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creeksneakers2

(7,473 posts)
87. They got that from an International Business Times story that was full of holes.
Sat Jun 4, 2016, 01:38 AM
Jun 2016

First we have that Saudi Arabia did not donate while Hillary was secretary. They did before but no quid pro quo was possible because it wasn't known that she'd be secretary.

Arms deals are extremely complex and take up to seven years to complete. Most of the work is carried out under the Pentagon, not the State Department. You couldn't just sell one.

The Saudi Arms deal was a major initiative of the entire administration. It started under Bush but was expanded under Obama for two major reasons. First, it was expected to produce 50,000 or 75,000 jobs. This was at a time when the 2008 crash left the country with high unemployment and the arms jobs were among the few that could be produced. The administration also wanted to build a barrier to Iran. The Saudi deal was the largest arms sale ever. It was inconceivable that Hillary wouldn't approve it. Tying the approval to donations to a foundation the Clintons got no direct compensation from is far fetched. Its like a whole city being flooded by a hurricane and somebody saying the flood was caused by someone letting their faucet drip.

IBT found that countries that did not donate also saw an 80% increase in arms sales. That was because we needed the jobs. IBT shows a chart with donors getting bigger increases. But all those countries with the huge increases were all Saudi allies from the Gulf Cooperation Council. They were part of the same initiative to build the wall against Iran. What IBT tries to make look like a pattern is just a single initiative, that went all the way to the top, above Hillary.

The fact that Hillary criticized those countries shows she wasn't bought off, not that she approved the arms deal for any other reason than policy.

IBT tried to make the deal suspicious because the sales were made to Saudi despite their horrible human rights record. We've been making arms deals with Saudi for decades despite their record. They are our best customer.

IBT also tried to question the deal because they said Israel opposed it. That was misleading at best and a lie at worst. While Israel at first made tactical objections to the deal, the weapons systems they were most concerned about were eliminated from the deal. Israel was then promised weapons that were more sophisticated than the ones the Saudis got. Israel's objections were dropped before the deal was even announced and sent to Congress.

IBT also tried to cast suspicion by saying that a defense contractor made a large donation just before the deal was finalized. But the deal was already sent to Congress with Hillary's backing a year before that. Hillary couldn't have possibly approved because of the donation because she'd already backed the deal.

Mother Jones isn't a right wing publication but they are definitely in the tank for Bernie and are out to get the Clintons. The idea that the foundation is corrupt originates with the right wing. It makes no sense, because the Clintons got no income from the foundation. In fact, $15 million that they raised giving speeches was turned over to the foundation. Why would they commit crimes when there was nothing in it for them?

People who hate the Clintons just can't stand the truth, that the Clintons did something wonderful for the world based on their own benevolence. They are great people, not the monsters the Clinton haters pretend they are.

Unity is impossible because Bernie refuses to say it's necessary. CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #1
I posted the article GRhodes Jun 2016 #2
Well, how do you unite with a group that doesn't want to unite? CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #15
It isn't that people don't want to unite GRhodes Jun 2016 #23
You compromise, which is why it isn't happening CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #28
Compromise GRhodes Jun 2016 #30
You're saying the only path to unity is to adopt Bernie's entire platform. CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #32
I'm saying GRhodes Jun 2016 #34
You are, sadly, right. JDPriestly Jun 2016 #63
count me irrational Voice for Peace Jun 2016 #93
I think it's desperation. She has been a thorn in his side, but now it's libdem4life Jun 2016 #109
So then, you prefer losing in November to giving ground to Bernie. JDPriestly Jun 2016 #55
I thought the complaint was that Hillary has already co-opted too much of Bernie's message? CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #102
The problem is you seem to think it's "obvious corruption" for Bernie to lose elections. Lord Magus Jun 2016 #70
No GRhodes Jun 2016 #80
As a matter of fact the way the voting has taken place has benefited BERNIE. Lord Magus Jun 2016 #86
You make a good argument SpareribSP Jun 2016 #26
Four minutes...speed reader. libdem4life Jun 2016 #108
Democrats shouldn't expect to "unite" with people who've never been Democrats in the first place. baldguy Jun 2016 #14
Have you seen the large and growing GRhodes Jun 2016 #19
^^^ This ^^^ I do not understand those who label Jackilope Jun 2016 #103
Unity is impossible because WE don't share the same principles. Live and Learn Jun 2016 #44
It's not up to Bernie to say anything. basselope Jun 2016 #66
Then it's not up to Democrats to give him status in the Senate. Fair is fair, eh? CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #101
He was elected from Vermont and he's done a good job for his state libdem4life Jun 2016 #110
I mean his seniority. Only been a Dem a year. He's bottom of the ladder, right? CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #111
Did you forget that he's been caucusing with Progressive Dems for years? libdem4life Jun 2016 #114
They've been generous to give him rank. They don't have to, if he fights past the campaign's end. CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #115
Yes. Generous. How civil of Them. Maybe his values transcend his perks? libdem4life Jun 2016 #116
Don't really care much what the democrats do. basselope Jun 2016 #119
IT WOULD BE COMPLETELY HYPOCRITICAL FOR BERNIE TO ENDORSE AN AVOWED AND CAREER CORPORATIST CorporatistNation Jun 2016 #124
Trump will unite us. He already is uniting us. bravenak Jun 2016 #3
Yes GRhodes Jun 2016 #31
K&R!!! Nt riderinthestorm Jun 2016 #4
Got to love this poster. In this posters last paragraph, he/she suggests that Sanders stay in it Trust Buster Jun 2016 #5
Respect is earned GRhodes Jun 2016 #7
If you've missed the outrageous behavior of the Sanders supporters on this site, then you have Trust Buster Jun 2016 #11
I will say this again GRhodes Jun 2016 #17
In solidarity with your posts. Well spoken representation for so many of us here. JudyM Jun 2016 #25
Priviledge, that is what you are describing nadinbrzezinski Jun 2016 #47
Hillary's record = Haters. Progressive Point=TrumpTrumpTrumpTrump libdem4life Jun 2016 #113
Really. Extreme hyperbole redstateblues Jun 2016 #52
Bernie, Run Bernie Run Protalker Jun 2016 #6
Hardly out of the park... bonemachine Jun 2016 #16
And the sheriff is hot on her heels. BillZBubb Jun 2016 #48
65 MFM008 Jun 2016 #8
The article was GRhodes Jun 2016 #9
Another uniquely virtuous progressive creeksneakers2 Jun 2016 #64
Well, I think that some of us see Tal Vez Jun 2016 #10
I don't want anything that Clinton and Ryan want to inflict on the country, tyvm Doctor_J Jun 2016 #13
Well, I know that a negative attitude is sure to get me nothing. Tal Vez Jun 2016 #18
Can you cite GRhodes Jun 2016 #21
Of course I can cite lots of data showing growth since 1980. Tal Vez Jun 2016 #24
Who is denying growth? GRhodes Jun 2016 #29
Listen, things have gone well for me since 1980, Tal Vez Jun 2016 #33
"how could I begin to know what you mean by progress?" GRhodes Jun 2016 #37
I don't know about Krugman or some of the others that you describe as living atop something, Tal Vez Jun 2016 #43
"And, I know how the GOP feels about distributional issues." TimPlo Jun 2016 #38
Well, some of the issues that you raise are perpetual issues. Tal Vez Jun 2016 #46
Let me tell you what some of the folks locallyq nadinbrzezinski Jun 2016 #50
If I remember correctly, locally for you is somewhere in San Diego. Tal Vez Jun 2016 #56
I worked as a paramedic in TJ nadinbrzezinski Jun 2016 #58
I'll read that. Tal Vez Jun 2016 #60
Well, I did read that and I will have to read it again to understand it better. Tal Vez Jun 2016 #83
I will show up nadinbrzezinski Jun 2016 #84
Of course, you'll vote as you see fit. Tal Vez Jun 2016 #89
It is a complicated one nadinbrzezinski Jun 2016 #90
I'd like to see how your statistics are counted creeksneakers2 Jun 2016 #61
The stock market GRhodes Jun 2016 #79
When I brought up the stock market creeksneakers2 Jun 2016 #96
The stock market crashed GRhodes Jun 2016 #97
You'll opt for nothing then. Your fooling yourself if you think Hillary means progress. BillZBubb Jun 2016 #49
These factually baseless accusations are beyond tiresome. Lord Magus Jun 2016 #71
That hidden tape suggested that the Clintons do have some common ground with Ryan. raging moderate Jun 2016 #105
"And, it could very well be that a President Clinton can accomplish more." GRhodes Jun 2016 #20
I am going to vote for the Democratic nominee. Tal Vez Jun 2016 #22
That's just a platitude. Jester Messiah Jun 2016 #51
I don't know if you've yet noticed, Tal Vez Jun 2016 #57
That would be a protest vote. Jester Messiah Jun 2016 #59
Well, I acknowledge that any voting is better than none. Tal Vez Jun 2016 #62
Hillary and her supporters view her as the perpetual victim. Doctor_J Jun 2016 #12
one argument I heard was that the Secretary of State isn't involved in foreign relations MisterP Jun 2016 #35
Maybe the SoS from 2008-2012 TimPlo Jun 2016 #39
the Clintons very good at generating protectors who'll circle the wagons around them MisterP Jun 2016 #41
Actually I think GOP has helped her more than Hurt her. TimPlo Jun 2016 #42
There were no deals creeksneakers2 Jun 2016 #65
Yup no deals at all. motherjones is a RW news source now I guess? TimPlo Jun 2016 #69
No, they're just shamelessly latching on to RW smears. Lord Magus Jun 2016 #75
Yea you need to stop and think for a minute. TimPlo Jun 2016 #77
So nobody knew a year ago that the primary was going to happen? Lord Magus Jun 2016 #78
They got that from an International Business Times story that was full of holes. creeksneakers2 Jun 2016 #87
All those that lost their homes in the housing crash don't know how good the rhett o rick Jun 2016 #118
The Clintons had nothing to do with the housing crash creeksneakers2 Jun 2016 #122
LOL. Of course not. Keep telling yourself that. The got $150,000,000 because rhett o rick Jun 2016 #123
An argument you heard from your imaginary friend? Lord Magus Jun 2016 #67
actually with someone I worked with for 16 years and thought I knew MisterP Jun 2016 #72
Actually, I was accusing you of making up a straw man argument. Lord Magus Jun 2016 #74
Christ, were your parents brothers or something? MisterP Jun 2016 #76
Nice projection redstateblues Jun 2016 #54
I've long noticed that Republicans always act like any election they lose is illegitimate. Lord Magus Jun 2016 #68
DUrec PowerToThePeople Jun 2016 #27
K and R! bbgrunt Jun 2016 #36
Well said. seabeckind Jun 2016 #40
Bernie staying in to the end and the DNC will be revealed! B Calm Jun 2016 #45
It's really very easy. Buzz cook Jun 2016 #53
That article's pure straw man. Trashed. -nt- Lord Magus Jun 2016 #73
Hit too close to home, eh? GRhodes Jun 2016 #82
Not even close. Lord Magus Jun 2016 #85
Cool GRhodes Jun 2016 #92
Unity is only possible LoverOfLiberty Jun 2016 #81
The American people are the losers GRhodes Jun 2016 #88
You are projecting LoverOfLiberty Jun 2016 #91
Yes GRhodes Jun 2016 #94
She is absolutely more electable LoverOfLiberty Jun 2016 #95
Cool GRhodes Jun 2016 #98
Argumentum ad populum. seabeckind Jun 2016 #100
Hillary's taking millions in INCOME from TBTF banks that are corrupting our govt. think Jun 2016 #107
Thanks for this article and all your excellent responses!! xynthee Jun 2016 #99
Even though the Democratic Party does not wish to unite Zambero Jun 2016 #104
"Clinton’s allies disrespect too many, LWolf Jun 2016 #106
Terry Simons at Counterpunch has been urging Bernie to leave the Democrats and run Green Party oberliner Jun 2016 #112
Voting for the lesser evil still gets us evil. coyote Jun 2016 #117
We should all stay in the thing, and in every other thing. Orsino Jun 2016 #120
Why lump Reich with Krugman and Feinstein? Stevepol Jun 2016 #121
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