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2016 Postmortem
In reply to the discussion: Hillary's historian refutes Sanders claim that this country is "created on racist principles". [View all]Armstead
(47,803 posts)12. Do I see some role reversal going on here?
Sanders pointing out an uncomfortable truth about racism, and a Hillary surrogate refusing ro acknowledge the role of racism.
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Hillary's historian refutes Sanders claim that this country is "created on racist principles". [View all]
Luminous Animal
Sep 2015
OP
I guess some people are willing to destroy their reputation for a politician.
beam me up scottie
Sep 2015
#57
No. They will appear on the right near the bottom of the article. You'll see a box
Luminous Animal
Sep 2015
#101
Even the founding fathers knew that slavery was a time bomb buried in the constitution.
Warren DeMontague
Sep 2015
#4
A gruesome response to anyone that doesn't think that this country isn't built on
erronis
Sep 2015
#109
well, technically it was a lot of LITTLER genocides, and often they just starved to death by
MisterP
Sep 2015
#81
No, it does not even come close to saying they only count as 3/5th of a real human.
ieoeja
Sep 2015
#106
My main beef with the article is the Mr. Welintz conflates country with Constitution.
Luminous Animal
Sep 2015
#82
"our country was founded on racist principles." - but what does really mean? That some of the
jonno99
Sep 2015
#90
One of the last? Your link appears to have the US somewhere in the middle. Not to mention
jonno99
Sep 2015
#173
To me that's the question of this thread. Racism's precedes capture and ownership. "Principles"
ancianita
Sep 2015
#224
"...attempting to judge the past by the present, ...is always a preposterous thing to do"
AlbertCat
Sep 2015
#92
Ok - but as codified by what specifially? This whole discussion is a little nebulas.
jonno99
Sep 2015
#132
Are you (or Bernie) referring to the "three fifths of all other Persons" language in article 1?
AlbertCat
Sep 2015
#139
I agree, and yet our jurisprudence is based on the words of the document - not the
jonno99
Sep 2015
#183
Both Washington and Jefferson owned hundreds of slaves and freed none during their lifetimes.
Nye Bevan
Sep 2015
#27
Can Hillary's lawyer explain why a slave could both not vote and only counted 3/5 th?
karynnj
Sep 2015
#28
So, Hillary's lawyer is on the wrong side of an argument made a century and a half ago?
karynnj
Sep 2015
#50
Slavery was NOT abolished until 1865 with the 13th Amendment. Are we going to ignore history. n/t
Skwmom
Sep 2015
#37
The only reason this matters to some is the supposed connection to Hillary...duh
randys1
Sep 2015
#40
Did I blame Hillary? Oh no I did not. I do hope someone asks her about it, though.
Luminous Animal
Sep 2015
#44
Because he advises her on historical issues and is sometimes referred as Hillary's Historian.
Luminous Animal
Sep 2015
#60
so Hillary's historian says, US not founded on racist principles, but Obama's campaign was?
virtualobserver
Sep 2015
#69
Their whole record belies any claim to any "fit into the arc of progression." Their record fits,
ancianita
Sep 2015
#146
People here are focused on criticizing DEMOCRATS, most of that is against Hillary.
randys1
Sep 2015
#65
I correct people all the time, problem is there is a 20-1 ratio of attacks on hillary.
randys1
Sep 2015
#247
I call bull shit, the OP does not threaten to NOT to vote if their candidate isn't the one
Autumn
Sep 2015
#252
And they still had to wait 56 more years after the 14th amendment for citizenship
jfern
Sep 2015
#156
The work of any historian, regardless of how respected he or she may be, is still subject
Maedhros
Sep 2015
#253
Don't make the mistake of assuming Hillary's supporters are arguing in good faith.
Maedhros
Sep 2015
#254
So, Hillary's historian denies the founding racism of this country, seemingly unaware ...
hedda_foil
Sep 2015
#73
It's an OpEd in the NYT by a Clinton advisor who claims that Bernie poisoning the current presidential
Luminous Animal
Sep 2015
#77
This is classic Clinton politics and he knows how to play the game.
beam me up scottie
Sep 2015
#119
Yeah, you joined right at the beginning and it's only going to get worse.
beam me up scottie
Sep 2015
#127
I understand his argument and that is not my main complaint. Bernie stated the COUNTRY
Luminous Animal
Sep 2015
#129
Please do. I can't anymore because I timed out on my 10 free monthly access to the Times.
Luminous Animal
Sep 2015
#151
Indeed. You are the new guy. Welcome and thanks for your every contribution.
Luminous Animal
Sep 2015
#211
He shilled for her in 2008 and accused Obama of deploying "racial politics":
beam me up scottie
Sep 2015
#112
"This country was founded by slave owners who wanted to be free." -George Carlin
Fearless
Sep 2015
#133
Are people going to claim that "3/5ths of a person" has nothing to do with racism?
jfern
Sep 2015
#141
No system of evil has "principles." Sanders just needs to lose that word. That's 17th Century l
ancianita
Sep 2015
#149
It means, in this context, the underlying foundation for a belief or behavior system.
Luminous Animal
Sep 2015
#160
Then we disagree on depravity, which is the basis of slavery, not "principles". "Foundation" is
ancianita
Sep 2015
#170
No. We disagree that a word can have more than one meaning. The members of the KKK
Luminous Animal
Sep 2015
#175
Like I said, there are no principles as the foundation of any evil system of bigotry/racism.
ancianita
Sep 2015
#184
Actually, Sanders and my definition is the first definition in every dictionary.
Luminous Animal
Sep 2015
#210
Definitions are living documents subject to change by thinking through words' ramifications.
ancianita
Sep 2015
#213
Oh I understand. I just think removing context and contracting meaning makes us less
Luminous Animal
Sep 2015
#216
To say that "foundation" and "principles" are synonymous muddles context and makes us unintelligent.
ancianita
Sep 2015
#218
I've not said that at all. The definition of principles has a foundation. That foundation is
Luminous Animal
Sep 2015
#230
The foundation of racism is fear, depravity and greed. Those are not principles. Principles are
ancianita
Sep 2015
#232
Like it our not, principles are the ideological foundation of both the odious and the sublime.
Luminous Animal
Sep 2015
#235
Thank you. If a word could have two different meanings, there wouldn't be need for different words,
ancianita
Sep 2015
#205
I understand that but I loathe disregarding context and the contraction of vocabulary.
Luminous Animal
Sep 2015
#207
Yes, it certainly does dictate context, particularly when one tries to rationalize the real world
ancianita
Sep 2015
#214
I also look to motives of those who strive to restrict language within narrow bounds.
Luminous Animal
Sep 2015
#221
This is where we are done. Enjoyed the conversation. Reject where's black Waldo.
Luminous Animal
Sep 2015
#228
That's beyond the scope of this thread. You could agree if you didn't distract yourself with that.
ancianita
Sep 2015
#202
Fair enough. But I'm on record as not putting anything past the language of status quo supporters.
ancianita
Sep 2015
#217
Fine. I got the history part. But I'm trying to deal with a candidate's use of language today.
ancianita
Sep 2015
#219
It is possible to support evil when one rationalizes the benefits of it by using exonerating words
ancianita
Sep 2015
#197
Changing language changes thinking. Language use is psycholinguistic training. It's crucial to seein
ancianita
Sep 2015
#208
Oh yes. No doubt. All kinds of astroturf uses of language...meet the new boss, same as the old boss
ancianita
Sep 2015
#225
Revisionist in the sense that he wants to rewrite history to fit a racist world view.
blackspade
Sep 2015
#241