2016 Postmortem

mwooldri

(10,783 posts)

146. Some people stick with their party, some don't.

Thu Feb 4, 2016, 11:04 AM

Feb 2016

If dedication to a particular political party is important to you, then yes Hillary makes more sense than Bernie. However the political party system in the USA simply makes a non Repuke/Democratic Party candidate non viable. That's why Bernie registered as a Democrat in states that have party registration (Vermont doesn't have it) and is running as a Democrat. That's also why (for similar reasons) why The Dumpster (aka Donald Trump) is running for the Repuke Party nomination. The closest we got in modern times is Ross Perot and even then he was under the guise of a political party.

Besides the definition of who is a Democrat or a Repuke is very wide. Why is the former Florida Governor Charlie Crist now a Democrat rather than a Repuke? Would Jill Stein be welcomed into the Democratic Party were she to leave the Green Party? Is Donald Trump a Democrat given his past support of the Clintons, or a Repuke? (then again is Donald J Trump just a persona of Donald Trump, being put on for our electoral entertainment?)

I choose Bernie over Hillary because of his loyalty to his principles over his loyalty to any political party. His principles don't appear to me to have changed a whole lot over the years. Hillary - a bit more flexible. Bernie also to me appears to want to work towards goals I believe are important.

However... Hillary is miles better than anyone running for the Repuke Party nomination, and it saddens me to say that Donald Trump is probably the best of the bunch... I'm convinced Donald J Trump is a persona running for President and that The Donald is much more moderate than he wants to have you believe right now. But Bernie 1st, Hillary 2nd. Jill Stein 3rd.

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BOOM! Barbara Boxer: Hillary is a progressive EVERY day. Bernie is a Democrat "some days." [View all] riversedge Feb 2016 OP

True or false: Admiral Loinpresser Feb 2016 #1

the Clinton fan club rejects reality and creates its own version. hobbit709 Feb 2016 #9

Crickets, crickets, crickets. n/t Admiral Loinpresser Feb 2016 #15

what a disgusting thing for her to say. I just lost a lot of roguevalley Feb 2016 #99

Not sure who you mean pandr32 Feb 2016 #169

Barbara boxer knows both candidates more then all of us yeoman6987 Feb 2016 #132

And she's a Democrat "some days" too. hobbit709 Feb 2016 #133

Maybe true depending on issue. yeoman6987 Feb 2016 #136

Like Bernie? BlueCaliDem Feb 2016 #178

Her opinion is wrong in this case Bradical79 Feb 2016 #145

Honestly, the India suing us is making me question my vote yeoman6987 Feb 2016 #152

Welcome to WTO world. n/t Admiral Loinpresser Feb 2016 #233

As much as I admire Barbara Boxer, she's a party loyalist. frylock Feb 2016 #147

Ms Boxer knows A LOT of things we peons aren't privvy to. Plucketeer Feb 2016 #162

Thank you for pointing that out pandr32 Feb 2016 #170

True. yeoman6987 Feb 2016 #174

The most fundamental part of progressive is “progress”. She effects progress. PeaceNikki Feb 2016 #155

Good read mikehiggins Feb 2016 #191

Read it again, it doesn't talk about financial help, but help with resources, guidance, connections. PeaceNikki Feb 2016 #194

I strongly disagree. Admiral Loinpresser Feb 2016 #225

Bernie should not have started this stupid meme. We have be two things or labels at once. riversedge Feb 2016 #33

Can't answer my question? Admiral Loinpresser Feb 2016 #37

Of course not. Talking points of the day come down, they don't sway. Fuddnik Feb 2016 #67

Oh, he's not afraid to debate. He's just horrible at it. BlueCaliDem Feb 2016 #182

Bernie Sanders is a conservative when it comes to guns. MoonRiver Feb 2016 #78

if hrc were 10% I would dislike her less roguevalley Feb 2016 #101

I answered your question with my post. Try some reading comprehension please. Thanks. riversedge Feb 2016 #88

No you didn't. Admiral Loinpresser Feb 2016 #151

I'm not sure what you meant either Bradical79 Feb 2016 #156

I think your "boom" fizzled before it even happened. Bubzer Feb 2016 #64

Hmmm. No response. jhart3333 Feb 2016 #79

Boxer voted no on the war and is soft on gun control (she sounds more like Bernie to me) Omaha Steve Feb 2016 #100

Maybe because Senator Boxer is a Democrat and Bernie is only one out of political expediency? BlueCaliDem Feb 2016 #187

Bernie's running although he doesn't want to-- Admiral Loinpresser Feb 2016 #237

Even better angrychair Feb 2016 #38

What exactly has she gotten "done" in the face of Repub opposition? blackspade Feb 2016 #65

True or false: I-VT became D-VT when it was convenient for his Presidential run? Algernon Moncrieff Feb 2016 #73

He became a Democrat because zalinda Feb 2016 #91

If he didn't like the party as-is, he should have run as an independent Algernon Moncrieff Feb 2016 #216

And then you would be whining that he is a spoiler. zalinda Feb 2016 #235

Boom goes the dynamite! Admiral Loinpresser Feb 2016 #238

DU has been filled with complaints about Republicans who became Democrats Algernon Moncrieff Feb 2016 #241

Only when Bernie started to rise zalinda Feb 2016 #247

He became a Democrat to fix your broken party. frylock Feb 2016 #154

My party was fine - thanks. Algernon Moncrieff Feb 2016 #215

Bill Clinton hasn't been in office for 15 years. frylock Feb 2016 #218

...and think about it -- Bernie Sanders was old then Algernon Moncrieff Feb 2016 #223

Ah good. More ageist bullshit. You should be proud. frylock Feb 2016 #224

umm. "your broken party"--Aren't you a Democrat? Just asking. riversedge Feb 2016 #220

Nope. frylock Feb 2016 #221

False. Admiral Loinpresser Feb 2016 #168

So it wasn't "responsible" of him to be a member of the Democratic party as Senator from Vermont Algernon Moncrieff Feb 2016 #217

+1 eom BlueMTexpat Feb 2016 #227

You have no idea what you're talking about. Admiral Loinpresser Feb 2016 #232

Mr "progressive" Bernie Sanders carries water for the NRA workinclasszero Feb 2016 #75

They love him so much they failed him with a D-. Fawke Em Feb 2016 #83

How the National Rifle Association helped get Bernie Sanders elected workinclasszero Feb 2016 #106

Hillary Clinton is responsible for more weapons of war being unleashed upon the world than Ikonoklast Feb 2016 #171

30000 plus americans die from totally unregulated guns in america..year after year workinclasszero Feb 2016 #176

And yet, Wayne LaPierre told his members to vote for Bernie workinclasszero Feb 2016 #189

With a D- rating from the NRA. eom zalinda Feb 2016 #87

Hillary carries water for the MIC Cassiopeia Feb 2016 #90

Yeah...a D- rated watercarrier... tex-wyo-dem Feb 2016 #96

Apparently he carries the water Goblinmonger Feb 2016 #150

Absolutely false. Admiral Loinpresser Feb 2016 #183

Yes, dpatbrown Feb 2016 #81

True Go Vols Feb 2016 #122

SHE'S A MODERATE, BECAUSE HER POSITIONS ARE HELD BY MOST AMERICANS! CSStrowbridge Feb 2016 #141

TRUE! in_cog_ni_to Feb 2016 #166

Bernie is a Democrat only when he needs to be liberal N proud Feb 2016 #2

who has Bernie Duckhunter935 Feb 2016 #13

It really comes down to too much emphasis on labels, hollysmom Feb 2016 #22

It's about principals. tecelote Feb 2016 #45

Only when he needs something from the Democrats liberal N proud Feb 2016 #48

If he goes third party the Democrats zalinda Feb 2016 #97

I need something from the Democrats, and once again will probably be let down and disappointed. nt Snotcicles Feb 2016 #127

He's consistently acted and voted more like a Democrat... tex-wyo-dem Feb 2016 #138

But we're not supposed to point that out, remember? VulgarPoet Feb 2016 #198

Touche, twd Carolina Feb 2016 #242

Interesting! Explains a lot.... tex-wyo-dem Feb 2016 #245

Right...that explains her speaking payments from goldman sachs... Bubzer Feb 2016 #66

And 'beyond'? Are you sure you want to stick with that? blackspade Feb 2016 #70

Oh jesus help me.. !! pangaia Feb 2016 #112

Some people stick with their party, some don't. mwooldri Feb 2016 #146

Silly and if Clinton wanted to be referred to as a progressive she would not have Jefferson23 Feb 2016 #3

couldn't you say the same thing re Bernie and being a Dem? DrDan Feb 2016 #19

How are they equivalent when for one, the DNC has no issue with Bernie running, do they? Jefferson23 Feb 2016 #26

simple - Bernie did not label himself a Dem, then switched when he thought he could DrDan Feb 2016 #104

He is an Independent and transparently was accepted by the DNC to run on our ticket. Jefferson23 Feb 2016 #111

he WAS an independent - then HE changed DrDan Feb 2016 #114

Yea, I guess you missed the way he did that TRANSPARENTLY...to the DNC and they're Jefferson23 Feb 2016 #125

I don't think he is a phony at all - why try to put words in my mouth? DrDan Feb 2016 #129

I didn't put any words in your mouth, I asked you a question. Jefferson23 Feb 2016 #135

as Bernie gave himself two labels - Indy and Dem DrDan Feb 2016 #181

lol enjoy your obtuse sandwich. n/t Jefferson23 Feb 2016 #185

enjoy your denial. n/t DrDan Feb 2016 #190

you absolutely did - "you evidently feel he is a phony" DrDan Feb 2016 #188

My post#125, of which I will remind you, you did not post my quote in full. Jefferson23 Feb 2016 #192

There's only 30% of you out there, and maybe 5% give a shit about that "issue" frylock Feb 2016 #157

read my post #114 DrDan Feb 2016 #180

I agree. frylock Feb 2016 #193

That's something about Bernie that's always made me uncomfortable. NurseJackie Feb 2016 #4

I guess hearing the truth makes you uncomfortable. hobbit709 Feb 2016 #6

he could have caucused with Duckhunter935 Feb 2016 #18

+1 stonecutter357 Feb 2016 #31

Is Barbara Boxer calling Hillary, the self-described moderate, a liar? Broward Feb 2016 #5

Yes. Ed Suspicious Feb 2016 #46

Then Hillary is a liar Motown_Johnny Feb 2016 #7

Bullshit leftynyc Feb 2016 #40

Message auto-removed Name removed Feb 2016 #58

Get lost newbie leftynyc Feb 2016 #59

I really have a hard time understanding your position on the gun manufacturers. A Simple Game Feb 2016 #63

Thank you! Fawke Em Feb 2016 #89

The fact is, each candidate is progressive on some issues and moderate on others ... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2016 #68

Beats the shit out of me leftynyc Feb 2016 #85

I think it a mistake for Bernie's campaign to get into the who is more progressive ... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2016 #110

And very divisive leftynyc Feb 2016 #126

Yep. But I get the sense that ... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2016 #161

It's what happens leftynyc Feb 2016 #173

Beats the shit out of me, too. I'm a Bernie supporter and no Nay Feb 2016 #200

Agree leftynyc Feb 2016 #211

Oh, no problem. We don't have to agree on who to vote for. I Nay Feb 2016 #213

Same here leftynyc Feb 2016 #214

She called herself a moderate. Was that a lie or not? Motown_Johnny Feb 2016 #117

Did you NOT read what I just wrote leftynyc Feb 2016 #130

Yes I did. Now answer the question. Motown_Johnny Feb 2016 #134

I did answer the question leftynyc Feb 2016 #142

I am not asking your opinion on if she is a progressive or moderate. Motown_Johnny Feb 2016 #144

LOL - what utter crap leftynyc Feb 2016 #148

I am questioning her honesty. Nothing else. Motown_Johnny Feb 2016 #175

K&R betsuni Feb 2016 #8

Sanders is right, the anti-gun nuts are wrong. Odin2005 Feb 2016 #10

the 'Democrat' that Boxer refers to is not the 'Democrat' of 30 years ago, either... islandmkl Feb 2016 #11

Thread win! Does anyone really think Abraham Lincoln or Teddy Roosevelt would have KingCharlemagne Feb 2016 #39

Party loyalty to a near-right wing tribe of neoliberals VulgarPoet Feb 2016 #12

Thank you! ejbr Feb 2016 #53

Massive win. ucrdem Feb 2016 #14

If believing delusional crap is your thing... MattSh Feb 2016 #16

Nice! DCBob Feb 2016 #17

Being a global lobbyist for Big Business as Sec of State was anything but progressive RiverLover Feb 2016 #20

You do know that is kind of one of State's job? My husband worked with an all american girl Feb 2016 #74

Actually, RiverLover Feb 2016 #115

I'm not sure, but I do know that our ambassador was fostering relationships with all american girl Feb 2016 #158

That has always bothered me about the State Department. Cleita Feb 2016 #201

I'm not sure what you mean by securty. all american girl Feb 2016 #205

Look at the American journalists kidnapped and beheaded for Cleita Feb 2016 #210

My wife has duty every other month or so Recursion Feb 2016 #240

The same Barbara Boxer who took Hillary to task over her Iraq war vote? pinebox Feb 2016 #21

Hillary helped push the coup in Honduras that sent many of those children KingCharlemagne Feb 2016 #42

Excellent! Puglover Feb 2016 #153

Brace yourself for accusations of vicious attacks On Sen Boxer. frylock Feb 2016 #163

lol pinebox Feb 2016 #164

More like whimper than boom. Hill and Barb are related through cali Feb 2016 #23

I'm cool . . . Gamecock Lefty Feb 2016 #24

I'm glad your beliefs are so strong that some posters on a message boards can sway you Armstead Feb 2016 #35

I know - that always makes me LOL bread_and_roses Feb 2016 #62

Way to hold true to core principles. Ed Suspicious Feb 2016 #50

Clinton ought not push this theme because it calls attention to her proud claim to be a moderate on Vote2016 Feb 2016 #25

Here are the videos~ RiverLover Feb 2016 #28

OUCH! Vote2016 Feb 2016 #34

except when shes a moderate Go Vols Feb 2016 #118

Says noted Corporatist Blue-Dog DLC DINO Conservadem Barbara Boxer Freddie Stubbs Feb 2016 #27

well said. And under the bus Boxer goes ericson00 Feb 2016 #29

After making that statement, she belongs there. Fawke Em Feb 2016 #44

K&R! stonecutter357 Feb 2016 #30

Neither Hillary or Barbara are progressive everyday. Both are funded by JRLeft Feb 2016 #32

Bernie is a bigger Democrat than any member of the party. alarimer Feb 2016 #36

BOOM: would Boxer prefer he caucus with the Rpublicans on some days Nanjeanne Feb 2016 #41

Wow. Barb's gone over to the dark side. Fawke Em Feb 2016 #43

K&R mcar Feb 2016 #47

Bernie doesn't take brides Geronimoe Feb 2016 #49

Yeah, cuz he's already married. lol. nt Nay Feb 2016 #199

Barbara knows where her bread is buttered. roody Feb 2016 #51

"Boom"? Don't you mean "splat"? The Velveteen Ocelot Feb 2016 #52

WRONG. Bernie is a Progressive. Hillary is a DLC/Third Way corporate lackey, always. Roland99 Feb 2016 #54

Boom! Hillary did fund raisers for Boxer when she was in jeopardy of LOSING Omaha Steve Feb 2016 #55

+1 Bubzer Feb 2016 #177

+10000000 azmom Feb 2016 #234

Did Boxer look in the mirror when she said "some days" hobbit709 Feb 2016 #56

Hillary has called herself a moderate Bjornsdotter Feb 2016 #57

Well, if you redefine 'progressive' to mean maintaining the status quo..... blackspade Feb 2016 #60

Well, at least she's discussing issues for a change nxylas Feb 2016 #61

And Boxer only wants to fix things when dems have no power to do anything 2pooped2pop Feb 2016 #69

Even on the days she REFERS to HERSELF as MODERATE? (yeah, didn't think so) AzDar Feb 2016 #71

She was a progressive on the day she Voted for the Iraq War? Bread and Circus Feb 2016 #72

Didn't she campaign for Joe Lieberman? Nedsdag Feb 2016 #76

Democrat, Progressive, Independent, Progressive monicaangela Feb 2016 #77

Didn't her daughter marry Hillary's brother? Fawke Em Feb 2016 #80

Probably more toddler type Sander fans comments. Those comments are NOT progressive. Shameful riversedge Feb 2016 #98

You didn't even look at the comments, did you? frylock Feb 2016 #167

...... daleanime Feb 2016 #82

How is Hillary a progressive, exactly? MynameisBlarney Feb 2016 #84

This is the very same logic randr Feb 2016 #86

Burn. nt LexVegas Feb 2016 #92

Under the bus with you, babs! wyldwolf Feb 2016 #93

Remember the room full of red roses? OxQQme Feb 2016 #105

k&r DesertRat Feb 2016 #94

She says she is a mushy 'moderate' centrist AgingAmerican Feb 2016 #95

Barbara Boxer is right on most days. Not sure about some days like yesterday. nt thereismore Feb 2016 #102

For whom is the government going to work? Rebkeh Feb 2016 #103

K&R DesertRat Feb 2016 #107

Is that why she started off as a RepubliCON? RoccoR5955 Feb 2016 #108

Boxer is part of the Washington establishment left-of-center2012 Feb 2016 #109

I Don't Care yellowwoodII Feb 2016 #113

Boxer is the best. Bleacher Creature Feb 2016 #116

Barbary is apparently a liar Trajan Feb 2016 #119

total balderdash amborin Feb 2016 #120

What's in a name? retrowire Feb 2016 #121

And because Hillary takes corporate campaign donations--she's a slave to the corporations EVERYDAY CoffeeCat Feb 2016 #123

How awful of Boxer to call Hillary a liar. merrily Feb 2016 #124

DU rec for...nt SidDithers Feb 2016 #128

So. Divide and conquer. If this doesn't stop now we are in for a GOP President. Lint Head Feb 2016 #131

Wow: another Third Way democrat attacking Bernie Sanders? Betty Karlson Feb 2016 #137

Oh Barb... tex-wyo-dem Feb 2016 #139

Hillary being a progressive "every day" is pretty hyperbolic Bradical79 Feb 2016 #140

Just what I was going to say. He's been very honest about his actions, Nay Feb 2016 #203

FIZZLE! No, she's not. Good try, though. (N/T) Old Crow Feb 2016 #143

Wow. So two votes on one polarizing issue, and that makes Hillary a progressive every day? frylock Feb 2016 #149

The most fundamental part of progressive is “progress”. She effects progress. PeaceNikki Feb 2016 #159

What Barbara Boxer fails to understand is that him not siding with the democrats on every issue basselope Feb 2016 #160

There are many times where Sanders voted conservatively than progressive pandr32 Feb 2016 #165

Barbara Boxer has joined the trolls? Spitfire of ATJ Feb 2016 #172

And your mother wears combat boots hueymahl Feb 2016 #179

K&R! LOVE my Senator - the only one who stood with the CBC in 2004 to protest BlueCaliDem Feb 2016 #184

Moderate/Middle.....then Bernie started showing up and bkkyosemite Feb 2016 #186

F*ck you back. mmonk Feb 2016 #195

I stand with and agree with Senator Boxer Gothmog Feb 2016 #196

Typical third way shortsightedness dragonfly301 Feb 2016 #197

Petition to ban threads that start with the word BOOM Cheese Sandwich Feb 2016 #202

I don't care. Primary season is silly season. katsy Feb 2016 #204

She's a gem! NurseJackie Feb 2016 #206

Moreno's politics are far more attractive than Beltway Boxer's. mhatrw Feb 2016 #208

Great one liner, especially if written for Bob Hope! mhatrw Feb 2016 #207

How one person chooses to define the words "progressive" and "Democrat" doesn't matter. cui bono Feb 2016 #209

Well, Bernie is more old-school Dem and Clinton more Third Way "Dem" so... polichick Feb 2016 #212

IWR, TPP, Iran negotiations, Keystone, Single Payer, Wall St....yeah, she's a real progressive. EndElectoral Feb 2016 #219

Senator Boxer should be grateful Bernie is running as a Democrat. Vinca Feb 2016 #222

Women Stick Together SoCalMusicLover Feb 2016 #226

All congressional legislation is complicated. intheflow Feb 2016 #228

This message was self-deleted by its author stopbush Feb 2016 #229

"Boom" indeed Number23 Feb 2016 #230

Except the days she's voting for the IWR or saying "marriage is a sacred bond between Warren DeMontague Feb 2016 #231

Suck it up Bernie you chose to leave the safety of vanilla independents. great white snark Feb 2016 #236

I don't get the Boom Dems2002 Feb 2016 #239

Boom means Riversedge thinks what Barbara Boxer says is a big deal. m-lekktor Feb 2016 #246

Seth Myers observed something similar. aikoaiko Feb 2016 #243

I hear some booms alright. n/t Aerows Feb 2016 #244