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SarahM32

(270 posts)
65. Why it's more than mere hope.
Sun Sep 9, 2012, 02:54 PM
Sep 2012

As I said in my Reply # 42, Isaiah and Jesus were making specific prophecies about a specific event.

The problem is that the theology of Christian Apologetics has caused Christians to misunderstand and misinterpret Isaiah.

Here is a relevant quoted excerpt from an article titled Prophecies Re: He Who Fulfills Them:

"The full truth has not been understood because there are certain symbolic phrases in the Judaic scriptures that some of the original Christians focused upon – those that speak of the coming of a son of man who 'will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.' (Isaiah 9:6) But, that is not what the original Hebrew scripture says. And while the work of the modern son of man does indeed bring peace, he, like Jesus, serves the eternal God.

As the article on Isaiah Chapter 53 explains, the original text of Isaiah 9:6 does not contradict itself by saying the son of man is Counselor and Prince of Peace as well as 'God the Everlasting Father.' Rather, it uses words applicable to a son of man whose counsel enables people to get the message of divine intent.

That literal reality is clarified in many other instances in the book of Isaiah (including Isaiah 40:18, 40:25, 42:1-2, 42:8, and 46:5) which state that God is not a person, and that the person who fulfills prophecy is not God but a son of man and a 'servant who God has chosen.'

For example, it is clarified by Isaiah 42:1-4: 'Behold my servant, whom I uphold; mine elect, in whom my soul delights; I have put my spirit upon him, he shall make the right to go forth to the nations. He shall not cry, nor lift up, nor cause his voice to be heard in the street. A bruised reed shall he not break, and the dimly burning wick shall he not quench. He shall make the right to go forth according to the truth. He shall not fail nor be crushed, till he have set the right in the earth; and the isles shall wait for his teaching.'

Many Christians believe that too speaks of Jesus because Matthew 12:19 claims it does. But it clearly does not. That is one of many blatant errors in the Christian gospels. It speaks of the modern son of man, because Jesus did rise up as a teacher-orator. He did cry out to make his voice heard on many occasions, and he certainly did cause his voice to be heard in the street."

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Recommendations

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Interesting. MineralMan Aug 2012 #1
As a seminary graduate I'd say: Ezlivin Aug 2012 #2
As a scholar help me out here please - Nazareth wasn't in the Bible? dballance Aug 2012 #3
I don't recall discussing that in seminary Ezlivin Aug 2012 #11
So the seminary does not cover the whole Bible in their classes? LiberalFighter Aug 2012 #16
No, not at all Ezlivin Aug 2012 #17
I wasn't referring to Nazareth or anything like that. LiberalFighter Aug 2012 #18
We covered it all Ezlivin Aug 2012 #19
Thank you for the insight. LiberalFighter Aug 2012 #20
I hope not Ezlivin Aug 2012 #24
Madelyn Murray O'Hare and Jim Morrison were seminary students alfredo Aug 2012 #26
Jesus being "from Nazareth" or being a "Nazarene" is mentioned 28 times in the NT. SarahM32 Aug 2012 #12
Thanks for the info. Which Bible Version? dballance Aug 2012 #14
Here are the numbers from KJV and NIV SarahM32 Aug 2012 #23
Most seminary graduates would not say no. They're taught the answer is yes. SarahM32 Aug 2012 #7
K&R - I want to hear from someone who knows the answers to the poster and the commenters. northoftheborder Aug 2012 #4
You're asking for a bit too much. An area of a great deal of disagreement. dimbear Aug 2012 #28
The three Isaiah and Jesus Thats my opinion Aug 2012 #5
Yes, many scholars say the book of Isaiah had three authors. But ... SarahM32 Aug 2012 #10
3 authors from 3 completely diferent periods of Judean History intaglio Aug 2012 #22
The translated quote from Isaiah that you include has a lot of the same cbayer Aug 2012 #6
Handel uses several exclusively Old Testament texts--and this is one. nt Thats my opinion Aug 2012 #8
Handel used Isaiah's words. SarahM32 Aug 2012 #9
Interesting website. Linguistically, historically I'm interested in the course of bible translations pinto Aug 2012 #13
Background and purpose of the site. SarahM32 Aug 2012 #15
One big problem intaglio Aug 2012 #21
It's not really a problem. SarahM32 Aug 2012 #25
The site you so proudly promote intaglio Aug 2012 #27
Not so. In fact, the site refutes the theology of Christian Apologetics. SarahM32 Aug 2012 #29
Being Jeffersonian does not mean that you abandon apologetics intaglio Aug 2012 #30
Intaglio, I disagree. And here's why: SarahM32 Aug 2012 #32
I said he was an apologist. Many faiths have apologists intaglio Aug 2012 #35
No. Jefferson was not an Apologist. And furthermore ... SarahM32 Aug 2012 #36
Well I can forgive you for misreading my sentence about Jefferson intaglio Aug 2012 #38
Well, since you put it that way ... I will say this: SarahM32 Sep 2012 #48
There are literary apologists intaglio Sep 2012 #49
Oh brother. SarahM32 Sep 2012 #50
You have stopped listening intaglio Sep 2012 #51
'Tis the other way around. SarahM32 Sep 2012 #54
You continue in your false description of apologetics intaglio Sep 2012 #55
Please. Let's be accurate. SarahM32 Sep 2012 #57
Again, apologetics is not just Christian, Isa is not the word you used intaglio Sep 2012 #59
Again, that's not relevant and avoids the issue. And ... SarahM32 Sep 2012 #60
I repeat only to be ignored by you again intaglio Sep 2012 #61
Okay, for the last time ... SarahM32 Sep 2012 #62
You distort and ignore, you are trapped in a web of deceit intaglio Sep 2012 #63
The relationship between Old Testament materials Thats my opinion Aug 2012 #31
Well, I wouldn't say that. SarahM32 Aug 2012 #33
Again you are speaking of "The Book of Isaiah" as if it is a singular production intaglio Aug 2012 #34
No, I am not. SarahM32 Aug 2012 #37
A fiat that you are right and others are wrong intaglio Aug 2012 #39
I think both of you have made some serious points. Thats my opinion Aug 2012 #41
Thanks. And ... SarahM32 Aug 2012 #43
Why it's more than mere hope. SarahM32 Sep 2012 #65
It has nothing to do with "profession" or money. SarahM32 Sep 2012 #66
There's an introduction to the 1611 King James Bible by its translators indicating Petrushka Aug 2012 #40
However, Strong in particular, Thats my opinion Aug 2012 #42
Yes. Thank you again. SarahM32 Aug 2012 #45
Petrushka, that's just more Apologetics, and ... SarahM32 Aug 2012 #44
Thanks for the link. Just discovered what the "messenger for the Spirit of truth" believes . . . Petrushka Aug 2012 #46
That story was published in February 2002. There's a more recent one online. SarahM32 Aug 2012 #47
FWIW: The writer of those articles, refers to himself in the thrid person, saying . . . Petrushka Sep 2012 #52
Ah, but you miss some very crucial facts. SarahM32 Sep 2012 #53
"...when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth." ?? Petrushka Sep 2012 #56
So, in other words, you will not address the facts, and simply ignore the truth? SarahM32 Sep 2012 #58
Why it's important that the book of Isaiah is not about Jesus SarahM32 Sep 2012 #64
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