2016 Postmortem

ancianita

(43,366 posts)

119. That's defeatism. Right now we've got a foot in the door and we need to open it and go through.

Fri Jun 3, 2016, 11:48 AM

Jun 2016

If everyone here keeps wailing about how cockblocked we are, then they're giving the perfectionist's perrennial excuse to do nothing.

That's unacceptable.

Progressives actually be good by doing good in spite of conditions, rather than waiting for conditions to be most opportune.

Conditions will never be right or opportune for progressives. The space for political change potential from Bernie's efforts are the best we're going to have.

We have to act with downticket, personal citizen activism.

Or progressives aren't serious. Just posers.

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How do Progressives work for change in a Clinton presidency? [View all] Prism Jun 2016 OP

There is none. The PTB Do Not Want Progressives who actually think libdem4life Jun 2016 #1

If You Try And Define The "Phenomenon," The Term Is FASCISM! CorporatistNation Jun 2016 #109

I have asked before, but got no real answer - What exactly separates a progressive and a Democrat? tonyt53 Jun 2016 #2

Oh god, a lot Prism Jun 2016 #9

2004? This is 2016. Sounds very much like you are only concerned about a single issue. tonyt53 Jun 2016 #14

Prism just wants a pony. QC Jun 2016 #28

This message was self-deleted by its author TM99 Jun 2016 #51

And THIS TOO ^^^^^10000% 2banon Jun 2016 #81

sounds like you carry some hostility regarding his "single issue." ruggerson Jun 2016 #54

Good to see you again! n/t QC Jun 2016 #79

you too ruggerson Jun 2016 #100

no, single issue is a trap, but we have to acknowledge LGBT did succeed swiftly larkrake Jun 2016 #56

You cannot be that dense nadinbrzezinski Jun 2016 #59

Yes he can Doctor_J Jun 2016 #80

because 3rd way is in control of the Party today larkrake Jun 2016 #52

This!^^^^^^10000! 2banon Jun 2016 #76

A Democrat is something than anyone can call himself/herself Doctor_J Jun 2016 #40

OMG you do it the way Americans have been doing it for over MyNameGoesHere Jun 2016 #3

Was there an answer in all that? Prism Jun 2016 #7

If you need an answer you are lost already. MyNameGoesHere Jun 2016 #8

So . . . no answer then Prism Jun 2016 #12

"...don't whine about it." I think was your answer Ned_Devine Jun 2016 #27

Absolutely Prism Jun 2016 #30

A "Clinton presidency" will mean "more of the same"... KansDem Jun 2016 #4

Same way they would in a Sanders administration. nt Jitter65 Jun 2016 #5

I doubt a Sanders administration would mess with progressives in primaries Prism Jun 2016 #6

Sanders wouldn't need to be pulled kicking and screaming... TCJ70 Jun 2016 #10

. Doctor_J Jun 2016 #39

Between now and the convention, you will see whether progressives can work inside the party to Attorney in Texas Jun 2016 #11

We're in the same boat Prism Jun 2016 #13

Hillary has a choice: unite and embrace the progressives or ignore the left and embrace centrists. Attorney in Texas Jun 2016 #24

I very, very much agree with your sentiment Prism Jun 2016 #31

Fear of Trump is - at the moment - the only arrow in her quiver. I don't see that having any effect Attorney in Texas Jun 2016 #37

We're rowing in the same direction Prism Jun 2016 #44

I prefer Loretta Sanchez and I will keep my reasons to myself nadinbrzezinski Jun 2016 #88

I voted Sanchez but I think I regret that now. She dissed Liz Warren today. JonLeibowitz Jun 2016 #95

Harris will be on the ballot nadinbrzezinski Jun 2016 #99

This election is not normal nadinbrzezinski Jun 2016 #87

I disagree. Hillary's calculus will be much easier. BillZBubb Jun 2016 #111

"Offering free stuff to gullible people" no less, QC Jun 2016 #29

Shush, you communist Prism Jun 2016 #32

As a matter of fact I did get a cake! QC Jun 2016 #33

We are all, definitely, on lists... Ghost Dog Jun 2016 #41

I should FOIA my FBI file just for shits and giggles nadinbrzezinski Jun 2016 #93

is this sarcasm? larkrake Jun 2016 #86

Sadly, no. QC Jun 2016 #94

So my little diddy after the Eisenhower group nadinbrzezinski Jun 2016 #91

absolutely- is the Party too corrupted? I suspect so larkrake Jun 2016 #58

I have a simplistic outlook on this question. cheapdate Jun 2016 #15

I don't think your view is simplistic at all Prism Jun 2016 #17

I sooooo agree with this post! auntpurl Jun 2016 #23

I kind of like Obama's first term. Obamacare, the stimulus, Dodd/Frank, Sotomayer&Kagan. StevieM Jun 2016 #16

Just one example Prism Jun 2016 #18

She supports a $12 federal minimum wage, which is more than any other recent StevieM Jun 2016 #22

No, they sure aren't. Mine either. I'm standing with you. tonyt53 Jun 2016 #26

I think Obama is a liberal at heart Prism Jun 2016 #34

As I said, I cannot even begin to imagine that Hillary's Supreme Court appointments StevieM Jun 2016 #47

Please clarify. floriduck Jun 2016 #42

The nominee is the candidate who is officially chosen by the party. In other words, StevieM Jun 2016 #46

Got it. Thanks. floriduck Jun 2016 #49

Pretty sure. he joined the party because libdem4life Jun 2016 #118

no, she will give is corp friendly and global trade judges larkrake Jun 2016 #61

As I have said, I find it unimaginable that her judges will be any different than the ones StevieM Jun 2016 #65

Sadly - yes. 840high Jun 2016 #96

Petitions will at least garner a response. randome Jun 2016 #19

Closed primaries are also a trick Prism Jun 2016 #21

Eh. I think there's legitimate opinion on both sides of closed primaries. randome Jun 2016 #25

I get your point but it becomes a double edged sword. floriduck Jun 2016 #43

But there's a large population of liberals who couldn't participate Prism Jun 2016 #48

But if he wants to vote Democratic, why not be part of the Democratic Party? randome Jun 2016 #50

You cannot commit to a Party that has taken a right turn away from the ideals larkrake Jun 2016 #105

Primaries should include non party folk larkrake Jun 2016 #83

That's exactly it, Prism. Waiting For Everyman Jun 2016 #20

Prism and others, I have a reading recommendation. Garrett78 Jun 2016 #35

By being brought to heel. hobbit709 Jun 2016 #36

We don't. that's the point. The far right has won. Doctor_J Jun 2016 #38

We HAVE to build new progressive infrastructure dreamnightwind Jun 2016 #45

Organizing is the only way, like herding cats? larkrake Jun 2016 #64

We have shown that, given leadership, we can organize dreamnightwind Jun 2016 #69

Thats why I adore Bernie, he has been very smart with this movement larkrake Jun 2016 #73

Her approach is a hawkish foreign policy and domestically incrementalism. EndElectoral Jun 2016 #53

true. She is going to stress foreign policy and totally ignore infrastructure larkrake Jun 2016 #66

Progressives need to find races where the Repub has no opponent and run in those races. LonePirate Jun 2016 #55

a Smart theory larkrake Jun 2016 #71

I hope to see less of what I saw with Obama. Maedhros Jun 2016 #57

Here is my two cents lmbradford Jun 2016 #60

does VP have any power? and will Hill weigh his opinion at all? larkrake Jun 2016 #67

Hillary's running mate will be another conservative, possibly a republican Doctor_J Jun 2016 #77

there are mayors governors and many other local and state elections JI7 Jun 2016 #62

Im working on it in Colorado, Bernie's list really helps larkrake Jun 2016 #68

It really DOES start at the local level! Blaukraut Jun 2016 #63

then we work on enthusiasm larkrake Jun 2016 #70

I agree! But the enthusiasm has to extend to the unsexy local and state elections Blaukraut Jun 2016 #74

It is an honest question. Certainly not with Trump and Hill. Their negs are dismal larkrake Jun 2016 #78

But are Hillary's negs due to a bruising primary, in part? Blaukraut Jun 2016 #98

No, she has always had negative likability. Her attacks on trump larkrake Jun 2016 #112

The same way every other constituency works to accomplish their policy agenda ... 1StrongBlackMan Jun 2016 #72

I agree, pettyness isnt constructive larkrake Jun 2016 #75

Not when there is CRITICAL MASS of people ... 1StrongBlackMan Jun 2016 #101

as long as they fall in line, or they consider them "Fringe"I dont think they will see progressives larkrake Jun 2016 #114

This is exactly what I am talking about in Post #72. ... 1StrongBlackMan Jun 2016 #117

If you want better legislation, we need control of the House of Representatives. The House controls Agnosticsherbet Jun 2016 #82

and the funding larkrake Jun 2016 #84

All funding bills must be initiated by the House. It is in the Constitution. Agnosticsherbet Jun 2016 #89

thats what I just said larkrake Jun 2016 #106

can we do that in four years, statistically? larkrake Jun 2016 #85

From what I have read, the best chance of winning back the House will be after the 2020 Census. Agnosticsherbet Jun 2016 #90

I'm too cynical right now. I expect HRC vindictiveness to be insurmountable. aikoaiko Jun 2016 #92

I;'ve been wondering that myself. And the answer depresses me... Armstead Jun 2016 #97

Not acceptable. Bernie didn't lose unless progressives fail to go through that political door ancianita Jun 2016 #120

You make a false assumption about "perfectionists" Armstead Jun 2016 #124

Then I join Rebecca Solnit, Obama and others, who claim that "better" creates new leverage ancianita Jun 2016 #130

You don't.... Buddyblazon Jun 2016 #102

There is a group that can serve as a models/mentors ... the membership of the Progressive Caucus. 1StrongBlackMan Jun 2016 #103

web site? contact? larkrake Jun 2016 #107

For one thing -- and probably first off -- a progressive has to lead the party and the Senate. ancianita Jun 2016 #104

We cant involve the party, we would be undercut continually larkrake Jun 2016 #108

That's defeatism. Right now we've got a foot in the door and we need to open it and go through. ancianita Jun 2016 #119

I'm seeing that you have an up hill battle ... 1StrongBlackMan Jun 2016 #127

We all need to cultivate and support endurance.It's what has made the underdogs win in our history. ancianita Jun 2016 #132

Absolutely! You will not get a single argument from me ... 1StrongBlackMan Jun 2016 #136

You think we have a foot in the door? If so, I agree with you larkrake Jun 2016 #146

Being on the platform committee is a foot in the door. 3 - 4 Bernie demonstrations in Philadelphia ancianita Jun 2016 #148

Work. For coins. cherokeeprogressive Jun 2016 #110

My advice creeksneakers2 Jun 2016 #113

well put larkrake Jun 2016 #115

Good advice. ancianita Jun 2016 #134

By supporting a primary challenger in 2020, John Poet Jun 2016 #116

Wait for four to eight years. n/t leeroysphitz Jun 2016 #121

The only problem as we have seen from the campaign. There is no plan to be more liberal, the plan is Todays_Illusion Jun 2016 #122

By holding their feet to the fire. Tierra_y_Libertad Jun 2016 #123

And, what does that look like? ... 1StrongBlackMan Jun 2016 #131

I tell my senators, congresswoman, and the prez.. Tierra_y_Libertad Jun 2016 #135

Would the better, albeit, much more difficult, tact be ... 1StrongBlackMan Jun 2016 #138

Sounds good. Tierra_y_Libertad Jun 2016 #139

No ... No ... No ... 1StrongBlackMan Jun 2016 #141

Which results in the lesser candidate getting fewer votes. Tierra_y_Libertad Jun 2016 #142

You do understand that that "better" candidate doesn't just appear. right? ... 1StrongBlackMan Jun 2016 #143

I've grown very cynical about the value of politics as an agent of change. Tierra_y_Libertad Jun 2016 #144

Social movements errupt, only ... 1StrongBlackMan Jun 2016 #145

Vote in mid-term legislative elections. That's how. MineralMan Jun 2016 #125

And recognize that the 2018 legislative elections action clock ... 1StrongBlackMan Jun 2016 #129

Yup. It's too late for the 2016 legislative elections MineralMan Jun 2016 #133

Instant gratification ... nano-second society! ... 1StrongBlackMan Jun 2016 #137

its not too late for this year, and 2018 can be the turning point but not if Hill regrows hate for larkrake Jun 2016 #147

We don't work in the presidency, we'll be outside. portlander23 Jun 2016 #126

You don't vote for status quo expecting change. HooptieWagon Jun 2016 #128

CLinton has been pushing out Progressives since the 80's Ferd Berfel Jun 2016 #140

Her victory will be the final nails in the coffin for anything progressive 2banon Jun 2016 #149

the answer is a violation of the terms of service. yurbud Jun 2016 #150

Showing up to vote in the mid-term elections is a good start. LonePirate Jun 2016 #151

Bernie has opened the DOOR OF OPPORTUNITY for the progressive wing of the Dems to mobilize cloudythescribbler Jun 2016 #152