Religion

tama

(9,137 posts)

100. Native rituals are experiental

Wed Jan 2, 2013, 01:42 AM

Jan 2013

much more deeply so than e.g. typical western religious practice of top down dogmatic theological preaching. I assume that was the
point.

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"Other ways of knowing," aka Different Cognitive Styles [View all] okasha Dec 2012 OP

I think I disagree with your last statement notadmblnd Dec 2012 #1

I agree that there are situations to which the theory does not apply, cbayer Dec 2012 #27

OK, so 'normality' tama Dec 2012 #30

While I respect your POV on this and can see the validity of your arguments, cbayer Dec 2012 #32

That's why tama Dec 2012 #35

tama, you are talking over my head. cbayer Dec 2012 #36

Sorry, I'll try, and thanks for asking tama Dec 2012 #38

Thanks, that makes more sense. cbayer Dec 2012 #39

Well, the "quantum looney" etc. tama Dec 2012 #40

This is where we will part ways pretty dramatically. cbayer Dec 2012 #41

Hmm tama Dec 2012 #42

Thank you. okasha Dec 2012 #50

If you recognize the condition, how can you continue to suffer from it without being equally insane? NoOneMan Dec 2012 #56

And then... what the heck do we know? tama Dec 2012 #65

"using this species to develop an antidote against..." NoOneMan Dec 2012 #69

No tama Dec 2012 #70

From what you said Laochtine Dec 2012 #43

I did not say that. cbayer Dec 2012 #44

In silent agreement. Well put. humblebum Dec 2012 #45

The possibility that something is true has no relation to the number of people who believe it. trotsky Dec 2012 #46

So then, if one juror thinks a defendant is guilty, he's guilty, but if all 12 say he's not guilty, humblebum Dec 2012 #47

If one juror 'thinks' he's guilty EvilAL Dec 2012 #74

Never said it did. But I did say that there was a higher probability of guilt humblebum Dec 2012 #83

I don't see it like that, EvilAL Jan 2013 #113

Justin Beiber is the best singer? Laochtine Jan 2013 #88

I think I should probably have added okasha Dec 2012 #49

I have been struggling with putting a similar idea into the right words and cbayer Dec 2012 #60

I recently saw an article about a local group of matachines, okasha Dec 2012 #62

I see no reason to presume otherwise tama Dec 2012 #71

If this is the case, NoOneMan Dec 2012 #76

In terms of their adaptational advantage, for humans, being part of a tribe could be critical. cbayer Dec 2012 #77

Why of course people find religion important NoOneMan Dec 2012 #78

It is interesting that those most discriminated against or who suffer the most have cbayer Dec 2012 #79

Where else are they to turn? NoOneMan Dec 2012 #81

Also tama Dec 2012 #84

I see what you mean. okasha Dec 2012 #48

There were three stages tama Dec 2012 #82

As usual, this discussion is not of much use skepticscott Dec 2012 #2

The two examples you chose actually illustrate two disjoint sets of "knowing". Warren Stupidity Dec 2012 #3

The distinction may or may not be valid skepticscott Dec 2012 #4

You may think so tama Dec 2012 #23

It's not my OP skepticscott Dec 2012 #25

Oh, words can mean things tama Dec 2012 #29

Should've been posted in GD. DCKit Dec 2012 #5

Discussions in 'religion' have always dealt with ways of knowing, Thats my opinion Dec 2012 #6

False, as usual from you skepticscott Dec 2012 #8

"fails to respond to challenges to describe in detail these 'other ways of knowing'" - still humblebum Dec 2012 #10

Yes, fail skepticscott Dec 2012 #11

Yep. Same old tired excuse - 'It never happened' - but we know it did, humblebum Dec 2012 #14

Thanks for proving my point skepticscott Dec 2012 #19

Yep, same old tired excuses, er um uh - LIES. As per humblebum Dec 2012 #20

Yep, same old tired excuses AlbertCat Jan 2013 #90

Don't make me laugh. The subject has been covered and examples given ad nauseam as humblebum Jan 2013 #91

The subject has been covered and examples given ad nauseam AlbertCat Jan 2013 #94

This is one of those areas where a suggestion in the scientific literature ... Igel Dec 2012 #7

Very interesting. Thats my opinion Dec 2012 #13

Do you have anything substantive to say, Charles? skepticscott Dec 2012 #17

Scottie tama Dec 2012 #22

Is there a remotely relevant point here? skepticscott Dec 2012 #24

Yup tama Dec 2012 #31

Actually, TMO was condescending and patronising to a poster, mr blur Dec 2012 #34

That's your interpretation, then tama Dec 2012 #37

There really is argument about this- digonswine Dec 2012 #9

The claim by utterly failed claimants skepticscott Dec 2012 #12

You have been so thoroughly debunked in the past from telling this same lie humblebum Dec 2012 #18

I seem to remember a big discussion about this- digonswine Dec 2012 #33

You're correct okasha Dec 2012 #51

just stopped when i hit 'scientism' Phillip McCleod Dec 2012 #15

Doesn't surprise me that okasha skepticscott Dec 2012 #16

That's ok. In that case, you only skipped the last two sentences. cbayer Dec 2012 #28

Yeah, let's chuck out the one thing that we know works. nt Deep13 Dec 2012 #54

Curtis' description here is pretty misleading LeftishBrit Dec 2012 #21

One of my favorite movies is Rashomon by Kurosawa. cbayer Dec 2012 #26

"Is one recollection more valid than the other?" Deep13 Dec 2012 #53

But who is to say which is more true? And does it really matter? cbayer Dec 2012 #61

It matters, and often, as I said, we just don't know. Deep13 Dec 2012 #66

When you talk about the most objective method, you describe science. cbayer Dec 2012 #72

Thanks, cbayer. okasha Dec 2012 #55

When you turn fiction jamtoday Jan 2013 #134

This has nothing to do with the veracity of religious claims. Deep13 Dec 2012 #52

No, you're only assuming that okasha Dec 2012 #57

No, theologies--whether folk or official--are the religion... Deep13 Dec 2012 #58

Wrong. okasha Dec 2012 #59

As further evidence in your presentation... sanatanadharma Dec 2012 #63

How po-mo can you get? Deep13 Dec 2012 #68

Wrong. Deep13 Dec 2012 #64

Mythology and literalism tama Dec 2012 #75

Well that may be true... Deep13 Jan 2013 #111

Thanks for your response tama Jan 2013 #119

Mythology is not theology. okasha Jan 2013 #103

So what's the difference? Deep13 Jan 2013 #108

That's all theology. okasha Jan 2013 #116

A quick and dirty distinction, Deep 13. okasha Jan 2013 #132

Where do you get the idea that there is no theology associated with Native American humblebum Jan 2013 #97

humblebum, tama Jan 2013 #98

The particular subject being addressed was that humblebum Jan 2013 #99

Native rituals are experiental tama Jan 2013 #100

Agreed, though all of us came from tribal cultures similar in many ways to those humblebum Jan 2013 #101

Yes, tama Jan 2013 #102

I get that idea okasha Jan 2013 #104

There does seem to be some equivocation regarding what constitutes theology. humblebum Jan 2013 #109

Please see my post #103, above. okasha Jan 2013 #115

Again, there does seem to be an ambiguity here. I hardly see theology as related solely humblebum Jan 2013 #117

Would you like to tell more about your background and practice? tama Jan 2013 #110

I'm Tsalagi (Cherokee). okasha Jan 2013 #114

Thanks tama Jan 2013 #120

Should have added: okasha Jan 2013 #121

Yup, Road Man :) nt and thanks again tama Jan 2013 #122

Could you define "medicine man" ? Leontius Jan 2013 #127

What I really dislike about the term okasha Jan 2013 #131

Are you trying to claim there's a thing called "the religious experience"... Silent3 Dec 2012 #67

Maybe these "experiences"... NoOneMan Dec 2012 #73

Can you give an example of "self-evident knowledge"? Silent3 Jan 2013 #87

This came first to mind: tama Jan 2013 #93

You're making some assumptions for which I see no basis. okasha Jan 2013 #105

I find Curtis' explanations, to be simplistic and demeaning to human variety, but your last.... Humanist_Activist Dec 2012 #80

basically you are claiming that reality is determined by popular vote, which is the most idiotic... cleanhippie Jan 2013 #85

But isn't that tama Jan 2013 #86

Aka, "consensus reality." okasha Jan 2013 #106

Learn about things before spouting off about them otherwise you come off... Humanist_Activist Jan 2013 #124

He seems to know exactly what he talking about and what he is talking about IS taught humblebum Jan 2013 #125

I just can't imagine why you complain that people don't listen to you. cbayer Jan 2013 #133

No, because that isn't accepted as evidence alone... Humanist_Activist Jan 2013 #123

No, but tama Jan 2013 #128

A problem with your example, the word "pretty" is itself subjective... Humanist_Activist Jan 2013 #129

The example was bit tongue in cheek tama Jan 2013 #130

He argues that the art student must rely on intuitive rather than rational information processing .. AlbertCat Jan 2013 #89

Are you an artist? tama Jan 2013 #92

Are you an artist? AlbertCat Jan 2013 #95

You have your theory of inspiration tama Jan 2013 #96

You're arguing with a number of things that neither Curtis nor I said. okasha Jan 2013 #107

rely on parts of your brain that do not depend on such "rational" divisions. AlbertCat Jan 2013 #112

May I suggest that you try to draw a rounded object using 1- or 2-point perspective? okasha Jan 2013 #118

Then tell us how one determines whether a drawing is good or not? humblebum Jan 2013 #126