Religion

rug

(82,333 posts)

62. No, what Dawkins was attempting was a plagiarism of Epicurus.

Thu Aug 1, 2013, 05:50 PM

Aug 2013

If God had to kill his son, then his power is limited. Therefore he is not a god.

If he had another choice but chose this, he's evil.

There are of course other conclusions, if the death was voluntary, but that's not what he's interested in discussing.

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Why torture your son? [View all] pokerfan Jul 2013 OP

Maybe satan made him do it? mikeysnot Jul 2013 #1

Sometimes I think that the Abrahamic religions worship a demon and not a "god". kestrel91316 Jul 2013 #2

What a lovely site! cbayer Jul 2013 #3

I'm cool with it, especially if it is funny. ZombieHorde Aug 2013 #51

That would go over like a nuclear bomb here, and you know it, ZH. cbayer Aug 2013 #53

We all know that's half the fun. nt ZombieHorde Aug 2013 #55

I don't think it's much fun at all. cbayer Aug 2013 #56

That is fair. I forget that we're not all admused by making fun of ourselves. nt ZombieHorde Aug 2013 #57

I'm pretty good about making fun of myself. It's the making fun of others I don't cbayer Aug 2013 #58

Once again Dawkins proceeds on a false premise. rug Jul 2013 #4

Well... pokerfan Jul 2013 #6

Nevermind prefunk Jul 2013 #20

It really is the orthodox view. rug Jul 2013 #21

That is your belief edhopper Jul 2013 #31

Ordained or not, it doesn't mean he had no choice. rug Jul 2013 #35

Here's the problem edhopper Jul 2013 #36

Give me one link that holds God was powerless to do anything else. rug Jul 2013 #37

What a weird way to phrase it. edhopper Jul 2013 #38

Precisely. Now read that cartoon headline again. rug Jul 2013 #39

Read the tag line edhopper Jul 2013 #40

"Why did he have to have his son tortured?" rug Jul 2013 #41

This is just getting sad edhopper Jul 2013 #42

True, I find this result would have been more compelling, for belief: AtheistCrusader Aug 2013 #67

Too much thinking, not enough blind faith Blue Owl Jul 2013 #5

I am a Christian and my parents are not. My dad says to me... hrmjustin Jul 2013 #7

Jesus did not have to be crucified pokerfan Jul 2013 #8

Jesus accepted the will of the Father. Christians believe Jesus's Death and Ressurrection is a hrmjustin Jul 2013 #9

But didn't Jesus know that he wouldn't really die? pokerfan Jul 2013 #10

Jesus really did die. It was not a pretend death. And he rose again. That is my beliefs. hrmjustin Jul 2013 #11

OK. Didn't he know that he would really truly die... pokerfan Jul 2013 #12

According to the gospels he predicted it three times. hrmjustin Jul 2013 #13

So... pokerfan Jul 2013 #14

Hanging on a cross is a sacrifice, He really did suffer. hrmjustin Jul 2013 #15

Lots of other people hung on crosses. Mariana Jul 2013 #29

Well i understand that view but as a Christian I believed he died and rose again. He did suffer pain hrmjustin Jul 2013 #30

I think that viewpoint fails to take into consideration okasha Jul 2013 #32

I don't think it does. Mariana Jul 2013 #34

I agree with most of what you say. okasha Aug 2013 #48

There's a key difference, if we accept the myth. trotsky Aug 2013 #49

As I read the Christian teaching, the occupying authority killed Jesus, after finding him struggle4progress Jul 2013 #16

Yet according to core Christian theology, the blood sacrifice was necessary. trotsky Jul 2013 #17

I suppose you may portray "core Christian theology" however you choose, struggle4progress Jul 2013 #18

I portray it as the vast majority of Christians believe it. trotsky Jul 2013 #22

I have some doubts about whether you have actually discussed the matter with "the vast majority struggle4progress Jul 2013 #23

My statement is backed by the official dogma of most major denominations. trotsky Jul 2013 #25

Funny how "Christ died for your sins" suddenly doesn't apply. Warren Stupidity Aug 2013 #43

What's funny is how people are able to talk past each other. eomer Aug 2013 #44

Wait... do I have this right? trotsky Aug 2013 #45

No, sorry if I made it sound that way. eomer Aug 2013 #46

OK, you might want to direct your comments toward s4p. trotsky Aug 2013 #47

This subthread is an example. rug Aug 2013 #50

Actually I think Trotsky and I meant the same thing. eomer Aug 2013 #59

If there was no redemption without his death is another way of saying he had to. rug Aug 2013 #60

So why didn't God just forgive without the torture and death of his son? eomer Aug 2013 #61

No, what Dawkins was attempting was a plagiarism of Epicurus. rug Aug 2013 #62

So Jesus' dying was not part of God's plan? n/t eomer Aug 2013 #63

A plan requires a present and a future. In other words, time. rug Aug 2013 #64

Okay, his will. The point that Dawkins is trying to make is that if God is all powerful... eomer Aug 2013 #65

Thanks for tracking down the source. rug Aug 2013 #68

Except it doesn't. rug Jul 2013 #19

So if he wasn't crucified edhopper Jul 2013 #24

An excellent question. rug Jul 2013 #26

The tenets based on "works" probably don't. okasha Jul 2013 #27

Why do you care? MissMarple Jul 2013 #28

If competing gods are torturing their sons, you do what you got to do. dimbear Jul 2013 #33

I don't recall any story okasha Aug 2013 #52

I allude, as you well understand, to the many dying and rising saviors which dimbear Aug 2013 #66

Good question. Zoeisright Aug 2013 #54