2016 Postmortem

bettyellen

(47,209 posts)

74. Well the guys who told me this have been following Sanders for many years.....

Mon Feb 22, 2016, 01:37 AM

Feb 2016

and they were sort of stunned to think anyone would find this approach alienating. And one immediately pointed to some figures of how they expected to win, and it was calculated without POC, and with former Dems and Indies.
It was always part of the strategy, and discussion. I remember people here confirming it was not just my friends doing that exact math.

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The African American vote in the Democratic party has the same power as the Evangelical vote in the [View all] Yavin4 Feb 2016 OP

agree mgmaggiemg Feb 2016 #1

Evangelicals make up ~50% of primary voters in GOP kcjohn1 Feb 2016 #3

It's the same impact in key states Yavin4 Feb 2016 #8

It is not kcjohn1 Feb 2016 #15

I wouldn't want a revolution without African Americans and Latinos on my side en masse. Starry Messenger Feb 2016 #2

Last time Latinos were on Clintons side kcjohn1 Feb 2016 #4

And the most progressive candidate will always be the most anti-racist candidate. Ken Burch Feb 2016 #39

Revolution? trillion Feb 2016 #71

that's all well and good but is it enough to win the GE? azurnoir Feb 2016 #5

As they say in sports, you have to make the playoffs to win the championship Yavin4 Feb 2016 #6

non sequitur is it enough to win her the GE? azurnoir Feb 2016 #7

No. It's not. But any Dem running for president needs a strong AA turnout. Yavin4 Feb 2016 #9

oh so there's a formula now okay so you're condident she'll win the GE I take it? azurnoir Feb 2016 #10

You didn't know that campaigns run all of these stats from past elections and try to get stevenleser Feb 2016 #19

need and get are 2 very different things azurnoir Feb 2016 #26

I'm a woman and she doesn't get me. trillion Feb 2016 #93

No Dem can win without it. Kaleva Feb 2016 #20

is it enough? was it for Kerry? azurnoir Feb 2016 #24

Let's not minimalize the black vote. It's not liberal or progessive behavior. trillion Feb 2016 #75

Thank you for that bravenak Feb 2016 #76

it's not minimizing to ask a question where the answer could be an inconvenient truth azurnoir Feb 2016 #79

Okay. But it seems demeaning. trillion Feb 2016 #82

because Hillary's super pac wasn't the subject of the thread and my comment wasn't demeaning azurnoir Feb 2016 #85

I think everybody understood what you were saying the first time. trillion Feb 2016 #96

hyperbole much I actually agreed with the premise of the thread azurnoir Feb 2016 #100

I don't "prove" my liberalism. I stand on it. trillion Feb 2016 #107

I am sorry that simple facts offend you perhaps that offense would be nbetter spent on the candidate azurnoir Feb 2016 #109

The last two democratic presidents vdogg Feb 2016 #154

My point was the difference between the primaries and the GE you speak of this as if it were 1 man azurnoir Feb 2016 #162

Whites tend to vote Repub. Even in California. Kaleva Feb 2016 #165

when it comes to GE aggregate stats don't matter much the electoral collage sadly does azurnoir Feb 2016 #166

They should get a lot more than they have artislife Feb 2016 #11

You assume Sanders got in believing he could win firebrand80 Feb 2016 #12

He wanted to keep the right from framing the conversation in this election Matariki Feb 2016 #17

Naivete has nothing to do with it Jarqui Feb 2016 #13

most likely it's about electability woolldog Feb 2016 #30

Most likely they are scared of the Clinton's corporate money. (nt) w4rma Feb 2016 #81

I don't see it as fear, I see it as resolve. joshcryer Feb 2016 #112

Do you know what demographic has the greatest challenge getting into politics? Fumesucker Feb 2016 #123

Yeah... joshcryer Feb 2016 #125

One of my kids married into a local political family Fumesucker Feb 2016 #130

Plutocracy in action. joshcryer Feb 2016 #131

Great response Josh. PragmaticLiberal Feb 2016 #161

Keith Ellison endorses Bernie brentspeak Feb 2016 #14

1 out of 5 black voters support Bernie Sanders... That's millions of invisible people Cheese Sandwich Feb 2016 #59

It is classic identity politics -- you are a racist/sexist if you don't have the right coalition JonLeibowitz Feb 2016 #116

Then he'll have no problem Saturday in South Carolina? brooklynite Feb 2016 #153

No he's gonna get his ass kicked in South Carolina. Hillary will get like 80% Cheese Sandwich Feb 2016 #156

Most elected officials are part of the establishment... HooptieWagon Feb 2016 #16

He did try. But black people just aren't that into Bernie Sanders. They like Hillary better. Cheese Sandwich Feb 2016 #18

he hasn't formed the relationships with the black community over the past several decades geek tragedy Feb 2016 #21

Black people sure do love Hillary Clinton for some reason. Just look at the polls. Cheese Sandwich Feb 2016 #22

I don't think it's love, but I can't speak for them. geek tragedy Feb 2016 #23

Probably she is seen as more electable and a known thing. Cheese Sandwich Feb 2016 #27

pretty much. Bernie Sanders is a nice guy who means what he says and means well. geek tragedy Feb 2016 #28

More likely she is seen ... NanceGreggs Feb 2016 #68

Most of the people I talk with think electability is a top issue. Cheese Sandwich Feb 2016 #72

Electability is always a top issue. NanceGreggs Feb 2016 #80

Except Clinton is absolutely unelectable. People dislike her the more they get to know her. w4rma Feb 2016 #83

Yeah. NanceGreggs Feb 2016 #94

Clinton supporters are whistling past their graveyard. w4rma Feb 2016 #97

This message was self-deleted by its author CobaltBlue Feb 2016 #91

It is a bit of the which came first: the chicken or the egg problem Jarqui Feb 2016 #32

Obama knew how to reach that community, having been part of it himself. geek tragedy Feb 2016 #33

We've had kind of the opposite thing that went against Bernie in this contest: Jarqui Feb 2016 #34

I think it's more that Lewis has strong ties to the Clintons. geek tragedy Feb 2016 #35

Agreed. But the blacks largely seem to vote as a block Jarqui Feb 2016 #49

It's the same as it always is: Corporatist vs. Populist. Follow the money. w4rma Feb 2016 #84

Perfect! Could not have state it any better, my friend. :) Liberal_Stalwart71 Feb 2016 #55

Message auto-removed Name removed Feb 2016 #128

She has it locked up thanks solely to Bill Clinton brentspeak Feb 2016 #25

actually, Hillary is liked much more than Bill is. Hillary is the one that introducted Bill JI7 Feb 2016 #47

THANK YOU bravenak Feb 2016 #54

he had to do a lot more than he has done, Obama did a lot more and started much earlier also JI7 Feb 2016 #46

Go ahead. Divide and conquer. And the GOP will conquer us. Armstead Feb 2016 #29

Divide and conquer sounds like "Don't make me uncomfortable" vs what is really happening uponit7771 Feb 2016 #37

NO it sounds like divide the electorate into little groups instead of trying to build.... Armstead Feb 2016 #38

Sanders associating his campaign with someone who call Obama "n-word-izzed" .... uponit7771 Feb 2016 #42

NO aside from his differences with Obama, West has been very much in line with AA concerns Armstead Feb 2016 #44

Armstead, the "n-word-izzed" label from West was the nice stuff. PoC like Obama, continuing his uponit7771 Feb 2016 #48

Just take "yes" for an answer and move on Armstead Feb 2016 #50

Associating himself with West who bashed Obama from Day #1, and it was personal. Liberal_Stalwart71 Feb 2016 #56

Jesus K Rist -- How many times does it take to say something simple? Armstead Feb 2016 #58

Armstead, YES HE DID call for a primary more than once!!! It is well documented and it wasn't .... uponit7771 Feb 2016 #126

It's not a good look. Liberal_Stalwart71 Feb 2016 #132

Why is pointing out a critical flaw in campaign strategy always challenged as "divide and conquer"? brooklynite Feb 2016 #151

Because it has been cast in those terms from the beginning, and not accidentally Armstead Feb 2016 #155

Sanders was unknown to EVERYONE... brooklynite Feb 2016 #157

He is steadily gaining support against a campaign of demionization Armstead Feb 2016 #159

"Steadily gaining support" brooklynite Feb 2016 #160

Time and logistics Armstead Feb 2016 #163

Sanders is indeed a good man...and Clinton is a good woman brooklynite Feb 2016 #164

You are correct noretreatnosurrender Feb 2016 #31

Sanders had Cornell West, I mean... doesn't West qualify as at least prominent?! tia uponit7771 Feb 2016 #36

Why are you so obsessed with Dr. West? Ken Burch Feb 2016 #40

You'll soon find out... sigh uponit7771 Feb 2016 #41

You're saying that Bernie has to ditch Dr. West before he can get AA votes? Ken Burch Feb 2016 #43

No, Sanders should cling to West ... who called Obama "n-word-izzed"... while Clinton uponit7771 Feb 2016 #45

To be honest, its all he could get as far as "prominent support" nt LexVegas Feb 2016 #51

Wrong he's had a lot of prominent people come out for him and your dis of West is offensive. trillion Feb 2016 #73

Hopefully, West is petulant at best...he's not the guy I would want around my campaign uponit7771 Feb 2016 #122

West is an opportunistic blowhard. giftedgirl77 Feb 2016 #129

So basically, are you saying because Sanders doesn't court the black vote he can't have it? trillion Feb 2016 #86

Establishing a relationship well before votes are needed isn't "courting" and I'll vote for HRC uponit7771 Feb 2016 #124

Actually, you're not standing up to anything Hillary has done here. trillion Feb 2016 #142

The first part of this retort was full of unneeded ad homs.. Sanders can throw no stones, NONE... uponit7771 Feb 2016 #147

I appologize. On re reading my post, it was hominems uncalled for. trillion Feb 2016 #148

I do, Hillary... IMHO... is NOT the same person she was 8 years ago. I can understand someone uponit7771 Feb 2016 #149

I have to google him on that. trillion Feb 2016 #150

There are many different types of establishments ... on of them being power structure... uponit7771 Feb 2016 #152

I wouldn't bet on that rbrnmw Feb 2016 #66

Early on people were often doing the calculus to win it without. Indies were to replace them. bettyellen Feb 2016 #52

Yep. Taking black voters for granted is a losing strategy. For some reason, many people cannot Liberal_Stalwart71 Feb 2016 #57

I was surprised people thought getting back old dems and indies was more important.... bettyellen Feb 2016 #60

More divide and conquer bullshit Armstead Feb 2016 #61

I am relaying conversation I had with friends who were early and staunch Sanders supporters. bettyellen Feb 2016 #62

SBS has a history of not playing into the hands of the GOP Armstead Feb 2016 #63

Oh I know the reasoning- but down playing his support for some to widen his base to gain more social bettyellen Feb 2016 #67

I disagree totally...but burning the midnight oil for work Armstead Feb 2016 #69

Well the guys who told me this have been following Sanders for many years..... bettyellen Feb 2016 #74

which of course means that was the strategy Bernie was following.... JonLeibowitz Feb 2016 #119

that is what I am talking about- his historical avoidance of "wedge issues" bettyellen Feb 2016 #120

No my point is you projected what a few people were talking about onto his campaign strategy JonLeibowitz Feb 2016 #121

well except for him (and fans) actually avoiding racism issues and pivoting to economics instead bettyellen Feb 2016 #170

I agree bravenak Feb 2016 #53

Bernie has been fighting hard for their vote jfern Feb 2016 #64

Yes. And he hasn't kept running to them and lying to them. trillion Feb 2016 #77

Which means they also have the power to sink it AgingAmerican Feb 2016 #65

Which they have done exactly never nt geek tragedy Feb 2016 #87

Hillary AgingAmerican Feb 2016 #88

So you've already started to blame a 2016 loss on black people geek tragedy Feb 2016 #89

A small subset of AAs are hellbent on ruining Sanders campaign AgingAmerican Feb 2016 #90

Racial scapegoating: not just for Trump voters geek tragedy Feb 2016 #92

They openly brag about it AgingAmerican Feb 2016 #95

Many white people show their true feelings towards African-Americans when geek tragedy Feb 2016 #98

Blah blah blah AgingAmerican Feb 2016 #102

You outed yourself as someone nakedly hostile to black people geek tragedy Feb 2016 #104

It's election math AgingAmerican Feb 2016 #105

People can read what you wrote, you know? geek tragedy Feb 2016 #108

And you cannot refute it AgingAmerican Feb 2016 #110

You're the one who's preemptively blaming black people geek tragedy Feb 2016 #111

This message was self-deleted by its author Matt_R Feb 2016 #133

This message was self-deleted by its author geek tragedy Feb 2016 #134

This message was self-deleted by its author Matt_R Feb 2016 #136

This message was self-deleted by its author geek tragedy Feb 2016 #137

This message was self-deleted by its author Matt_R Feb 2016 #138

This message was self-deleted by its author geek tragedy Feb 2016 #139

I misread. I apologize. Matt_R Feb 2016 #140

Peace nt geek tragedy Feb 2016 #141

so the majority of white people who vote Republican are not to blame ? JI7 Feb 2016 #113

Notice how they characterize black folks exercising independent judgment as geek tragedy Feb 2016 #114

Forcing Hillary down the throats of Democrats, yes AgingAmerican Feb 2016 #144

black voters are NOT forcing Hillary down anyone's throat geek tragedy Feb 2016 #145

For a small subset of AAs trying to sink Sanders campaign? AgingAmerican Feb 2016 #143

so you think the 5-10 pro-Hillary black people at DU are going geek tragedy Feb 2016 #146

So, hang on. snot Feb 2016 #118

1/2 the Blacks are voting for Bernie in South Carolina in the last poll I saw. trillion Feb 2016 #70

I don't know what polls you've been looking at. Hillary is beating Sanders by something like Number23 Feb 2016 #115

The AA vote is the most reliable bloc for any party, period. joshcryer Feb 2016 #78

Did you see the Jesse Helms impersonation up thread? nt geek tragedy Feb 2016 #99

Didn't read the whole thing. joshcryer Feb 2016 #103

might as well. geek tragedy Feb 2016 #106

I have to agree. I find the dismissive comments on the black vote to be offensive and wrong. trillion Feb 2016 #101

But he did have a prominent black supporter. Keith Ellison. But for some reason he appears to have Number23 Feb 2016 #117

Keith Ellison is a very high quality proxy to deploy. geek tragedy Feb 2016 #158

As much as I like Ben Jealous I still think that Ellison would have been a much better Number23 Feb 2016 #167

Message auto-removed Name removed Feb 2016 #127

Good analysis Gothmog Feb 2016 #135

I actually agree that forjusticethunders Feb 2016 #168

Danny Glover, Michelle Alexander, Ta-Nehisi Coates intheflow Feb 2016 #169