Religion

Mariana

(15,626 posts)

26. Redemption and forgiveness.

Reply to yallerdawg (Reply #12)

Tue Nov 7, 2017, 01:08 PM

Nov 2017

Who needs redemption and forgiveness? Why do they need it?

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'Called Home. Gone to Be with Their Lord. In a Better Place.' [View all] MineralMan Nov 2017 OP

In the christian religion, there are always a rationalizations for everything that happens. And RKP5637 Nov 2017 #1

Yup. It's all a freaking mystery, isn't it? MineralMan Nov 2017 #2

Uh oh, now you're going to be accused of religious intolerance. trotsky Nov 2017 #3

It's no secret. That is the oft-stated doctrine MineralMan Nov 2017 #4

Well yeah but you can't talk about it *like that*, you see. trotsky Nov 2017 #7

That is ridiculous. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #8

Ridiculous? trotsky Nov 2017 #10

the lord murdered those people and jesus did nothing to stop it. "shall not perish" LOL nt msongs Nov 2017 #29

I beg to differ with you. MineralMan Nov 2017 #11

See. Now you're adding in the true core of Christianity. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #12

No, he covered all that Lordquinton Nov 2017 #16

"They're in a better place now." MineralMan Nov 2017 #17

Redemption and forgiveness. Mariana Nov 2017 #26

You'll have to ask them. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #30

"They believe they come up short everyday" trotsky Nov 2017 #32

You don't believe this? yallerdawg Nov 2017 #33

The question is, should everyone believe it? trotsky Nov 2017 #35

You have a twisted concept of the core message of Christianity. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #38

You agree that the core message is that of CONDITIONAL love. trotsky Nov 2017 #39

The sacrifice is unconditional. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #40

What a free choice! trotsky Nov 2017 #44

If you believe there is no afterlife... yallerdawg Nov 2017 #63

I care because it's a fucking horrible idea. trotsky Nov 2017 #66

Stop cherry picking out of the book, please. Mariana Nov 2017 #43

We all perish. Inarguable. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #47

You have said in the past that you are not a Christian. trotsky Nov 2017 #48

I just think many here have a distorted view of true Christianity. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #50

You aren't a Christian. Who are you to define Christianity? trotsky Nov 2017 #51

"True Christianity" Act_of_Reparation Nov 2017 #59

You condemn and disparage believers... yallerdawg Nov 2017 #61

No, really. Tell us more. Act_of_Reparation Nov 2017 #65

Many believers should be disparaged and condemned. Mariana Nov 2017 #71

Do you believe ISIS and Al-Qaeda... yallerdawg Nov 2017 #96

Good luck in your debate. eom guillaumeb Nov 2017 #105

Thank you! yallerdawg Nov 2017 #110

Yallerdawg, you are not a Christian? You sound like a Christian. marylandblue Nov 2017 #95

I want to defend faith and people of faith. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #97

The book clearly says that we DON'T all perish. Mariana Nov 2017 #49

NOW you have nailed the core soul of Christianity. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #52

Let me "cherry pick" another. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #57

And the book clearly says that is everyone. Mariana Nov 2017 #72

Christianity exists because we want to be better! yallerdawg Nov 2017 #73

But the problem only exists because Christianity says it is one. trotsky Nov 2017 #74

You have this insistence on labeling people. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #77

And you have this insistence on changing the topic when you can't defend your position. trotsky Nov 2017 #79

You just ask the same thing over and over. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #82

Yeah, I'm pretty stupid. Thanks. trotsky Nov 2017 #84

Try Post 82. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #86

I ask the same question because you won't answer it. trotsky Nov 2017 #88

One can observe a certain pattern and similarity to your posts. guillaumeb Nov 2017 #107

That's a broad brush statement. Act_of_Reparation Nov 2017 #114

Yeah, I often repeat the question when someone refuses to answer it. trotsky Nov 2017 #117

Here's pretty much what the Bible says about such a woman Glorfindel Nov 2017 #55

Ah, such a message of love. trotsky Nov 2017 #67

They believe that because the core of Christianity Mariana Nov 2017 #34

Not the core. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #36

Yes, the core. trotsky Nov 2017 #37

That is called an observation. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #42

So here we are. trotsky Nov 2017 #45

Assumption and observation, yes. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #58

But without that assumption, what *you* call the core is utterly meaningless and unnecessary. trotsky Nov 2017 #68

you do know that this doctrine applies to new born babies, right? Voltaire2 Nov 2017 #131

Another assumption and observation - with a solution! yallerdawg Nov 2017 #137

well there is always word salad as an argument. Voltaire2 Nov 2017 #139

Sometimes it's a good and positive thing, I suppose. Mariana Nov 2017 #41

I think the only core belief of Christianity is that the world is saved through Jesus marylandblue Nov 2017 #31

The core belief is that the world needs to be saved, I think. Mariana Nov 2017 #53

Yes, but lots of variation on the details marylandblue Nov 2017 #54

So you have defined the core of Christianity? guillaumeb Nov 2017 #99

Oh, by all means. MineralMan Nov 2017 #100

And you feel at all qualified to define what billions believe? guillaumeb Nov 2017 #101

You offered. Please proceed. MineralMan Nov 2017 #103

No, I am content to accept that you are the official "definer" guillaumeb Nov 2017 #104

OK then. MineralMan Nov 2017 #106

A far better answer than your "definition" of Christianity. eom guillaumeb Nov 2017 #108

You should direct that same post at your friend yallerdawg. trotsky Nov 2017 #116

Is it back to all about me? yallerdawg Nov 2017 #138

In this case, yes. trotsky Nov 2017 #141

If I remember correctly, Romans 3:23: All have sinned and fall short of the glory of God. Still Blue in PDX Nov 2017 #46

Marketing 101 Pope George Ringo II Nov 2017 #9

Those poor babies who had just started their lives. My heart breaks..n/t monmouth4 Nov 2017 #5

"In a better place" has always been particularly frightening Pope George Ringo II Nov 2017 #6

No, belief in an afterlife means you're not afraid of or dreading death. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #25

Excuse meeee.... wcmagumba Nov 2017 #56

Which is why people who believe in an afterlife spend more on end of life medical treatment... Act_of_Reparation Nov 2017 #69

Or maybe they have been more richly rewarded in this life... yallerdawg Nov 2017 #78

Oh, FFS! dhol82 Nov 2017 #109

That would be a confusing conclusion. Act_of_Reparation Nov 2017 #113

There are a lot fewer atheists... yallerdawg Nov 2017 #124

Yes, it always skews the numbers. Act_of_Reparation Nov 2017 #125

Per capita? yallerdawg Nov 2017 #127

Thanks! Act_of_Reparation Nov 2017 #128

If this is what you want to hang your hat on... yallerdawg Nov 2017 #129

In your expert opinion... Act_of_Reparation Nov 2017 #130

you left out :crickets: Voltaire2 Nov 2017 #132

Wow, WTF dude. trotsky Nov 2017 #119

What would be the secular, godless message to these people suffering? yallerdawg Nov 2017 #13

So secular, godless people can't comfort anyone? Act_of_Reparation Nov 2017 #14

All I see here is... yallerdawg Nov 2017 #22

That's great. Act_of_Reparation Nov 2017 #24

It would be, "What a horrible thing to have happened!" MineralMan Nov 2017 #15

We are to believe that's not good enough. Act_of_Reparation Nov 2017 #19

Apparently so. MineralMan Nov 2017 #21

No that's the theistic response Lordquinton Nov 2017 #18

Bingo! MineralMan Nov 2017 #20

How 'bout let's speak out for the victims pandr32 Nov 2017 #28

An appropriate Vonnegut allusion, from Slaughterhouse Five. longship Nov 2017 #23

My dad never went to church but my mom did so when he died blueinredohio Nov 2017 #27

The only way they can justify these senseless murders. The fact is they are simply dead The_Casual_Observer Nov 2017 #60

That's my opinion, as well. MineralMan Nov 2017 #62

You hope. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #64

Nope. It's not a matter of hope. MineralMan Nov 2017 #70

I think Yallerdawg is implying Mariana Nov 2017 #75

That IS the wager, isn't it? yallerdawg Nov 2017 #80

You're not a Christian. trotsky Nov 2017 #81

As a gambler... yallerdawg Nov 2017 #83

Prove to me that there are only 4 options. trotsky Nov 2017 #85

From wiki: yallerdawg Nov 2017 #87

From me: trotsky Nov 2017 #89

Silly wabbit. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #90

How do you know Pascal picked the right god? trotsky Nov 2017 #91

I don't understand why you keep repeating something I have never said. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #92

So, no response to any of the questions? trotsky Nov 2017 #93

Do you have me on "ignore?" yallerdawg Nov 2017 #94

I bet you wish I did. trotsky Nov 2017 #118

Trotsky has a valid question, and I wish you would answer it. Mariana Nov 2017 #112

You want to use philosophical quibbling as a distraction. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #121

You brought up "the wager" in this thread. Mariana Nov 2017 #122

I pointed out in this thread... yallerdawg Nov 2017 #123

No, it really isn't the wager. Mariana Nov 2017 #111

If you actually sit down and do the math... Act_of_Reparation Nov 2017 #115

Relevant quote trotsky Nov 2017 #120

so do you believe that there is eternal damnation for unbelievers? Voltaire2 Nov 2017 #133

You'll find out. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #134

yet another person of faith unwilling to state what they believe. Voltaire2 Nov 2017 #135

I am not here to proselytize or save your soul. yallerdawg Nov 2017 #136

Most who believe that aren't honest enough to say it outright Mariana Nov 2017 #140

I'm not a betting man. MineralMan Nov 2017 #102

This is one of the reasons I left organized religion years ago. redstatebluegirl Nov 2017 #76

Prayers are, in my view, intended as a comfort for the survivors. eom guillaumeb Nov 2017 #98

Prayer is a form of meditation, I think. The Velveteen Ocelot Nov 2017 #126

People who can so casually dismis death scare me quite a bit. AtheistCrusader Nov 2017 #142