2016 Postmortem

DanTex

(20,709 posts)

166. So, you're a natural then. The NRA talking points come effortlessly.

Fri Oct 2, 2015, 12:30 AM

Oct 2015

At least now hopefully you understand that it's not about hammers.

As I pointed out, this fantasy "cascade of lawsuits" you were talking about never happened. Last time I pointed out that you were speculating without evidence (shocker), but it's worse than that. We already know whether there would be a "cascade", because until Bernie and the NRA passed the law, these kinds of lawsuits could make it to court. And there wasn't one. What did happen were legitimate lawsuits that were succeeding.

By the way, lawsuits are a common way to get corporations to change harmful practices, and not just in the gun industry. The people who don't like this are right-wingers, hence their massive push for tort reform (check out the movie Hot Coffee). They're 100% with you on your caveat emptor approach to corporate responsibility.

But even if in your fantasy world where there was a cascade of lawsuits, I happen to believe that if a corporation can't remain profitable under the same standards of legal liability for wrongdoing as everyone else, that corporation either should not exist, or should change its practices so that its legal penalties don't drive it bankrupt. The argument "we do so much harm that we owe millions, make the lawsuits go away" doesn't excite me much. That goes for a bank, pharma, oil company, or gun company.

Anyway, it's getting late, going to sleep. Always a good time.

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Bernie Sanders Doubles Down On Support for Law That Protects Gun Sellers From Lawsuits [View all] riversedge Oct 2015 OP

That's opportunistic in very bad taste Armstead Oct 2015 #1

I wrote and canceled about four replies FlatBaroque Oct 2015 #6

Same here. There was much rewriting in response to this OP. arcane1 Oct 2015 #25

As the NRA likes to say, we're not supposed to talk about gun control after a shooting. DanTex Oct 2015 #18

Post removed Post removed Oct 2015 #19

Tell that to Obama. He didn't seem to think that talking about gun control in the wake of the DanTex Oct 2015 #24

That's a whiole different thing and you damn well know it Armstead Oct 2015 #29

No it's not. Bernie has an atrocious record on gun control. Voted against the Brady Bill, and DanTex Oct 2015 #37

You are about to make it onto my rarely used ignore list Armstead Oct 2015 #41

Do what you need to do. But I'm not going to stop talking about gun control simply because DanTex Oct 2015 #46

What a mean and shitty post. Ron Green Oct 2015 #116

Of course, he's a "good man" so we're supposed to pretend he didn't side with the wingnuts DanTex Oct 2015 #120

Post removed Post removed Oct 2015 #36

Did you watch the press conference? Your anger is misdirected. If you don't want people to talk DanTex Oct 2015 #40

Not the same thing as misleading headline and you fucking know it. HERVEPA Oct 2015 #47

The headline is totally accurate. Bernie did vote for immunity for the gun industry. DanTex Oct 2015 #51

I really detest the personal attacks that some seem to be doing on you. It can actually be argued still_one Oct 2015 #95

It can be, but that argument is a gross distortion of what this law was actually about. DanTex Oct 2015 #101

My point was it can be discussed and debated. I actually am upset because of what I consider a still_one Oct 2015 #125

I agree. The personal attacks, yeah. I get a lot of those simply by being a Hillary supporter. DanTex Oct 2015 #129

Some have noticed the personal attacks: Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #138

Does Budweiser profit from DUI's Travis_0004 Oct 2015 #137

Yes, you can sue them if you want. But if it's deemed frivolous you'll have to pay for DanTex Oct 2015 #143

Spot on, Dan. Cali_Democrat Oct 2015 #139

Obama was simply amazing today in that press conference. DanTex Oct 2015 #148

Your logic on all comments is impeccable.....I am with the President also. Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #144

Just an NRA excuse/dodge treestar Oct 2015 #179

If it was in the general discussion forum, I would agree, but this is a valid point in the primary still_one Oct 2015 #48

I disagree. It's just bad taste Armstead Oct 2015 #52

Then we disagree. It should be argued and discussed. For instance, it can reasonably be argued still_one Oct 2015 #110

Sanders did an interview about it TODAY, it no big deal ...."bad taste" is parroting NRA's spiel. bettyellen Oct 2015 #172

The bodies aren't even cold and they're already exploiting the victims to promote Hillary. beam me up scottie Oct 2015 #65

Capitalizing on tragedies to score political points. OnyxCollie Oct 2015 #113

Instead of attacking the Republicans who keep blocking legislation they go after Bernie. beam me up scottie Oct 2015 #124

All Bernie did dsc Oct 2015 #181

too bad treestar Oct 2015 #178

Obama on mass shootings: "This is something we should politicize." bigtree Oct 2015 #193

Unless the gun went off because of a defect I agree gun makers should not be.... Logical Oct 2015 #2

I agree. To do otherwise would bring up so many lawsuits and appeals that the courts would .. BlueJazz Oct 2015 #44

And today's horror has nothing to do with Sanders or the PLCAA arcane1 Oct 2015 #50

I agree. nt Logical Oct 2015 #53

If the gun is defective and/or the manufacturer broke the law they can be sued. beam me up scottie Oct 2015 #73

"A" for effort FlatBaroque Oct 2015 #3

Wow. Especially your last paragraph. BlueWaveDem Oct 2015 #4

Which is why the NRA gives Bernie such high marks LondonReign2 Oct 2015 #185

yep,D- Go Vols Oct 2015 #195

if you don't want people to sell guns ibegurpard Oct 2015 #5

If there should be no repercussions for selling a legal product, why did Sanders vote to give DanTex Oct 2015 #10

Other manufacturers are. HooptieWagon Oct 2015 #42

Suing gun makers is not the path to stopping gun violence. Bonobo Oct 2015 #7

Well, it was, until all the lawsuits, some of which were succeeding, were thrown out of court DanTex Oct 2015 #16

It makes no sense. Bonobo Oct 2015 #27

Google the Smith and Wesson lawsuit. You have no idea what this law actually did. DanTex Oct 2015 #59

Suing hospitals for malpractice is also tort reform. Bonobo Oct 2015 #80

Yes, medical malpractice costs are another big right-wing boogeyman. DanTex Oct 2015 #94

The underlying lack of logic of suing gun manufacturers is what is the problem. Bonobo Oct 2015 #97

So you haven't googled the Smith and Wesson case, huh. I wonder why. DanTex Oct 2015 #103

How did you conclude that, Dan? Bonobo Oct 2015 #107

Because if you did, you'd realize that the the analogies you are drawing are total nonsense. DanTex Oct 2015 #109

Can you articulate the case or not? Bonobo Oct 2015 #119

I did. Did you read this post? Here, I'll post the link three times, maybe then you'll click it. DanTex Oct 2015 #122

Make the case on this thread or walk. Bonobo Oct 2015 #128

Sir, yes sir! No links, sir! Understood! DanTex Oct 2015 #130

After removing all your head-shaking and posturing, your argument is ridiculous. Bonobo Oct 2015 #134

Like I said, that analogy is much closer to the reality than the idiotic DanTex Oct 2015 #142

Why is the analogy about a hammer wrong? Bonobo Oct 2015 #146

A lot of reasons. DanTex Oct 2015 #149

That doesn't address the analogy. Bonobo Oct 2015 #156

Of course it does. The analogy is not remotely similar to what the law was about. DanTex Oct 2015 #158

No, Dan, letting a court decide would not constitute proof. Bonobo Oct 2015 #162

The court system is the way we have to decide matters like this. Not just for the gun DanTex Oct 2015 #163

Dan, first of all. The amount of NRA playbook reading I do equals literally zero. Bonobo Oct 2015 #164

So, you're a natural then. The NRA talking points come effortlessly. DanTex Oct 2015 #166

And for a change, DanTex, what are Clinton's positions on gun control? Left Ear Oct 2015 #157

For one, she voted against the legal immunity bill. And she was a supporter of the Brady bill. DanTex Oct 2015 #160

Dodge viper has 700 hp Travis_0004 Oct 2015 #141

Yes, you can sue Dodge about that. But if it's deemed frivolous, you will end up paying DanTex Oct 2015 #145

Whereas the gun manufacturers have such strong immunity even a good lawsuit will be dismissed Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #150

And that was the precise point of the law. Gun manufacturers had already lost some, others had DanTex Oct 2015 #151

By comparing firearms to hammers...inane. One is a deadly weapon, legality of manufacture is a Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #153

Reductio ad absurdum Fairgo Oct 2015 #168

Non-sequitur. Sorry. Locking and wiping from memory. Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #182

Thanks! Fairgo Oct 2015 #197

And then when the lawsuits were succeeding laws were passed to protect the manufacturers. Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #55

It is inconsistent for progressives treestar Oct 2015 #189

This is exactly right. The whole "litigiousness" and "tort reform" thing is straight right-wing, DanTex Oct 2015 #191

We held cigarette manufacturers libel though didn't we? leftofcool Oct 2015 #8

You can sue ALL manufacturers. Except gun manufacturers. BlueWaveDem Oct 2015 #13

Yeah because guns and cigarettes are just alike. Autumn Oct 2015 #15

You're really going to defend the gun industry? BlueWaveDem Oct 2015 #23

Yes, that is exactly what we have. The gun industry is warm and fuzzy. Bernie said so. DanTex Oct 2015 #31

... BlueWaveDem Oct 2015 #43

Yeah, the gang thing, straight from the NRA playbook. DanTex Oct 2015 #63

Fear = $$$$ BlueWaveDem Oct 2015 #92

Dan you are so looking so silly this election season. Cracks me up. Dan being Dan. nt Logical Oct 2015 #58

From you, that's a complement. But at least you've been pro-NRA the whole time, rather than DanTex Oct 2015 #62

Post removed Post removed Oct 2015 #79

Truth....the conclusion is clear from the collective comments defending NRA memes. Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #155

Alert Results: 4-3 to keep stevenleser Oct 2015 #196

Got a link to Bernie saying the gun industry is warm and fuzzy Dan? I'll wait while you fetch it. Autumn Oct 2015 #106

Warm and fuzzy enough to deserve a special legal immunity. But maybe he doesn't actually believe it, DanTex Oct 2015 #117

Yeah that's why the NRA gives him a D Dan. eom Autumn Oct 2015 #127

Forgive Dan, he just hates Bernie. Dan being Dan. Nt Logical Oct 2015 #132

guns are legal ibegurpard Oct 2015 #32

The mind, it reels mcar Oct 2015 #33

You seemed to have learned a lot about specific DUers in your one week of posting here. arcane1 Oct 2015 #39

Yes, this was all in the past week. For example: BlueWaveDem Oct 2015 #66

I liked you better before. I didn't think you'd go as low as to defend this OP. arcane1 Oct 2015 #78

Oh good. An insult and a rofl. BlueWaveDem Oct 2015 #89

I'm saying that cigarettes and guns are NOT the same. Cigarette manufactures were sued and rightfuly Autumn Oct 2015 #87

Actually, they were sued until they put the warning labels on. still_one Oct 2015 #114

tobacco industry lied ibegurpard Oct 2015 #121

That too, but I am referring about it today, I would be very skeptical if someone would be still_one Oct 2015 #170

That pretty much sums it up. nt Bobbie Jo Oct 2015 #88

Crazy ain't it? workinclasszero Oct 2015 #152

Only if you are blind and deaf to reason LondonReign2 Oct 2015 #192

Sanders said that hammers and guns are just alike...did he not? Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #57

And the thing is, they aren't alike, because hammer manufacturers don't have the DanTex Oct 2015 #67

The hammer and ladder industries should be crying foul for the unfair protection for actual weapons! Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #70

in that both are legal? ibegurpard Oct 2015 #68

Guess which one is designed as a weapon and preferred by armies? Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #74

make them illegal ibegurpard Oct 2015 #76

Actually you can sue hammer manufacturers. They weren't covered under the Sanders-NRA DanTex Oct 2015 #77

You can't sue someone for producing something that is legal? Tobacco and auto, etc. would disagree Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #90

when they lie about safety and attempt to deceive the public ibegurpard Oct 2015 #118

You just made a fine case for near prohibitive control and restrictions of these deadly weapons. Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #133

maybe so ibegurpard Oct 2015 #169

No, he did not. And you know that. arcane1 Oct 2015 #71

He was wrong, though. Thanks to him, you can sue hammer manufacturers, but not gun manufacturers. DanTex Oct 2015 #84

Hammers and guns are tools, I disagree with the posters comparison of cigaretts and guns. eom Autumn Oct 2015 #98

did he? Oh jeeze. bettyellen Oct 2015 #176

Cigs have one purpose. And they lied about their safety. Wow, think more about it. nt Logical Oct 2015 #56

Guns have one purpose, that is to kill. Think about it! leftofcool Oct 2015 #187

Because they spent years knowingly lying about their product. phleshdef Oct 2015 #140

Cigarette manufacturers lied about lethal nature of it's products. They argued that tobacco is safe. Ed Suspicious Oct 2015 #154

You're forgetting something pinebox Oct 2015 #186

Gun nuts have claimed for years that an armed society is a polite society. leftofcool Oct 2015 #188

Sure pinebox Oct 2015 #190

Gun manufactures should be held responsible for guns that are defective. Autumn Oct 2015 #9

And they ARE ibegurpard Oct 2015 #14

Yep and I liked what you post upthread. Autumn Oct 2015 #20

Smh Truprogressive85 Oct 2015 #11

Yet, still gets a D- from the NRA. Fawke Em Oct 2015 #12

Bernie didn't vote for Afghanistan War? BlueWaveDem Oct 2015 #17

He didn't vote for Iraq. Fawke Em Oct 2015 #30

Ignore this one. They're on a mission to distort everyone's posts. arcane1 Oct 2015 #34

Fair enough. BlueWaveDem Oct 2015 #54

Did not get a F because of some support, like the gun manufacturer lawsuit immunity. Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #60

That's like not getting an F because you turned in extra credit. Fawke Em Oct 2015 #72

Extra credit was given for the gun manufacturer immunity vote. For one. Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #99

I live in a rural state. Fawke Em Oct 2015 #111

Wow. Exploiting those dead bodies before the blood has even congealed. arcane1 Oct 2015 #21

Yeah, its always too soon to talk about it. BlueWaveDem Oct 2015 #26

Too soon to talk about what? A lawsuit? arcane1 Oct 2015 #28

It is too soon to use a tragedy to sandbag a candidate Armstead Oct 2015 #35

No low will ultimately be too low, when it comes from attacks from that direction. arcane1 Oct 2015 #61

Stop making this about Hillary. It's Bernie's vote. BlueWaveDem Oct 2015 #82

It's about Hillary because her supporters are exploiting a tragedy by blaming Bernie for it. beam me up scottie Oct 2015 #159

Pardon my ignorance and /or laziness for not looking this up LondonReign2 Oct 2015 #194

That was such a preposterously bad vote, I can't imagine that people here would actually try to DanTex Oct 2015 #22

As opposed to Hillary's pretzel logic on Iraq? Fawke Em Oct 2015 #38

When you fall back on the "Saint Bernie" epithet, all you do is lower my opinion of you. Bonobo Oct 2015 #45

Remember how the right-wing said the left thought of Obama as the Messiah? Fawke Em Oct 2015 #64

I'll keep that in mind, because your opinion is what I live for. DanTex Oct 2015 #69

Good one....the only grade - the term itself an NRA propaganda tool - I would be proud of is an F--. Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #81

I could care less what you keep in your mind. Bonobo Oct 2015 #83

But somehow you think I'm interested in what's in your mind, or what you think is in the mind of DanTex Oct 2015 #86

No, I don't care one bit about your interest, Dan. Bonobo Oct 2015 #93

Thanks for your advice. I think you come off as petulant when you parrot everything Saint DanTex Oct 2015 #96

Yes, that is possibly just you, and I am not a big fan of the NRA. Bonobo Oct 2015 #104

Except in cases where Sanders sides with the NRA... DanTex Oct 2015 #112

The same logical fallacy keeps plaguing you. Let me try to help. Bonobo Oct 2015 #115

Hitler, huh. That was a good one. DanTex Oct 2015 #123

It's analogy. nt Bonobo Oct 2015 #126

Not just any analogy, a Hitler analogy. Don't sell yourself short. DanTex Oct 2015 #131

Yup, it's a logical analogy that apparently perplexes you. Bonobo Oct 2015 #135

Sanders compared hammers to guns as similar weapons? I find that hard to believe. Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #49

Mark Stern is an idiot. Vattel Oct 2015 #75

I'm also quite sure today's killer didn't give a rat's ass whether the gun-maker could be sued. arcane1 Oct 2015 #85

Of course he is. Anyone who calls Bernie a "gun nut" is either delusional or a moron. beam me up scottie Oct 2015 #91

But oh how they have pounced on this topic! arcane1 Oct 2015 #100

They exploited the victims of the last tragedy too but this was probably coordinated at another site beam me up scottie Oct 2015 #105

In this case Sanders is the idiot. DanTex Oct 2015 #108

I am actually against this law because it does over-protect gun sellers and manufacturers. Vattel Oct 2015 #177

I support Sanders. Puzzledtraveller Oct 2015 #102

Car manufacturers are liable for defective cars, not defective drivers. This OP is disingenuous GoneFishin Oct 2015 #136

Probably. That's ok with me. (nt) Inkfreak Oct 2015 #147

So what? It's not like they're banks or something. NuclearDem Oct 2015 #161

stay classy frylock Oct 2015 #165

I hope so. LoveIsNow Oct 2015 #167

I say we start with a suit against GE for the WMD manufacture nolabels Oct 2015 #171

Count me as another in agreement with Bernie on this.[n/t] Maedhros Oct 2015 #173

I'm not a gun owner but I agree with Bernie too. beam me up scottie Oct 2015 #175

Bernie was interviewed on TV about this TODAY people. He thought it was relevant. bettyellen Oct 2015 #174

The flailingly desperation to not discuss anything about Sanders' record unless it's glowing Number23 Oct 2015 #198

Yeah, and there was an alert on this OP too. It is ridiculous to think it would not come up on bettyellen Oct 2015 #199

I hadn't given too much thought to this until I read this post. Vinca Oct 2015 #180

In the time you thought and wrote that you could have researched any of the lawsuits stopped by Fred Sanders Oct 2015 #183

Smells like stinkbait in here. 99Forever Oct 2015 #184