Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News Editorials & Other Articles General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

karynnj

(61,078 posts)
33. Exactly - you state better what they voted for than anything I remember from the last decade
Mon May 11, 2015, 12:04 PM
May 2015

"First of all, the resolution Hillary and so many other Democrats voted for authorized an invasion, SHOULD IT PROVE NECESSARY,"

Not to mention, Bush, like many on the left and right, also conflate what was known in October 2002 and what was known in March 2003, when GWB started the invasion. When Bush called for the invasion in March, inspectors were already saying that they had not found WMD and Iraq was cooperating in allowing invasive inspections and even destroying their best missiles that were found to go too far when not loaded with warheads. The ONLY pressing need to invade given was that it would soon be too hot for our soldiers to invade!

In October, no investigators had been in for 4 years and it was likely that the sanctions regime would be ended internationally. Many people, especially Biden and Kerry, both on SFRC, called in summer 2002 for Bush to work with the UN and to consult Congress - and NOT use the 2001 authority to attack Iraq. Biden, in the 2008 race spoke of the concern about sanctions ending as a concern that drove many Democrats. The IWR called for working with the UN, which Bush started to do after the vote then abandoned when he saw he did not have the support of France and Germany. It also called for Iraq to allow invasive inspections.

Imagine that Bush had done what many Democrats, both against and for the IWR, were advocating for and used the fantastic option handed to him - that he was uninterested in because his goal was NEVER what he said it was. Imagine how strong he would have been in 2004 if - instead of going to war - he got a long term agreement to continue monitoring Iraq, while lifting the sanctions that had done so much damage over more than a decade. He could then have declared that his invasive inspections eliminated things like the missiles actually destroyed for having too long a range and that they eliminated the possibility that Iraq still had chemical weapons, while showing they had no nuclear weapons. ( Had the same authority in October 2002 been asked for by a President Kerry or a President Biden etc, there is no doubt in my mind that this is what they would have done. )

While still being a wartime President, Bush could have contrasted his monitoring Iraq with the horrible toll the sanctions had had under Clinton. (They started under GHWB, but he could have easily argued that they were never intended to be permanent.) How could any Democrat run against him for successfully doing what they called on him to do?

Note that NOT going to war with Iraq would have avoided so many negatives - no war, no increased debt, no Abu Ghraib. He would have run on being strong after 911, attacking Afghanistan to control AQ, and he would have had Iraq as an example of peacefully limiting a threat (even if partly falsely created) and run on the tax cuts (the Democrats had insured they extended to everyone - even though the biggest share of gain going to the 1%) and the drug benefit for Medicare. Bush could have stolen many issues that are usually Democratic.

To me, it is sad that the left was so angry over the IWR that they HELPED move part of the blame from Bush to the Congress for a decision he alone made. At this point,I have spoken to many intelligent people who are surprised when I tell them the vote was in October, the invasion in March -- as many have a false memory that directly connects the two - placing the vote and the decision at the same point in time -- as Jeb Bush does EXPLICITLY in this comment that they had the same intelligence. This ignores that HRC's vote occurred before the inspectors were in -- and Bush had the results of about 5 months of work by people like Hans Blix and El Baredi (IAEA) done after the vote.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

Good! hrmjustin May 2015 #1
He has a long road before Hillary yeoman6987 May 2015 #5
Walker or Rubio. hrmjustin May 2015 #6
Oh yeah. Forgot about him. You are right he may get it. yeoman6987 May 2015 #7
hillary can't use the "I would have invaded Iraq" quote lol nt msongs May 2015 #2
Aside from Cruz the kook, Jebby is the weakest candidate for the GOP. Dawson Leery May 2015 #3
but he knows where the money is Backwoodsrider May 2015 #30
Makes one wonder what he knows and has on Mittens Sheepshank May 2015 #39
Hillary voting to invade Iraq defuses that line of attack. AtomicKitten May 2015 #4
Except she voted to give bush the authority to do what is necessary. Hoyt May 2015 #11
lame excuse for poor judgment AtomicKitten May 2015 #16
It's not a lame excuse. It's what was plainly discussed as the reason for the vote at the time. stevenleser May 2015 #19
Bernie Sanders got it right, wasn't bamboozled by horseshit, AtomicKitten May 2015 #21
Guessing right on a boolean proposition isn't particularly praise-worthy. stevenleser May 2015 #22
It's called due diligence as opposed to craven political motivation. AtomicKitten May 2015 #23
No, there was no due diligence to be had. There was no firm evidence either way. That was why it was stevenleser May 2015 #24
Nonsense. AtomicKitten May 2015 #25
Then explain why the entire world wanted the UN Weapons inspectors back in Iraq. stevenleser May 2015 #26
Yes, those primaries were harsh. Next week's general election is clinton all the way. NYC_SKP May 2015 #8
Jeb just decided the Dem primary in favor of Hillary. Get used to it. delrem May 2015 #9
If both are out of the running I'll be happy. One down. NYC_SKP May 2015 #10
I wonder if any Republican nominee will be promoting and expanding Obamacare? Sheepshank May 2015 #40
It was a joke, Sheepshank. delrem May 2015 #42
"Now the only problem will be distinguishing Hillary from Jeb. " this was your joke? Sheepshank May 2015 #43
Well, the Clinton and Bush families are close friends. delrem May 2015 #44
so you weren't joking...? Do you follow and adhere to the politics of all of your friends? Sheepshank May 2015 #45
It was a joke, Sheepshank. delrem May 2015 #46
Ouch. That'll leave a mark. John Poet May 2015 #41
He hung himself out to dry on an extremist right wing site, of all places DFW May 2015 #12
He's stuck because he can't admit his brother skewed the intelligence Yorktown May 2015 #13
Cheney had a business agenda DFW May 2015 #14
I'd doubt that Yorktown May 2015 #15
No, nothing as paltry as money. tavernier May 2015 #17
I still do not see what the Iraq fiasco gave to Cheney Yorktown May 2015 #28
For starters 200,000 options of Halliburton Stcok for $1 DFW May 2015 #35
PNAC - neocons for big bucks and power. BillZBubb May 2015 #27
The invasion WAS "the mistake" Proud Liberal Dem May 2015 #32
Only on a national basis DFW May 2015 #36
Exactly - you state better what they voted for than anything I remember from the last decade karynnj May 2015 #33
I don't see how Jebby makes it past the teahaddists workinclasszero May 2015 #18
Hmm R.Quinn May 2015 #20
I don't think either stands a chance Yorktown May 2015 #29
yep no chance Backwoodsrider May 2015 #34
It's scary enough knowing that Jeb takes advice from his brother on anything Proud Liberal Dem May 2015 #31
He must not want the gig...or why would he say such a thing? Left coast liberal May 2015 #37
Bernie november3rd May 2015 #38
Latest Discussions»Retired Forums»2016 Postmortem»Jeb probably just handed ...»Reply #33