2016 Postmortem

Armstead

(47,803 posts)

11. Usually I'd not use those royal terms. But hypothetically....

Sat Jun 18, 2016, 10:40 AM

Jun 2016

If Jeb Bush had not screwed the pooch and if he had become the nominee...I feel fairly certain that here in DU it would be acceptable to refer to him as the latest in the Bush Line of Succession and the analogies to royal courts (and worse, like the Bush Crime Family) would be perfectly acceptable on DU.

Remember that GW Bush was often referred to as The Dauphin here, and no one thought anything of the term.

There are similarities in having one family and their backers in the WH for more then two terms.

Also.....

In the context of now -- what Sanders, and I and many supporters are afraid of is that the nomination of Clinton could mean that once again the same Inner Circle will run things unchallenged, and that it will be portrayed as "everyone but a small fringe left" accept and agree with everything they do.

Close to half the voters have a different perspective....AND a lot of people who voted for Clinton actually also agree with and prefer much of Sanders message and critiques and goals.

Further here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12512201394#post5

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I have a theory on why Sanders is not conceding or endorsing at this poinjt [View all] Armstead Jun 2016 OP

I thought he's Faux pas Jun 2016 #1

That too....But I'm looking at the political calculations involved. Armstead Jun 2016 #2

Have you ever seen a political convention? Tortmaster Jun 2016 #134

Except when he said he wouldn't run a negative campaign redstateblues Jun 2016 #4

Oh stop that crap...He did not run a "negative" campaign anymore than Clinton did Armstead Jun 2016 #7

Calling her unqualified is not negative? redstateblues Jun 2016 #63

Calling one unqualified lancer78 Jun 2016 #99

Like I said: Bernie is perfect. Mr Positivity. LOL redstateblues Jun 2016 #107

and much more 840high Jun 2016 #126

character assassination, questioning her judgment and calling her unqualified BlueStateLib Jun 2016 #117

If you are that delicate then I suggest you run away and hide for the next five months Armstead Jun 2016 #123

Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2016 #138

"Kiss her ring". Jesus Christ. randome Jun 2016 #3

And if Sanders just folds now, his issues disappear totally Armstead Jun 2016 #5

Who says he needs to fold? I LIKE his ideas! Most of us do! randome Jun 2016 #69

No he's the right guy....It requires a fighte,r whether one likes him personally or not Armstead Jun 2016 #79

You are wrong. Jakes Progress Jun 2016 #160

Just to correct the record -- He has excellent skills to get things done Armstead Jun 2016 #162

Sounds like thirty years ago he might have been a good mayor Jakes Progress Jun 2016 #170

His ideas getting taken seriously... tex-wyo-dem Jun 2016 #128

Why will his issues disappear? They are not his issues alone.Dems have been speaking to these issues glennward Jun 2016 #82

Democrats have been ignoring these issues for a long time Armstead Jun 2016 #84

Democrats over the last 30 years have given up on the approach you describe Armstead Jun 2016 #122

That's exactly your problem, you think of them as "his" issues. Lord Magus Jun 2016 #119

No but he is representing issues that the Democratic power structure has marginalized Armstead Jun 2016 #121

No, he really isn't. Lord Magus Jun 2016 #125

Not his alone...but this year in Democratic politics only Bernie's campaign raised most of them. Ken Burch Jun 2016 #131

Nice strawman you've got there. Lord Magus Jun 2016 #132

you don't fight fire with smaller fires tk2kewl Jun 2016 #8

Actually, your analogy is mistaken. Fire breaks are smaller fires to contain a raging one. randome Jun 2016 #68

a fire break contains a fire while it consumes all available fuel tk2kewl Jun 2016 #70

Its a process -- Step one was demonstrating that there is a significant desire for change... Armstead Jun 2016 #77

That's a theme with this particular poster. NurseJackie Jun 2016 #73

That particular poster gives respect to those who express themselves reasonably.... Armstead Jun 2016 #85

Respect? NurseJackie Jun 2016 #116

"talk with people instead of at them" That Guy 888 Jun 2016 #133

I'm okay with that. Baitball Blogger Jun 2016 #6

Not insecure about her winning, but fear some ugly invectives hurled at her by "Progressives" as bettyellen Jun 2016 #40

That doesn't explain the attacks on Bernie. Baitball Blogger Jun 2016 #46

Bernie continues to promote progressive views, which makes her look bad. arcane1 Jun 2016 #76

Wow. The pictures in that coloring book are suitable for ages 8 and under. Maru Kitteh Jun 2016 #89

Kind of like the reading level of your nonsense post. arcane1 Jun 2016 #101

You had no point. You had broad-brush, intellectually lazy Maru Kitteh Jun 2016 #102

Unlike the well-reasoned posts you put up in response? arcane1 Jun 2016 #103

+10 appalachiablue Jun 2016 #124

'aye 840high Jun 2016 #127

Seems reasonable to me. 1800+ people Hortensis Jun 2016 #9

Usually I'd not use those royal terms. But hypothetically.... Armstead Jun 2016 #11

Don't know where it came from, Hortensis Jun 2016 #17

I'd use the term "oligarchy" but that too is frowned on Armstead Jun 2016 #33

Oh? Hadn't noticed. Well, if one's describing Hortensis Jun 2016 #48

Oligarchs, unfortunately, don't much care about cookies Armstead Jun 2016 #51

True. But if they're to be taken seriously, Hortensis Jun 2016 #54

This has been the first time "oligarch" has been referred to in mainstream politics... Armstead Jun 2016 #59

Well, we can certainly agree that the Hortensis Jun 2016 #67

Pretty good theory. emulatorloo Jun 2016 #10

In response.... Armstead Jun 2016 #14

He'll cost himself a primetime speaking slot for symbolism? Wouldn't the speech be more effective? CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #12

It would look (and be) petty to deny him a speaking slot on that basis, and ..... Armstead Jun 2016 #13

It's petty not to concede obvious defeat. I agree with Rendell. Active candidates don't speak. CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #15

If Bernie concedes and endorses her after the vote but during the convention? Armstead Jun 2016 #16

The convention is a tightly scripted thing. SaschaHM Jun 2016 #20

That'd be boring as hell Armstead Jun 2016 #28

Primetime is one hour a night on the networks. CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #39

I'm not going to debate all of the intri8cies Armstead Jun 2016 #44

What adjustment? You can't bump Hillary or her VP to make room for Bernie. CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #58

There are ways...This is rigid thinking tghat has dominated the primaries Armstead Jun 2016 #61

Do you realize what duplicitous bs it is to say "vote for me" and "I support her" at the same time? CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #66

Do you understand the word "symbolism" and what it means? Armstead Jun 2016 #83

He can go through with it. But no speaking slot for him until after, meaning no primetime. CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #87

You and i are not drawing up the schedule, so it is immaterial Armstead Jun 2016 #88

Yeah, because the convention schedule is what voters think about in the booth. Lol. CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #100

Yep. I'm in total agreement. SaschaHM Jun 2016 #45

I think a gracious and enthusiastic endorsement AFTER an honest vote would be far more effective Fozzledick Jun 2016 #74

We've had an honest vote. It was called the primaries. CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #86

Why don't you want the delegates to vote? Be honest now. Fozzledick Jun 2016 #106

They're going to. I want him to endorse Hillary so we can be united on winning, with no distractions CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #108

What I said is the best time to endorse is AFTER the vote is taken and the nominee confirmed. Fozzledick Jun 2016 #109

Waiting until after the vote looks petty, and means nothing CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #110

Bullshit, what looks petty is trying to drive off the competition before the vote. Fozzledick Jun 2016 #112

Pointlessly carrying on when everyone knows you lost is divisive. CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #113

No answer? So why do you keep repeating a lost argument? Fozzledick Jun 2016 #114

I'm with the majority. Bernie's the one being divisive, by not being a man and conceding. CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #115

What a sleazy and divisive provocation! Fozzledick Jun 2016 #120

lol bonemachine Jun 2016 #154

Or he just can't bring himself to saying that he lost KingFlorez Jun 2016 #18

yeah whatever....it's all about personality and Reality Show drama Armstead Jun 2016 #19

Again, he simply cannot bring himself to saying that he lost KingFlorez Jun 2016 #23

"You can play conjecture all day"... ljm2002 Jun 2016 #27

You can attack me, but it will not change the fact that Sanders lost KingFlorez Jun 2016 #29

You stated that another poster is engaging in "conjecture"... ljm2002 Jun 2016 #42

This is a fucking political discussion board Armstead Jun 2016 #31

You are pulling things out of the air again KingFlorez Jun 2016 #37

You are correct on one level ....So half an apology. Armstead Jun 2016 #41

Right. And then the Clintonistas will resurrect the "fringe candidate" narrative RufusTFirefly Jun 2016 #22

Those voters voted and were counted KingFlorez Jun 2016 #25

This reminds me of a relationship where one party wants to end it, but the other party can't/won't Arkansas Granny Jun 2016 #94

Yes! It's like opting for a roll call instead of a voice vote RufusTFirefly Jun 2016 #21

If he pulls somethin like that I would be in favor of the party retaliating once Hillary is elected. YouDig Jun 2016 #24

That'd be reallllll smart Armstead Jun 2016 #26

What's Bernie going to do? Start voting with the GOP? I doubt it. YouDig Jun 2016 #34

You are thinking short term, Armstead Jun 2016 #38

Yes. I am thinking about November, specifically. A lot hinges on that. YouDig Jun 2016 #47

Neither of us can predict the future... Armstead Jun 2016 #56

True dat. I hope you're right that it's "chill, Bernie's got this." YouDig Jun 2016 #60

Yep....But also remember that this transcends Sanders Armstead Jun 2016 #62

Brilliant strategy! Brilliant! RufusTFirefly Jun 2016 #30

By then the election will be over and Hillary will be president. No more Bernie or Bust threats. YouDig Jun 2016 #35

That's probably some really great advice. I hope that Clinton and the DNC actually do try this. NorthCarolina Jun 2016 #55

YouDig PowerToThePeople Jun 2016 #175

Of course, and it's not a theory. JackRiddler Jun 2016 #32

Nah! He's still praying to the indictment fairy. Hey, who knows, it could happen. brush Jun 2016 #36

From the expectation of 5 or 10 percent to 43 pecent (about) is worth paying attention to Armstead Jun 2016 #43

Ahhh . . . he's hardly the first to propose many of those positions. Democrats have . . . brush Jun 2016 #50

Time will tell..... Armstead Jun 2016 #52

Many posters here are already writing as if the Sanders campaign never happened... villager Jun 2016 #49

Or -- worse -- just a minor little blip Armstead Jun 2016 #53

...to be safely-- insistently -- ignored, going forward. nt villager Jun 2016 #57

They have to crush Sanders, not just defeat him mikehiggins Jun 2016 #64

Well put and 100% correct. Nt Else You Are Mad Jun 2016 #80

Exactly...."Certainly his continuing onto the convention floor is not preventing.." Armstead Jun 2016 #81

I was told by a Bernie supporter that the reason he hasn't Pastiche423 Jun 2016 #111

Trump is using Bernie's failure to concede to attack Hillary. pnwmom Jun 2016 #136

And once Bernie endorses her Trump will never say anything nasty again Armstead Jun 2016 #150

Take out crown and ring so I can recommend it. NCTraveler Jun 2016 #65

...so a year of campaigning wasn't enough to show the level of his support? brooklynite Jun 2016 #71

Nope Armstead Jun 2016 #75

BINGO! We have a winner! Fozzledick Jun 2016 #72

Nonsense. The biggest pot of gold Sanders has, are the emails and contact details of those who OnDoutside Jun 2016 #90

That's certainly one of the big negotiable points Armstead Jun 2016 #93

I wouldn't be a supporter of Bernie, as I've seen plenty of his type here in Europe but if I were OnDoutside Jun 2016 #96

And I would be clicking on "unsubscribe" with great enjoyment and gusto. n/t djean111 Jun 2016 #142

I'm sure they're lying awake over that. OnDoutside Jun 2016 #158

Oh, I know - they care as much about that as they care about anything you do. Which is not at all. djean111 Jun 2016 #159

Then they are more felix_numinous Jun 2016 #152

Well I'm sure you'll regale us of never having participated in the politics before, but the DNC gave OnDoutside Jun 2016 #157

In simpler terms: It's the right thing to do. Tierra_y_Libertad Jun 2016 #78

People have to be allowed to declare themselves felix_numinous Jun 2016 #91

Exactamente Armstead Jun 2016 #92

Plus we are developing skills felix_numinous Jun 2016 #95

Good point....I hope you're correct Armstead Jun 2016 #148

Bernie is fighting for something bigger than Hillary. She is just a bump in the road of jillan Jun 2016 #97

Does anyone know if an End of Campaign process automatically kick into place if Sanders concedes ? OnDoutside Jun 2016 #98

If your intent is to imply that Bernie is only continuing for money and security reasons - djean111 Jun 2016 #143

His message is one of bluster and over promising but I was interested in the mechanics of what OnDoutside Jun 2016 #156

Hillary Clinton does not have the nomination. She has not "won." It is not official. senz Jun 2016 #104

What's despicable is your absurd conspriacy theory about the AP announcement. Lord Magus Jun 2016 #118

Maybe you're.... Armstead Jun 2016 #147

If the math said he had lost, he woud have conceded. senz Jun 2016 #151

It's his mailing list and donor database. Starry Messenger Jun 2016 #105

I like this theory Armstead and I think you might be right. Silver_Witch Jun 2016 #129

Nothing wrong with that. It's perfectly legitimate to do that. Ken Burch Jun 2016 #130

That's what some seem to want -- Mindless Monotony disguised as "unity" Armstead Jun 2016 #146

I agree. I want that affirmation of the important issues we voted for. Overseas Jun 2016 #153

Why should a minority of delegates be able to force their positions pnwmom Jun 2016 #135

You're right....40 percent of the primary voters don't count. They're NOTHING. Armstead Jun 2016 #145

You're saying that the minority should get to make the decisions. pnwmom Jun 2016 #155

Its called negotiation and compromise Armstead Jun 2016 #161

But Bernie's speech on Thursday was all about the "musts." Not about pnwmom Jun 2016 #163

You sound like my rethug senator's office helper. peace13 Jun 2016 #181

Why shouldn't a pool of delegates and candidates be able to compromise? Orsino Jun 2016 #166

Did you listen to Bernie's last address from his home? pnwmom Jun 2016 #167

I know certain politicians like to pre-negotiate away items at issue... Orsino Jun 2016 #168

Why not join US? The diverse majority of Democratic voters who voted for Hillary? n/t pnwmom Jun 2016 #169

See, that just sounds like more kneel-before-Zod stuff. Orsino Jun 2016 #171

I haven't seen any indication that he wants to compromise on the platform. pnwmom Jun 2016 #172

Because he doesn't pre-negotiate away what he wants to win. Orsino Jun 2016 #174

Only his supporters think we "need" all the things he says we "must" have. pnwmom Jun 2016 #179

Put Senator Warren on the ticket so that we can ignote Sanders Gothmog Jun 2016 #137

That's silly....You'd not support something you might agree with because he supports it? Armstead Jun 2016 #144

With Warren on the ticket, Clinton does not have to pay attention to sanders games Gothmog Jun 2016 #149

I think he's reluctant to get out before the FBI report is released. Vinca Jun 2016 #139

Either that, or he is terrified his supporters would do to him what he had them do robbedvoter Jun 2016 #140

His stated purpose is indeed to promote his agenda. Orsino Jun 2016 #141

Why should his agenda take priority over hers? The voters chose Hillary and her agenda. pnwmom Jun 2016 #165

She's not in primary mode anymore. Orsino Jun 2016 #173

He is -- unless and until he suspends his primary campaign. nt pnwmom Jun 2016 #180

He's still running so he can still raise money through donations. nt TeamPooka Jun 2016 #164

Money, Money, Money liberal N proud Jun 2016 #177

Sounds logical. The Wielding Truth Jun 2016 #176

Does it seem weird to anyone that this can be posted.... peace13 Jun 2016 #178