2016 Postmortem

Babel_17

(5,400 posts)

193. It's like the Clinton campaign had to stop thinking about winning the general election

Fri Feb 12, 2016, 11:32 AM

Feb 2016

They're motivated now to do anything, say anything, to win the nomination. But the cost of doing that will come sooner than in November (should Secretary Clinton have managed to become our candidate).

The head to head comparisons as shown in polls are likely, imo, to show the downside of sleazy attacks against one's competitor in the primaries.

Senator Sanders will look like a lock to win against Trump and other Republicans, while Secretary Clinton won't. Her negative numbers, already bad, will look flat out untenable. And then there's the three investigations going on that will reflect on her integrity as the public becomes more aware of them.

If Secretary Clinton can't gain at least the grudging admiration of the majority of those supporting Senator Sanders, she might be unelectable. She'd need those voters in the swing states.

Following the David Brock playbook is not the way to win friends, and influence opinions, among Sanders supporters.

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Have we really reached a place where if you aren't a PoC [View all] cali Feb 2016 OP

Nah, just at a place where AA's on DU who've been screaming there's a problem with.... uponit7771 Feb 2016 #1

The Clinton campaign has been manufacturing that problem cali Feb 2016 #7

They did? ismnotwasm Feb 2016 #9

David Brock TTUBatfan2008 Feb 2016 #15

What does that have to do with the response of AA's to Sanders or his campaign? ismnotwasm Feb 2016 #22

How is anything manufactured? TTUBatfan2008 Feb 2016 #30

I'm still not clear, please elaborate ismnotwasm Feb 2016 #38

Misunderstood what you meant. TTUBatfan2008 Feb 2016 #52

Okey dokey ismnotwasm Feb 2016 #61

Can you specify what the response that you are refering to is? snort Feb 2016 #69

I do. Whole heartedly. The same way she tried to drive a wedge between LGBT and Obama in 08 Joe the Revelator Feb 2016 #26

They did? AlbertCat Feb 2016 #73

Team Hillary has a huge problem they keep trying to make up for Hydra Feb 2016 #185

We, black folk, can think for ourselves... don't need Clintons assessment, which she hasn't given to uponit7771 Feb 2016 #10

It really is hard for Sanders supporters to understand this. vdogg Feb 2016 #131

That is Absolutely Fine elljay Feb 2016 #161

Oh really? MADem Feb 2016 #23

People claiming social justice is nothing more than a "tactic" and POC duped made it a much bettyellen Feb 2016 #24

Some people think that PoC aren't savey enough to know about Sanders uponit7771 Feb 2016 #147

I think the claim that POC (and women) have been duped is patently offensive.... bettyellen Feb 2016 #166

Thx bettyelle... I edited my post ... thx for your response uponit7771 Feb 2016 #168

sorry if I was not clear. some of the things I have read here have been deliberately bettyellen Feb 2016 #171

Savvy. [nt] Jester Messiah Feb 2016 #192

There is ZERO problem ThePhilosopher04 Feb 2016 #17

So when African Americans criticize Sanders or his campaign ismnotwasm Feb 2016 #33

I'm underqualified to comment perhaps but I'll wade in this far. MrChuck Feb 2016 #101

Very well said MrChuck!! monicaangela Feb 2016 #111

Hey! You two are gonna harm your candidate Mike__M Feb 2016 #126

Oops! monicaangela Feb 2016 #130

How has Clinton fomented unfair criticism? If anything she's been fairly reserved just now hitting.. uponit7771 Feb 2016 #142

No further example is needed beyond this one. MrChuck Feb 2016 #164

I don't see how you answered the question at all, you addressed it but I don't see any concrete uponit7771 Feb 2016 #165

Its been in the news all day... MrChuck Feb 2016 #167

What's the "its" you're referring to? Criticism?! Clinton is supposed to address all the criticism s uponit7771 Feb 2016 #169

I bid you peace. MrChuck Feb 2016 #173

I have seen some interesting attempts lately to inject hatred toward white people bettyellen Feb 2016 #139

So this is black folks fault? tia uponit7771 Feb 2016 #144

Nope, I have seen people attributing words like "fuck white people" to Hill's campaign. bettyellen Feb 2016 #151

Sanders lost IA PoC by 25% after spending 3 months campaigning there... those PoC heard uponit7771 Feb 2016 #141

AA's on DU aren't all for Clinton. retrowire Feb 2016 #39

THANK YOU. KentuckyWoman Feb 2016 #59

You hardly speak for all PoC on this board nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #43

Strawman at best, never intimated in any way that I did and not even part of my reply uponit7771 Feb 2016 #145

Oh you have nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #156

I for the most part have been careful to use polling data and generalized statements about PoC uponit7771 Feb 2016 #160

You have nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #162

Divide. Divide. Divide. Divide. Divide. Do you not see what is being done here? Do you not see the Dont call me Shirley Feb 2016 #110

You mean by bashing Obama and then associating his campaign with vile racialized Obama bashers uponit7771 Feb 2016 #146

Are you speaking of Cornell West? Dont call me Shirley Feb 2016 #194

Do I even count as PoC if I'm only half-black? VulgarPoet Feb 2016 #2

Not unless you support Hillary. cali Feb 2016 #20

Nope, unless you openly support HRC nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #32

I am sorry you went through that rbrnmw Feb 2016 #58

what is insane is that even though we have screen caps nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #60

They aren't interested in the truth Hydra Feb 2016 #186

Nope, not enough. For example nadinbrezinski, a Mexican Jewish woman Arazi Feb 2016 #37

That's not a very nice thing to say. ismnotwasm Feb 2016 #41

shrug. The poster asked. Its easily verifiable, ask Nadin Arazi Feb 2016 #50

and some of us do not support any candidate openly nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #56

That quite the rationalization you have going there ismnotwasm Feb 2016 #63

Given that you were at the center of that discussion off site nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #55

Thank you, you are very kind. ismnotwasm Feb 2016 #65

Keep it nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #67

Sure ismnotwasm Feb 2016 #72

I think we'd all like to see that LondonReign2 Feb 2016 #82

Are you referring to me? ismnotwasm Feb 2016 #85

I presume nadin was referring to you LondonReign2 Feb 2016 #87

Ok you're right ismnotwasm Feb 2016 #91

Well you made the list nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #114

I am not a partisan nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #93

Hookay... ismnotwasm Feb 2016 #96

Well an apology and some self reflection nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #115

That's an awesome word. ismnotwasm Feb 2016 #120

You do nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #121

What, exactly, are you talking about? ismnotwasm Feb 2016 #128

Nope nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #129

Thanks - needed to be shown. 840high Feb 2016 #99

You welcome nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #119

I was referring to the person making those posts as a partisan, not you LondonReign2 Feb 2016 #152

Sorry for misunderstand f. nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #154

Just awful. The anti-semitic ones were grotesque - Money Goldbricks etc Arazi Feb 2016 #159

It will not be long nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #163

I don't see the posters name on that screenshot rbrnmw Feb 2016 #179

She did that at the OTHER SITE nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #180

again I'm sorry if someone used antisemitic slurs toward you rbrnmw Feb 2016 #181

I wish it was antisemitism nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #183

I take people at their word rbrnmw Feb 2016 #187

Very very true nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #188

It also left the impression that he met the Clintons DURING his Civil Rights involvement. arcane1 Feb 2016 #3

This is confusing to me dragonfly301 Feb 2016 #8

He deliberately phrased it to give that impression. In essence, he lied n/t arcane1 Feb 2016 #12

I guess that's why google dragonfly301 Feb 2016 #16

It's hard to see it as truthful. It fits the definition of artful smear. cali Feb 2016 #25

There's no other reason to say he met them in the same paragraph as not meeting Sanders. arcane1 Feb 2016 #28

Absolutely! Dustlawyer Feb 2016 #64

John Lewis very careful said he had met the Clintons. He did not say when Autumn Feb 2016 #35

I will probably grudgingly hold my nose a vote for her dragonfly301 Feb 2016 #42

Why would he compromise his own reputation to mislead or lie? Kittycat Feb 2016 #78

Maybe he didn't want to play the reporters game. Autumn Feb 2016 #89

I caught that, too. Blue_In_AK Feb 2016 #88

He met them when Bill Clinton was 29, before he went into politics. So they've been pnwmom Feb 2016 #106

dunno ... GeorgeGist Feb 2016 #158

Every governor in America was at that shindig. MADem Feb 2016 #190

So 1975, 76. John Lewis is a member of the Progressive Caucus along with Bernie Sanders who chaired Bluenorthwest Feb 2016 #170

1968 she interned at the House Republican Conference and worked Rockefeller (R) campaign for prez. ieoeja Feb 2016 #53

I grew up in Albany, NY dragonfly301 Feb 2016 #57

No she was not a registered Republican until 1968! OKNancy Feb 2016 #125

In 1968 she was working for Sen. Gene McCarthy, an anti war candidate, just as I was. In 1968.... Hekate Feb 2016 #138

He met the Clintons during the mid-70's. Wasn't the Civil Rights movement still going on? nt pnwmom Feb 2016 #84

I would say the Civil Rights Movement dragonfly301 Feb 2016 #95

I would agree, but the poster I was responding to apparently thinks it ended in the 60's. n/t pnwmom Feb 2016 #102

Only if you want to see it that way in order to attack John Lewis. Everyone can clearly see.... George II Feb 2016 #112

"Have we really reached a place"... NaturalHigh Feb 2016 #4

Why do you think they want a woman so bad. n/t Skwmom Feb 2016 #5

Desperate circumstamces call for extreme measures. guillaumeb Feb 2016 #6

That's how I read them too. n/t Jefferson23 Feb 2016 #11

I'm the one who said hero and not a saint. Punkingal Feb 2016 #13

It's a very good point. Thank you. cali Feb 2016 #27

The fact that you think that saying he never saw Sanders in the 1960s is an "attack" speaks volumes Empowerer Feb 2016 #14

It was clearly an attack. Period cali Feb 2016 #29

Though Mr. Lewis employed questionable innuendo... gregcrawford Feb 2016 #107

Of course it's an attack. A backhanded one at that ThePhilosopher04 Feb 2016 #31

Are you not familiar with what an "implication" is? nt retrowire Feb 2016 #45

Right? ismnotwasm Feb 2016 #47

This is like claiming John Kerry didn't earn his medals. Spitfire of ATJ Feb 2016 #75

No it's not. The Swiftboaters were lying. John Lewis is telling the truth. Empowerer Feb 2016 #76

Hillary's supporters are jumping on his comments to call Bernie a liar. Spitfire of ATJ Feb 2016 #94

I haven't seen anyone call Bernie a liar. Empowerer Feb 2016 #98

Here is what they're saying... Spitfire of ATJ Feb 2016 #100

It's definitely noteworthy. What it tells me, I cannot say. NurseJackie Feb 2016 #109

I gotta wonder what are the internal polls within the Clinton campaign? nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #18

My 18 yo facebook messages me from college dragonfly301 Feb 2016 #49

that should be interesting nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #51

interestingly when Andy Young sided with WalMart there was no defensive reaction MisterP Feb 2016 #19

Interesting. H2O Man Feb 2016 #21

It leaves the impression, particularly with those who don't know cali Feb 2016 #36

Oh, I definitely H2O Man Feb 2016 #54

Well, time for another donation padfun Feb 2016 #153

Unless I am reading the quote incorrectly, does it not also imply that both Bill and Hillary Clinton Dragonfli Feb 2016 #71

Right. H2O Man Feb 2016 #149

Me too, he is a hero of mine, since we know Bill and Hill did no such thing Dragonfli Feb 2016 #155

That is so true. Many of us were active in one way or the jwirr Feb 2016 #134

Put simply... deathrind Feb 2016 #34

DU reached that place about 8 years ago. This isn't new. nt MadDAsHell Feb 2016 #40

Actually, what we've reached is the side of the bus. It doesn't matter who it is... cherokeeprogressive Feb 2016 #44

Yeah, heaven forbid we criticize an endorsement of a person that we don't approve of. nt retrowire Feb 2016 #46

I saw something somewhere Mike__M Feb 2016 #143

... nc4bo Feb 2016 #48

John Lewis' legacy can weather this. fbc Feb 2016 #62

I wouldn't worry about Lewis Capt. Obvious Feb 2016 #66

Ouch. jwirr Feb 2016 #136

What's a PoC? aintitfunny Feb 2016 #68

Person of Color nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #70

Thank you, didn't arrive at that one. aintitfunny Feb 2016 #122

I see this as part of the pattern of the Clinton's use of surrogates.... Spitfire of ATJ Feb 2016 #74

Wow - you probably have no idea how patronizing and condescending you sound Empowerer Feb 2016 #77

Actually, I'm looking at the DELIGHT of Hillary supporters when they get some ammo. Spitfire of ATJ Feb 2016 #92

He isn't so much being "used" Gore1FL Feb 2016 #118

Cali, I respect John Lewis also. I can not speak to his motivations, but it is politics and politics LiberalArkie Feb 2016 #79

No. NCTraveler Feb 2016 #80

Love this pic from the 50th Anniversary of the march on Selma. PonyUp Feb 2016 #81

I'm sure Hillary wanted to be there but she probably had an important speech to LondonReign2 Feb 2016 #90

Nice. 840high Feb 2016 #105

well if she's pushing Ted Nugent Anti Semitic crap it'll get lower :( PatrynXX Feb 2016 #83

REALLY?? MFM008 Feb 2016 #86

You go to the polls with the voters you have, not the voters you would ideally have. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Feb 2016 #172

I doubt that MLK or John Lewis noticed me when I worked for civil rights in L.A. Tierra_y_Libertad Feb 2016 #97

John Lewis is pro-private prison and was pushed to support Obama over Clinton by his constituents. w4rma Feb 2016 #103

I believe your assumption monicaangela Feb 2016 #104

You say you respect John Lewis enormously but then accuse him of being Hillary's puppet. Justice Feb 2016 #108

Hillary Clinton didn't "employ" John Lewis to say what he said. He spoke from HIS heart.... George II Feb 2016 #113

He didn't attack bernie. He said he didn't know him then. Gore1FL Feb 2016 #116

Thank you because THAT makes sense. jwirr Feb 2016 #140

Well documented? Gman Feb 2016 #117

DC is a network of favors and influence. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2016 #123

And this... Is the thread winner nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #127

Bernie DID say he expected the kitchen sink thrown at him soon. Also, I was at the 1963 March FailureToCommunicate Feb 2016 #124

The majority of the CBC nyabingi Feb 2016 #132

. UglyGreed Feb 2016 #133

He implied that Bill & Hillary were marching at that time Merryland Feb 2016 #135

a bit off topic, but I wish my dad was still alive tularetom Feb 2016 #137

THe POC phrase was started and spread Erich Bloodaxe BSN Feb 2016 #174

I totally get that, but having said that tularetom Feb 2016 #175

Shrug. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Feb 2016 #177

I think thats sort of my point tularetom Feb 2016 #178

You are not the first one to ask that question... Fumesucker Feb 2016 #182

I swear on all that is holy tularetom Feb 2016 #189

Glad you enjoyed it.. Fumesucker Feb 2016 #191

That is one of the strangest semantic shifts I have seen in years nadinbrzezinski Feb 2016 #184

There is a special place in hell for any progressive who takes issue with opinions from POC LittleBlue Feb 2016 #148

WTF!!! quickesst Feb 2016 #150

To say that Hillary is "controlling" John Lewis is pretty insulting AND silly. kerry-is-my-prez Feb 2016 #157

Keep it going........ Beacool Feb 2016 #176

It's like the Clinton campaign had to stop thinking about winning the general election Babel_17 Feb 2016 #193

I had a post hidden today because I dared to even suggest that John Lewis may have experienced TBI.. frylock Feb 2016 #195