2016 Postmortem

karynnj

(60,976 posts)

37. I agree with Cali 100% in this OP and am impressed how clearly she articulated why it is a problem

Fri Aug 21, 2015, 02:59 PM

Aug 2015

She left office, knowing there were many FOIA that her email should have been subject to and she made no effort to insure the SD had the emails. Because many HRC DID go to SD accounts, they did have some. This might be why it took nearly a year for the SD to even know they were missing stuff.

It then appears, from the NYT article, that the SD had a pretty difficult time getting the email from her - as they mentioned that there were "negotiations that had to go all the way up to Kerry's chief of staff, David Wade. (Point being that if Wade demanded them, it was essentially the same as Kerry demanding them) Then they took several months and gave them to the SD on paper - and apparently wiped the server. Once this became known, the SD has been asked to redo many FOIA requests - making them even slower. In addition, there is the enormous 12 people/year project to process all her email and put them online.

As to previous SoS, the use of email rather than other forms of communication has changed over time. It is likely that the Clinton era SoS may never have used email for work. (The government was way behind private companies.) I have no problem with them expanding this investigation to the practices of Powell and Rice. However, that does not change that this was against the Obama administration guidelines.

I am surprised that you do not see this as against an open and transparent government. I don't like that this has left Obama and Kerry in the awkward positions they are in.

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it's not the classified stuff that bugs me about the email mess. it's what the mess says about [View all] cali Aug 2015 OP

The attacks on Hillary will NEVER stop. And as we can now see, those who oppose her randys1 Aug 2015 #1

Then she needs to be able to deal with them, and she can't. Motown_Johnny Aug 2015 #72

EXACTLY what all the rightwingers are telling me on the internet, EXACTLY what you just randys1 Aug 2015 #73

I bet they also say that water is wet and the sky is blue. Motown_Johnny Aug 2015 #84

Lots of those opponents here at DU, I wish they would go to a place where rightwing talk randys1 Aug 2015 #85

Truth should be accepted anywhere Motown_Johnny Aug 2015 #89

What truth am I rejecting? The truth according to who? randys1 Aug 2015 #91

That she needs to be able to deal with the attacks, Motown_Johnny Aug 2015 #95

And yet she's far ahead of Sanders. That is truth. Deal with it. George II Aug 2015 #101

A little less every day.... every day.... every day.... Motown_Johnny Aug 2015 #104

to you and your cohorts all criticism of Hillary is right wing cali Aug 2015 #90

So if someone doesn't feel the way that YOU virgogal Aug 2015 #94

I thoroughly expect rightwingers to hate and attack Hillary, I wont take that away from them randys1 Aug 2015 #98

there is nothing remotely hateful in my op cali Aug 2015 #206

The RW has no messageboards at all like DU, not a single one. RW has never invited open discussions. Sunlei Aug 2015 #108

NOt on most explicit rw boards, I do know one where nobody is banned for any reason randys1 Aug 2015 #110

Unlike DU, They're probaby afraid to ban anyone who pays by the month. Sunlei Aug 2015 #132

Listening to caller after caller into all the shows today about Hillary and email randys1 Aug 2015 #134

IMO, if after RW raked over decades of Mrs. Clintons work and all they have is an old school email s Sunlei Aug 2015 #137

He is next on the list, i am sure randys1 Aug 2015 #139

Really? George II Aug 2015 #122

really. Sunlei Aug 2015 #129

Seems like you don't like 840high Aug 2015 #169

prove it. post some comments from wingnuts saying that cali Aug 2015 #120

Well, she's ahead of Sanders by 2-1 or more in every state but one. .. George II Aug 2015 #93

First of all, it is way to soon to lean on those. Motown_Johnny Aug 2015 #102

Two points: George II Aug 2015 #167

You are averaging in old polls which are no longer correct. Motown_Johnny Aug 2015 #191

Well then, if you look at the last four polls listed on Pollster, Sanders appears..... George II Aug 2015 #192

No. nt MannyGoldstein Aug 2015 #183

Yes. nt George II Aug 2015 #193

What bugs ME is the willingness of people to use JUDICIAL WATCH horse shit on a Democratic message MADem Aug 2015 #82

blabitty bla bla bla.... get back to me when you got something new to groan about. boston bean Aug 2015 #2

you can stick your fingers in your ears and chant "I can't hear you" cali Aug 2015 #5

And you can say the same thing over and over, doesn't make what I said untrue. boston bean Aug 2015 #7

it's hardly just me saying it. cali Aug 2015 #11

Right it isn't just you, it's the entire GOP chorus along with you! boston bean Aug 2015 #12

it's scores of liberal pundits, elected dems and rank and file dems as well. cali Aug 2015 #19

Yeah, right! you keep saying that. boston bean Aug 2015 #44

It will depend on her GOP opponent whether he wins or not Armstead Aug 2015 #28

The email situation is of her own making. It's not a smear, it's a fact. Her sloppy handling Autumn Aug 2015 #123

Everyone's got an "opinion", some opinions are just conspiracy theories. boston bean Aug 2015 #196

No, people are voicing their concern over Autumn Aug 2015 #198

Just so happens all them "concerns" are the same as what Right Wingers fling at the wall. boston bean Aug 2015 #199

I hear those concerns from a lot of Democrats so OK. Of course they don't Autumn Aug 2015 #200

just cause you hear them from "Democrats" doesn't mean boston bean Aug 2015 #201

Unless one of her staff personally supervised the the "wiping" of the server, what was to jonno99 Aug 2015 #3

Even if they supervised that, what (other than professionalism) would have prevented them from doing karynnj Aug 2015 #25

so you choose to reward rw hate attack for your benefit, for your candidate. it never stops. seabeyond Aug 2015 #4

sorry, this has nothing to do with my support for Bernie. I've been opposed to hillary cali Aug 2015 #9

your bottom line is tear her down thru rw hate, rewarding their agenda. seabeyond Aug 2015 #10

fail seabey. I use liberal sources. cali Aug 2015 #21

liberal media? .... no agenda there, liberal sources for rw attack. i see no clarifications seabeyond Aug 2015 #23

that doesn't make any sense. cali Aug 2015 #29

Why not address the actual criticisms of her handling of the emails Vattel Aug 2015 #150

Supporters are blind kcjohn1 Aug 2015 #6

i am not a supporter, nor blind. please do not insult people simply because they disagree with you seabeyond Aug 2015 #13

No insults kcjohn1 Aug 2015 #36

calling people "blind" for disagreeing with you is not an insult? seabeyond Aug 2015 #38

There is different kcjohn1 Aug 2015 #42

TO hide Benghazi details, right! Wait, am I being punked, this is NOT randys1 Aug 2015 #75

You won't get an answer. 840high Aug 2015 #170

the fury born of denial is pretty interesting. cali Aug 2015 #30

"fury" i see not an ounce of fury. but, that is part of the game played. assign emotion, then insult seabeyond Aug 2015 #39

you are expressing fury. cali Aug 2015 #50

no. i am not. you persume to dictate peoples feelings over the net and expect to be taken seriously? seabeyond Aug 2015 #54

Sorry, but it most certainly IS the RW scandal machine making this into more than it is. blm Aug 2015 #8

you are flat out wrong. it is an issue cali Aug 2015 #17

For as many Democrats that you claim (and quote) that its an issue, there are five times as many.... George II Aug 2015 #27

of course most dems are going to close ranks behind her cali Aug 2015 #57

Of course. ... George II Aug 2015 #78

I think her viability is vanishing cali Aug 2015 #119

You're entitled to your opinion. I just hope that damage caused by you and others doesn't destroy.. George II Aug 2015 #131

it's the height of absurdity cali Aug 2015 #133

Get real - do you really think 840high Aug 2015 #171

+1000 sheshe2 Aug 2015 #159

IT is ONLY an issue if the media and the anti Clinton campaign, alive and well here at DU randys1 Aug 2015 #80

LOL - Horsepoo - Dems 'privately' express a lot of concern against Obama, Kerry, ACA, IRS, blm Aug 2015 #68

whatever. rave nonsensically on o your heart's content cali Aug 2015 #76

I'm not as easily entertained by RW propaganda as you. blm Aug 2015 #92

silly attempt at a smear by you. I don't do rw propaganda. I do facts cali Aug 2015 #124

I agree with Cali 100% in this OP and am impressed how clearly she articulated why it is a problem karynnj Aug 2015 #37

thanks,karynn cali Aug 2015 #51

I get that, but, who can claim that when she was taking the similar path as GOP SoS blm Aug 2015 #62

Correct. 840high Aug 2015 #172

Republicans are Hypocrits, we should not be Rilgin Aug 2015 #55

Laugh, laugh, I thought I'd cry. blm Aug 2015 #65

Turn it on yourself Rilgin Aug 2015 #69

Nope - I'm saying what I said. Neither Powell or Rice would even be asked and when it is known blm Aug 2015 #74

neither are running for president. neither had their own server. cali Aug 2015 #79

Yeah - If only HRC used the DNC's server, instead, THEN the corporate media would be OK blm Aug 2015 #86

Can you make a single argument other than Rilgin Aug 2015 #100

Then use your energy to DEMAND it across the board. blm Aug 2015 #106

No Rilgin Aug 2015 #116

LOL - No one here thinks that Dem politicians can be allowed to be AS bad. YOU want that blm Aug 2015 #117

flail, flail an more flail. cali Aug 2015 #126

You're welcome to show that ANY real DUer said Dems are allowed to be AS bad as GOPs. blm Aug 2015 #135

Again Rilgin Aug 2015 #140

^^ THIS ^^ jonno99 Aug 2015 #66

Demand ALL of DC turn over every email waylaid. ALL - or should it ONLY be these emails blm Aug 2015 #71

Well, don't you think that when one becomes a public servant that THAT (FOI requests) is to be jonno99 Aug 2015 #77

my understanding is that FOIA is to be followed, period HFRN Aug 2015 #87

Demand it of EVERY ONE OF THEM. Or, are you in harmony with the RW propaganda machine blm Aug 2015 #88

Why is this so hard to comprehend? YES! demand it of every one of them and the jonno99 Aug 2015 #97

Where is YOUR energy directed? Making the RW propagandists' load easier. blm Aug 2015 #103

"CorpMedia has its hooks" - no doubt. But it begs the question: why does the campaign jonno99 Aug 2015 #111

Come clean with what? With the horsesh!t narrative being catapulted? blm Aug 2015 #115

Yes - furthermore I don't 840high Aug 2015 #174

...+1 840high Aug 2015 #173

Well, she was one of a number of high-ranking people with private accounts back then, and Hortensis Aug 2015 #14

Well look at that a concerned Bernie supporter is very concerned saturnsring Aug 2015 #15

Did you ever think that it's a concerned Dem supporter.? 840high Aug 2015 #175

LOL! This is only an issue because you won't stop talking about it. randome Aug 2015 #16

wow. that's some potent denial you have going on cali Aug 2015 #18

So tell me what bad thing happened because of this. randome Aug 2015 #41

I'll answer my own request. Nothing. randome Aug 2015 #46

this mess is the bad thing. cali Aug 2015 #127

So nothing bad happened that you can point to. randome Aug 2015 #195

that her favorabilities are disastrous is a bad thing. she is the odds on favorite to cali Aug 2015 #197

This server thing is the most important issue this country faces!!!!!! JoePhilly Aug 2015 #32

You must live a sheltered 840high Aug 2015 #176

So was Benghazi. Sorry, I meant to say BENGHAZI! randome Aug 2015 #194

It's all about the perception of the voters. Tierra_y_Libertad Aug 2015 #20

that's true, but I stand by what I wrote in the op cali Aug 2015 #24

I agree with your OP. Tierra_y_Libertad Aug 2015 #34

"Less-than-honest-husband"? Is that you Mr. Starr? George II Aug 2015 #31

No, that's me who thinks Bill is less than honest. Tierra_y_Libertad Aug 2015 #33

Trashing Bill... sheshe2 Aug 2015 #161

You never miss a chance to take a gratuitous (and unworthy) shot at Hillary Clinton, do you? George II Aug 2015 #22

how about actually addressing the specifics in the op? cali Aug 2015 #26

You nor anyone else has one lick of proof that Hillary boston bean Aug 2015 #35

no proof but there's evidence as posted in the op and there's common sense, critical cali Aug 2015 #47

There is no proof. Yet, you want to continually try to turn it into the worst, human failure, that boston bean Aug 2015 #49

Great post. Couldn't have said it better. Kingofalldems Aug 2015 #53

No - Occam's razor is about arriving at the simplest answer. So - what is the question? jonno99 Aug 2015 #70

. boston bean Aug 2015 #96

Proclaims the ostrich... jonno99 Aug 2015 #99

... sheshe2 Aug 2015 #163

At some point we have to just accept that the GOP is everywhere. randys1 Aug 2015 #81

OMG, this is sheshe2 Aug 2015 #162

I like cali's OP - sorry you don't. 840high Aug 2015 #177

Exactly, and as they say, innocent until PROVEN guilty.... George II Aug 2015 #130

Because they're just right wing talking points, and you just revel in the "scandal". George II Aug 2015 #128

I have to wonder why that is? sheshe2 Aug 2015 #164

I am a Hillary leaner - and I must agree with you - she got some darned awful advice . . . if she DrDan Aug 2015 #40

I am far from tech savvy, but I just don't get not separating work cali Aug 2015 #45

I can only speak for the two corporations I worked for . . . but there DrDan Aug 2015 #63

This message was self-deleted by its author Corruption Inc Aug 2015 #109

don't buy it DrDan Aug 2015 #144

Mixing work and personal is common, but dreamnightwind Aug 2015 #142

I think she should give a speech to explain it to the public HFRN Aug 2015 #43

In case you were curious. Juicy_Bellows Aug 2015 #56

Looks like Juror 6 got it right . TheFarS1de Aug 2015 #121

How'd you know I was #6? Juicy_Bellows Aug 2015 #125

I'm not going to rag on Hillary too much about this yet, Blue_In_AK Aug 2015 #48

I'd forgotten about that. cali Aug 2015 #59

We have long memories up here Blue_In_AK Aug 2015 #61

Thanks for the reminder. 840high Aug 2015 #178

My thoughrs on the matter GitRDun Aug 2015 #52

i know little to nothing about puters. my question. all the people sending her work emails knew seabeyond Aug 2015 #58

actually an excellent thought. 100s, maybe 1000s of people who knew and said nothing. Sunlei Aug 2015 #113

Someone directed kcjohn1 Aug 2015 #60

Yes, I'd like to know whose idea it was! xynthee Aug 2015 #67

Perhaps Powell and Rice during the transition process? Why won't RW media ask them blm Aug 2015 #118

I understand the sentiment GitRDun Aug 2015 #143

Assuming it will go away is a mistake musiclawyer Aug 2015 #64

It won't go away. Wait till 840high Aug 2015 #179

? Motown_Johnny Aug 2015 #83

lol ok GitRDun Aug 2015 #141

The lack of oversight is the problem here. Motown_Johnny Aug 2015 #147

You are talking about optics GitRDun Aug 2015 #149

I am talking about judgement. Motown_Johnny Aug 2015 #160

Now you are moving on to other subjects where you disagree with her GitRDun Aug 2015 #168

You can bet that some classified information was mishandled. Motown_Johnny Aug 2015 #190

I hear ya GitRDun Aug 2015 #207

I used to work in offices. I never accessed private e-mails in the office. JDPriestly Aug 2015 #105

I assume you'd never vote for her, even if she wins the primary. Sunlei Aug 2015 #107

you assume incorrectly. cali Aug 2015 #112

'of course' I do! Sunlei Aug 2015 #114

Blah, blah, blah. leftofcool Aug 2015 #136

denial, denial and more denial cali Aug 2015 #138

This message was self-deleted by its author Corruption Inc Aug 2015 #145

The classified stuff is the real problem, tho The Traveler Aug 2015 #146

I recently deleted 5000 emails from my personal account. Lancero Aug 2015 #148

so you're a high ranking government official with one account for both your personal cali Aug 2015 #151

No. Lancero Aug 2015 #152

try responding to what is in the op. it has nothing to do with right wing bullshit cali Aug 2015 #154

Seems to mention the fauxian scandal quite a lot... Lancero Aug 2015 #155

Hillary screwed up but hay rick Aug 2015 #153

The media's been blowing it out of proportion ever since it hit. Lancero Aug 2015 #156

What does your company think about you mixing their business and yours on that account? Fumesucker Aug 2015 #157

Depends - What do you think about the embrace of a RW fauxian scandal? Lancero Aug 2015 #158

Silly answer. 840high Aug 2015 #181

In otherwords, you think it's great that Democrats are falling for Republican hoaxes. Lancero Aug 2015 #184

I think it's great that 840high Aug 2015 #186

You running for president? 840high Aug 2015 #180

Nope, but apparently large portions of DU think deleting personal emails is tantamount to murder. Lancero Aug 2015 #185

The mess is of his own creation. It reflects badly on his judgment riversedge Aug 2015 #165

You really are a one trick pony, aren't you. philosslayer Aug 2015 #166

not even close. but if it makes you feel better cali Aug 2015 #187

SoS working from a private email account MannyGoldstein Aug 2015 #182

If this is the craziest thing you've ever heard of, you've lived a very sheltered life. randome Aug 2015 #188

The email thing really doesn't bother me too much. What does bother me-- eridani Aug 2015 #189

She made a dumb mistake, at the very least. nt Zorra Aug 2015 #202

I suspect that many of her unforced errors stem from being gun shy because of the tblue37 Aug 2015 #203

It's obvious that what really bugs you about it is that there is no substance to it. DanTex Aug 2015 #204

huh? no. what troubles me is that it reveals that Clinton has no problem lying cali Aug 2015 #205