2016 Postmortem

winter is coming

(11,785 posts)

117. ^^ This. I have difficulty believing we truly need to spend *that* much for defense.

Thu Jan 14, 2016, 03:34 PM

Jan 2016

If we do, let's figure out why, and what we're getting for our money. If we're going to spend that much money on our country, I'd rather see it go to infrastructure, education, and healthcare.

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If you want Single Payer, are you willing to impose a national sales tax to pay for it? [View all] Yavin4 Jan 2016 OP

8 out of 10 democrats favor single payer. cali Jan 2016 #1

Are you willing to pay a national sales tax to pay for it? n/t Yavin4 Jan 2016 #8

I am yes. apnu Jan 2016 #23

Me too! ViseGrip Jan 2016 #118

It beats paying insurance premiums and co-pays, doesn't it? arcane1 Jan 2016 #86

I say yes, too demigoddess Jan 2016 #122

I am, yes. But it might not even be necessary. Bernie Sanders said that the Single Payer Cal33 Jan 2016 #135

HELL YES! It's less expensive than monthly insurance policies...that's for damn sure. n/t in_cog_ni_to Jan 2016 #2

Yes. I will be happy to pay in taxes what I pay to an insurance company. Autumn Jan 2016 #3

Hell yes. We are paying $800 a month through employer. 7wo7rees Jan 2016 #20

I would prefer a progressive tax nt firebrand80 Jan 2016 #4

Yep. Gidney N Cloyd Jan 2016 #5

I'd prefer income taxes but sure whatthehey Jan 2016 #6

Yes TubbersUK Jan 2016 #60

Absolutely! fleur-de-lisa Jan 2016 #7

Do your fellow Americans want a national sales tax? Yavin4 Jan 2016 #9

I don't know what your game is nor do I really care . . . fleur-de-lisa Jan 2016 #25

Transparent as glass: deceptive descriptions and weak-ass talking points. arcane1 Jan 2016 #87

Yes, because they are already paying through the nose for health insurance. merrily Jan 2016 #44

When they have to pay half again for EVERYTHING, the bloom will come off that rose real quick. nt MADem Jan 2016 #65

Sorry, but 2.2 percent of income in taxes is far less than half the 14.7 percent Fawke Em Jan 2016 #97

When they realize it would be less than their insurance premiums? tkmorris Jan 2016 #112

If the Sanders campaign thought they could win sufrommich Jan 2016 #10

GOP talking point Armstead Jan 2016 #19

Well,yes. Exactly. sufrommich Jan 2016 #22

And our job is to echo that? Armstead Jan 2016 #28

You cannot win an election in the U.S. by promising to raise taxes sufrommich Jan 2016 #33

Oh heck then. Let's just cancel the election and let the GOP do whatever they wasnt. Armstead Jan 2016 #38

Americans understand they are already paying for health insurance. merrily Jan 2016 #45

Not just that .... Mother Of Four Jan 2016 #153

Sorry, I've been wrong to fall for the pretense that this is really about Medicare for All when merrily Jan 2016 #154

... Mother Of Four Jan 2016 #155

No, no, my response is not about you or about Medicare for All. merrily Jan 2016 #156

Ah gotcha .... Mother Of Four Jan 2016 #157

Yep. Facts won't matter. merrily Jan 2016 #158

You can if you tell them the amount they'd save paying taxes Fawke Em Jan 2016 #99

It's the job of the Clintonites to echo GOP talking points, yes. Doctor_J Jan 2016 #101

Except when it's expedient to parrot a liberal line Armstead Jan 2016 #105

The average family will save money. Broward Jan 2016 #29

Some would save money,others wouldn't. Union members sufrommich Jan 2016 #43

I don't believe that is true because he will be taxing the middle class a modest amount Samantha Jan 2016 #169

Paying national sales tax will be cheaper than health care now Robbins Jan 2016 #11

It doesn't require a sales tax. evlbstrd Jan 2016 #12

Don't disagree with single payer, but doubling our Medicare tax won't be enough. Hoyt Jan 2016 #26

I don't even know if we can reach the German efficiency level exboyfil Jan 2016 #57

It would definitely be a lot, as Vermont found out when they ended their bold experiment to enact Hoyt Jan 2016 #70

That's looking only at payroll income. RichVRichV Jan 2016 #104

Yes! Health care costs are half in other developed countries and outcomes are better! Human101948 Jan 2016 #31

^^^this^^^ and, if necessary, supplement with sales tax on CERTAIN items ReasonableToo Jan 2016 #62

Wait, wait... PyaarRevolution Jan 2016 #109

"Those foods" = "sugary foods" ReasonableToo Jan 2016 #127

I was referring... PyaarRevolution Jan 2016 #139

not interested in hashing out finite details at this point in time. ReasonableToo Jan 2016 #144

I feel the same as you, but am curious to know why organic and non-gmo food would be exempt cleanhippie Jan 2016 #149

Me: NO extra tax on fresh produce ReasonableToo Jan 2016 #160

It seems you are open to following the science, wherever that takes us. cleanhippie Jan 2016 #161

Cool. Glad we are in agreement. :-) ReasonableToo Jan 2016 #163

Well, at least they do follow science, not the psuedo-science peddled by anti-GMO groups. cleanhippie Jan 2016 #165

I would add that we should also tax alcoholic beverages, altho we do that here in CT CTyankee Jan 2016 #170

Yes, I would rather pay a tax than an insurance premium. Punkingal Jan 2016 #13

HELL YES! no brainer. nt m-lekktor Jan 2016 #14

If necessary. But we won't know the numbers mmonk Jan 2016 #15

More expansive AND worse EdwardBernays Jan 2016 #27

Why not try something like increasing the taxes on those making $300,000 and more/year first? Cal33 Jan 2016 #16

Do you have any idea how much you'd have to tax them to keep from taxing lower income Hoyt Jan 2016 #34

You need an entirely new source of revenue to replace the existing health insurance system Yavin4 Jan 2016 #48

Didn't Sanders say that he was going to go for the Single Payer system with universal coverage? He Cal33 Jan 2016 #133

That's why I wrote to give it a try first to see how it will come out. My question to you is, Do Cal33 Jan 2016 #75

Even the legitimate stuff in that list doesn't approach the $3 trillion we spend on health annually. Hoyt Jan 2016 #93

Here's a link stating that Corporate Welfare costs the average American family $6,000 per year. Do Cal33 Jan 2016 #130

No. Are you being purposely obtuse. I mean, Sanders isn't going to change that. Hoyt Jan 2016 #132

There is no point in discussing this further. You think your way, and I'll think mine. Cal33 Jan 2016 #134

I used to think like you right up until George McGovern lost in a landslide. Hoyt Jan 2016 #136

Just read my msg. 135, which is near the top of the page. And read the link. Cal33 Jan 2016 #137

We also need to figure out where to get $150B/yr. for 20 years exboyfil Jan 2016 #76

I think hospitals, insurance companies, pharmaceutical companies and doctors over-charge. Cal33 Jan 2016 #88

Like with an executive order? No, he could not Orangepeel Jan 2016 #148

Medicare pays only a percentage of what doctors charge. The doctors who take Cal33 Jan 2016 #162

Yep Armstead Jan 2016 #17

European countries are not paying a fortune for defense. potone Jan 2016 #18

^^ This. I have difficulty believing we truly need to spend *that* much for defense. winter is coming Jan 2016 #117

[cough] bullshit [cough] EdwardBernays Jan 2016 #21

Value-added tax Yavin4 Jan 2016 #51

National Insurance contribution EdwardBernays Jan 2016 #58

VAT is not the primary funding mechanism for enlightenment Jan 2016 #64

Exactly right EdwardBernays Jan 2016 #79

Correct TubbersUK Jan 2016 #145

If it is the same as my friend in Australia marlakay Jan 2016 #24

Great story. Here's how they pay for those services Yavin4 Jan 2016 #32

No. enlightenment Jan 2016 #69

Sales tax is 9% where I live noiretextatique Jan 2016 #111

No TubbersUK Jan 2016 #147

Yes, except we don't need to. Cut military spending by a couple percent. Myrina Jan 2016 #30

Not enough money. Not nearly enough. Yavin4 Jan 2016 #35

So cut it by 50%. We have the biggest military budget in the history of everyone forever anywhere. Myrina Jan 2016 #37

My agenda is truth. Yavin4 Jan 2016 #53

Exactly!!! exboyfil Jan 2016 #59

Why not the whole truth then? whatthehey Jan 2016 #67

The humorous thing would be if exboyfil Jan 2016 #73

Agenda is truth underpants Jan 2016 #106

Right now my wife and I are paying approximately $1100 per month for Medicare and a supplement tularetom Jan 2016 #36

Look over your spending on goods/services on a monthly basis. Yavin4 Jan 2016 #55

I'd have to be spending $11k a month before I'd lose money tularetom Jan 2016 #63

VAT is a sales tax on services rather than goods. ieoeja Jan 2016 #121

Actually, as it is imposed in Canada and Australia, it is a tax on goods AND services tularetom Jan 2016 #143

I much prefer income taxes to pay for it... ljm2002 Jan 2016 #39

Yep. marmar Jan 2016 #40

sales taxes are regressive. tax the rich. tk2kewl Jan 2016 #41

point taken Hiraeth Jan 2016 #78

Which is why the OP is claiming sales taxes are the only way to fund single payer. jeff47 Jan 2016 #81

Yes, and the OP has done nothing to explain how this just has to be done with sales taxes. DisgustipatedinCA Jan 2016 #98

Yes, and yes... Your entire premise is false. onecaliberal Jan 2016 #42

I AM ALREADY PAYING MORE IN PREMIUMS AND DEDUCTIBLES THAN THE TAX RATE. HELL YEAH !!! Hiraeth Jan 2016 #46

yes! thanks for putting it in all caps for the neuronally-challenged. kath Jan 2016 #74

IT TAKES WHAT IT TAKES TO GET OUT THE VOTE. THANKS !! Hiraeth Jan 2016 #83

I would be willing to fund it with a sensible and progressive Ed Suspicious Jan 2016 #47

Yes. although that is regressive. I like Bernie's plan better. n/t Motown_Johnny Jan 2016 #49

The US consumer spends $20 billion on soft drinks Ichingcarpenter Jan 2016 #50

Yes. DinahMoeHum Jan 2016 #52

Yes, elleng Jan 2016 #54

Whatever it takes bowens43 Jan 2016 #56

Yes (nt) bigwillq Jan 2016 #61

Yes___________________________ n/t vkkv Jan 2016 #66

I pay $350/month for my plan through the exchange Politicub Jan 2016 #68

No Buzz cook Jan 2016 #71

No. Income tax. Sales taxes are regressive. Matariki Jan 2016 #72

Exactly AJH032 Jan 2016 #167

Yes..... daleanime Jan 2016 #77

If you oppose single payer, can you do it without lying? jeff47 Jan 2016 #80

Yes! redstatebluegirl Jan 2016 #82

Or an income tax AgingAmerican Jan 2016 #84

Id rather pay taxes than be forced to pay for corporate greed. WDIM Jan 2016 #85

Yes. Europe seems to be doing well despite a sales tax. Tierra_y_Libertad Jan 2016 #89

Unfortunately I would have to say no. avebury Jan 2016 #90

If we just paid what we are already paying to corporations WDIM Jan 2016 #96

I am one of the lucky ones in that I don't have avebury Jan 2016 #140

Sure why not Mnpaul Jan 2016 #91

You don't have to use a national sales tax. n/t Skwmom Jan 2016 #92

I reject the central thesis--that sales taxes must be raised in order to accomplish this. DisgustipatedinCA Jan 2016 #94

The current proposals have it paid for by a slight income tax. Fawke Em Jan 2016 #95

I am really tired of Republicans and DINOs telling me why we can't have healthcare LIKE EVERY OTHER Doctor_J Jan 2016 #100

Yes cantbeserious Jan 2016 #102

I' m American - in the UK - the NHS is great - you would love it. Clifton Jan 2016 #103

Yes, the NHS truly is a gift :) TubbersUK Jan 2016 #110

It makes too much sense, most US politicos don't have the sense Dog gave a carrot. Mnemosyne Jan 2016 #166

As long as it's not on groceries. PyaarRevolution Jan 2016 #107

Interesting: many responders read this to say we would "have to" do a VAT, which you didn't say Recursion Jan 2016 #108

The responders on this thread remind me of Republicans who want tax cuts without saying what... Yavin4 Jan 2016 #115

The anti-tax guy tells me I remind him of a Republican? I think not. DisgustipatedinCA Jan 2016 #120

Okay. You have a reading comprehension problem. Yavin4 Jan 2016 #124

No, I believe my old English major is helping me to barely get by, somehow. DisgustipatedinCA Jan 2016 #125

Almost every fucking responder on this thread has said, "yes, raise taxes". ieoeja Jan 2016 #123

They are playing their designated role. Poorly, yes, but still playing it n/t arcane1 Jan 2016 #126

If it's a lot less than my $700+ a month for ACA, then shit yes! nt valerief Jan 2016 #113

The amount of sales tax I will pay will be far less than the premiums and deductibles Maedhros Jan 2016 #114

I'm paying a heckuva lot more on medical premiums than I am sales tax. EndElectoral Jan 2016 #116

False framing. We can tax anything we want to pay for it. Orsino Jan 2016 #119

Yes especially if it includes sonofspy777 Jan 2016 #128

No. It should be a progressive income tax, or possibly some kind of financial transaction tax. drm604 Jan 2016 #129

That's a great idea and relatively painless. Vinca Jan 2016 #131

Sure. Normally I hate sales tax but LittleBlue Jan 2016 #138

We have that in Canada. Poor people get money back from the tax service 4 times a year. Think of all applegrove Jan 2016 #141

Absolutely! n/t shanti Jan 2016 #142

About a 28% tax. Nt. seabeyond Jan 2016 #146

This message was self-deleted by its author polly7 Jan 2016 #150

Sure, if we don't have to pay insurance premiums. Blue_In_AK Jan 2016 #151

Make it a poll please. darkangel218 Jan 2016 #152

yes MariaThinks Jan 2016 #159

It would be a whole lot less than what I am currently paying in deductibles. n/t FourScore Jan 2016 #164

I prefer a payroll tax with no cap n/t TexasBushwhacker Jan 2016 #168