likely these guys all right Bretton Garcia Apr 2017 #33

Watch the movie. Read the book. rug Apr 2017 #40

He's preaching to the choir. People sworn to believe faithfully. Bretton Garcia Apr 2017 #51

Like hell he has. AtheistCrusader Apr 2017 #88

The hell he hasn't. rug Apr 2017 #96

I have several copies of his book. A throw-away theistic argument is to give someone AtheistCrusader Apr 2017 #99

The story is loaded: The story's premise puts the atheist at an unwinnable disadvantage. DetlefK Apr 2017 #31

Precisely. Flip it and that's exactly the antitheist method. rug Apr 2017 #41

Nice broadbrush Orrex Apr 2017 #84

Here's a meme for you. rug Apr 2017 #93

It's only unwinnable because there's no evidence. AtheistCrusader Apr 2017 #89

It's unwinnable because you attack the immaterial by demanding material evidence. rug Apr 2017 #95

*Ignoring the books of your faith claim the immaterial MADE everything material* AtheistCrusader Apr 2017 #97

But it does. rug Apr 2017 #107

False analogy Orrex Apr 2017 #108

Cliched replies. rug Apr 2017 #109

Ad hominem Orrex Apr 2017 #110

Red herring. rug Apr 2017 #111

No Orrex Apr 2017 #112

I've read it already. rug Apr 2017 #113

Does the author describe themself in the book and how he or she might be contacted? AtheistCrusader Apr 2017 #114

Exactly. Orrex Apr 2017 #115

Right. AtheistCrusader Apr 2017 #116

Terrific summary Orrex Apr 2017 #119

An ant doesn't know what a tool is. It's incapable. rug Apr 2017 #128

Right as usual sir. AtheistCrusader Apr 2017 #129

Tell me when they find ants using a sponge left behind a drywall. rug Apr 2017 #130

If I got shot down that hard I might be tempted to drop a non-sequitur and flee as well. AtheistCrusader Apr 2017 #131

You're a hero in your own mnid, Ace. rug Apr 2017 #132

Is that so? Lordquinton Apr 2017 #135

Special pleading Orrex Apr 2017 #105

Apples and oranges. rug Apr 2017 #106

At least apples and oranges are REAL. AtheistCrusader Apr 2017 #133

So is their difference. rug Apr 2017 #134

This guy can't really be much of a reporter PoindexterOglethorpe Apr 2017 #34

True. But? Bretton Garcia Apr 2017 #35

History is what happens in the real world. PoindexterOglethorpe Apr 2017 #44

I agree. Barron has more work to do. Bretton Garcia Apr 2017 #47

Read his review edhopper Apr 2017 #42

Rug tricked us with a misleading excerpt again !?!!?? Bretton Garcia Apr 2017 #48

Same old edhopper Apr 2017 #52

That's a pretty piss-poor - and stale - summary of the review. rug Apr 2017 #59

Careful, or you'll be accused of broad-brushing. Orrex Apr 2017 #56

Seeking succor in sympathetic quarters? rug Apr 2017 #60

No. Orrex Apr 2017 #67

That could be the title of the fucking book/movie in your OP. AtheistCrusader Apr 2017 #90

Squealing like a stuck pig could be the title of some responses. rug Apr 2017 #92

No, I mean your post was a genius paraphrase. AtheistCrusader Apr 2017 #100

Maybe you should read the whole link. rug Apr 2017 #58

+1000 Cattledog Apr 2017 #63

Jesus is always real to me. hrmjustin Apr 2017 #76

Strobel should not have been impressed with the idea Htom Sirveaux Apr 2017 #78

Elvis sightings were a staple of the National Inquirer Bretton Garcia Apr 2017 #79

Apologetics generally bore me but this shallow intellectualism is amusing.... Humanist_Activist Apr 2017 #80

Standard responses to apologetics Bretton Garcia Apr 2017 #83

Argument to populism is tricky. They still crank out some 1/3-1/2 million copies of Atlas Shrugged AtheistCrusader Apr 2017 #91

I was trying to be generous, and bringing up the point that it doesn't matter much if it was.... Humanist_Activist Apr 2017 #98

"Faith" attacks the science, history, of the Bible Bretton Garcia Apr 2017 #86

Barron never does History Bretton Garcia Apr 2017 #87

This message was self-deleted by its author ymetca Apr 2017 #127