2016 Postmortem

Recursion

(56,582 posts)

50. "Lying" is a bit harsh; he knows the "plan" he released is complete bullshit, though

Wed Feb 3, 2016, 07:25 AM

Feb 2016

I mean, he knows you can't pay a negative amount for pharmaceuticals. It's a stretch to call it a "lie"; he just is telling the base what they want to hear. It's how you win elections.

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The False Lure of the Sanders Single-Payer Plan [View all] kennetha Feb 2016 OP

"Inquiring minds want to know".......... Not much. nt 7wo7rees Feb 2016 #1

The lesson is: never try. [n/t] Maedhros Feb 2016 #2

The lesson is kennetha Feb 2016 #8

I'm sorry, but I don't buy your defeatist bullshit. Maedhros Feb 2016 #10

There is nothin defeatist about bein practical and honest with the voters riversedge Feb 2016 #53

Yeah, Hillary's pretty destructive, all right. Fawke Em Feb 2016 #110

The choice is not between proposing something that has no chance JDPriestly Feb 2016 #38

Teddy Roosevelt gordyfl Feb 2016 #31

What trade offs, and why is it pie-in-the-sky? polly7 Feb 2016 #3

read the article. kennetha Feb 2016 #5

No. I asked you, you made the thread and the claims. nt. polly7 Feb 2016 #7

some salient points kennetha Feb 2016 #11

The U.S. spends more on health-care than any country in the developed world. polly7 Feb 2016 #13

The only way it can cost more is that it will insure more people. JDPriestly Feb 2016 #43

You're exactly right Recursion Feb 2016 #47

Ding ding ding, we have a winner! Erich Bloodaxe BSN Feb 2016 #62

Again, read the article. And read other stuff that has been written about the transition costs. kennetha Feb 2016 #75

the health care industry will adjust mdbl Feb 2016 #46

The infrastructure and medical workers are all in the private sector jmowreader Feb 2016 #52

While providing treatment to the 80 million people currently skipping treatments due to cost Recursion Feb 2016 #54

Medical workers are all in the private sector here, also. polly7 Feb 2016 #55

Are doctors' offices run as not-for-profit entities also? jmowreader Feb 2016 #84

Some run their offices in their own private buildings with other physicians and specialists, polly7 Feb 2016 #85

Your system was established BEFORE that kind of medicine came in jmowreader Feb 2016 #86

Our physicians and specialists also take advantage of rapid technological change polly7 Feb 2016 #88

It's cheaper to upgrade than to start from scratch jmowreader Feb 2016 #90

Oh, I'm sorry. I didn't realize you were talking specifically about laser vision correction. polly7 Feb 2016 #91

I'd rather he tried and failed Philos Feb 2016 #4

He's not actually trying.... kennetha Feb 2016 #12

I'm at least willing to give him the chance to prove otherwise Philos Feb 2016 #14

You assume Bernie is like Hillary and just lying. Fearless Feb 2016 #21

"Lying" is a bit harsh; he knows the "plan" he released is complete bullshit, though Recursion Feb 2016 #50

He's not lying exactly, but he is engaging in empty demagoguery kennetha Feb 2016 #74

Pixie Dust! tecelote Feb 2016 #42

The magic pixie dust is in the myth that all of our healthcare is JDPriestly Feb 2016 #48

Let's hope the magic pixie dust can at least mdbl Feb 2016 #49

is it our goal or not? Do we not speak aspirationally? Fast Walker 52 Feb 2016 #69

He did try as he had a bill but it went nowhere treestar Feb 2016 #77

No We Can't! tecelote Feb 2016 #26

I'd rather someone succeed in doing something treestar Feb 2016 #76

The author was Bill Clinton's advisor in the 90's. beam me up scottie Feb 2016 #6

LOL! ebayfool Feb 2016 #9

American Prospect is home for DEM party hacks. nt m-lekktor Feb 2016 #40

What a shock. ;) beam me up scottie Feb 2016 #44

That is the question -- So what exactly IS the point? ucrdem Feb 2016 #15

Income inequility, political graft, health care costs, and student debt are all grand illusions. mhatrw Feb 2016 #18

Single payer: riff on ACA. Free college: riff on Obama's CC plan. And so on. ucrdem Feb 2016 #19

ACA: riff off Single Payer. And so on. nt. polly7 Feb 2016 #23

People are tired of being ripped off by the "too big to fail" banks JDPriestly Feb 2016 #51

Unfortunately I'm starting to think this is just how politics works now Recursion Feb 2016 #39

"Inquiring minds want to know" madokie Feb 2016 #16

Singler payer is by far the best bet for all. One pool, everyone in it. No corporate profiteering. mhatrw Feb 2016 #17

Plenty of corporate profiteering from providers, though Recursion Feb 2016 #36

Who cares what this person thinks. They're wrong. Fearless Feb 2016 #20

Details? gordyfl Feb 2016 #22

Where's that famous American Can Do spirit? Bad Dog Feb 2016 #24

I remember posting an article I found about UK healthcare before the NHS. mwooldri Feb 2016 #33

Harry Leslie Smith Bad Dog Feb 2016 #37

My father died of tuberculosis in the 30s and he HAD healthcare. virgogal Feb 2016 #79

You're more likely to get cured if you can get treated. Bad Dog Feb 2016 #83

Silly bullshit. We are ALREADY PAYING for universal health care eridani Feb 2016 #25

Actually, we're overpaying for universal healthcare. winter is coming Feb 2016 #87

Agreed--we could have platinum-plated care for what we are now paying n/t eridani Feb 2016 #94

Actually, isn't it the status quo that's unfeasible ? TubbersUK Feb 2016 #27

NAILED IT. Fast Walker 52 Feb 2016 #70

So, instead of "Yes we can!" it's "No we can't!" pat_k Feb 2016 #28

Start with an idea... mwooldri Feb 2016 #29

Inquiring minds want to know nationalize the fed Feb 2016 #30

You run with the argument that brings the donations and volunteers in Recursion Feb 2016 #32

No, it's aspirational and setting the starting position for negotiations. jeff47 Feb 2016 #73

I lived in four European countries. They all had single-payer. JDPriestly Feb 2016 #34

Literally impossible, since there aren't 4 European countries with single payer Recursion Feb 2016 #35

Who cares whether or not we fit the technical definition of single payer. Bad Dog Feb 2016 #41

I agree, which is why insisting on "single payer or nothing" is idiotic Recursion Feb 2016 #45

How do you define single-payer. I lived in UK, Austria, Germany and JDPriestly Feb 2016 #56

WTF are you talking about? France has 30% copays! Recursion Feb 2016 #59

Having copays does not make a system not a universal public system. Warren Stupidity Feb 2016 #63

Well, no, that's just not what "single payer" means Recursion Feb 2016 #65

UK not single payer? How? mwooldri Feb 2016 #92

Well, as you point out Recursion Feb 2016 #93

Generally, doctors are not NHS employees - they're contractors. mwooldri Feb 2016 #97

Of course it's single payer TubbersUK Feb 2016 #96

Senator Sanders has to be more pure than anyone in the world. Tortmaster Feb 2016 #57

Shouldn't it be more about all the people who would benefit from polly7 Feb 2016 #60

Sander's proposal are feasible handmade34 Feb 2016 #58

I never thought it was possible that a Democrat Unknown Beatle Feb 2016 #61

You confuse ends with means kennetha Feb 2016 #119

Yep. Sanders is going to wave arms and cut Healthcare spending from $3 Trillion to $1.38. Hoyt Feb 2016 #64

While covering providing care to 80 million more people (nt) Recursion Feb 2016 #66

Most folks want to do that, but he needs to be honest about the cost and Hoyt Feb 2016 #67

I haven't got time this morning to dig them up but there are Jarqui Feb 2016 #68

I pay $700 a month for my premium only. I would rather pay a $400 tax. Were you around Autumn Feb 2016 #71

God I want to buy a house from people who write this shit. jeff47 Feb 2016 #72

In negotiations, you don't reopen issues already settled in your favor unless you are foolish. kennetha Feb 2016 #78

The ACA is not sustainable. jeff47 Feb 2016 #80

Many Countries around the world that have universal coverage operate on a similar model. kennetha Feb 2016 #81

And using their models still requires gutting the ACA. jeff47 Feb 2016 #82

Yes TubbersUK Feb 2016 #121

�Single-payer is the only health reform that pays for itself� Ferd Berfel Feb 2016 #89

The lure of the CAN'T DO, CAN'T DO campaign is so much sweeter. Live and Learn Feb 2016 #95

Yet it has been proven to work in scores of other countries AgingAmerican Feb 2016 #98

That's not really the issue kennetha Feb 2016 #99

Defeatist attitudes are the main roadblock AgingAmerican Feb 2016 #100

No that's not at all the main roadblock. kennetha Feb 2016 #102

Defeatism is the enemy of progress AgingAmerican Feb 2016 #103

politics as wish fulfillment kennetha Feb 2016 #104

if they can do it, why do you insist that we cannot...? mike_c Feb 2016 #105

Obviously you didn't bother to read the linked to article. kennetha Feb 2016 #106

I'm sorry, but I'm not buying it.... mike_c Feb 2016 #115

Well if you were a dictator kennetha Feb 2016 #116

I'm happy to improve and extend what has already been achieved.... mike_c Feb 2016 #117

I was all in favor the public option kennetha Feb 2016 #118

Yes, but they are not 'Americanly Exceptional!' immoderate Feb 2016 #101

It's perfectly feasible and requires resolve. katsy Feb 2016 #107

did you actually read the linked to article? kennetha Feb 2016 #108

I think we need to keep single payer the goal. katsy Feb 2016 #109

Hillary has univeral coverage as her goas since day one. Her proposal is incremental steps given riversedge Feb 2016 #111

I'm all for single payer and love our candidates. katsy Feb 2016 #113

He is talking out of his butt. That's where you are wrong. kennetha Feb 2016 #112

I'm still researching but I am concerned katsy Feb 2016 #114

So despite the fact that many countries successfully use single payer health care, grntuscarora Feb 2016 #120