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2016 Postmortem
In reply to the discussion: Sanders is a SOCIALIST. Pointing that out isn't "red-baiting". [View all]pinebox
(5,761 posts)10. Failboat 500
No, he's not.
Why is it so hard for American's to actually understand the differences between this? Canada , Germany, Sweden, Norway, Denmark, France & Switzerland are NOT the former USSR.
I'm to keep shoving this meme in everybody's face until they finally get it.

Bernie doesn't scream about state ownership of property, sorry.
Stop Calling Bernie Sanders a Socialist-The Vermont senator is a "democratic socialist"and yes, there's a difference.
http://www.newrepublic.com/article/121680/bernie-sanders-democratic-socialist-not-just-socialist
So perhaps it's better to consider his policies themselves. Sanders wants a level playing field, where everyone born in America actually has the same opportunity for success, instead of "a government of the billionaires, by the billionaires and for the billionaires," as he puts it. He rails against the influence of the Koch brothers and other wealthy political donors and corporations on both Republicans on Democrats, ensuring that the rich stay rich and making sure the working class remain exactly that. While many Democrats claim to be in favor of leveling the playing field, few use the rhetoric Sanders does. He has suggested things like breaking up the largest banks and frequently refers to the United States as an oligarchy.
Writing earlier this year on the "fear-mongering" over Sanders' politics, Penn Spectrum columnist Larry Liu noted the "confusion in America what socialism really is":
For starters, socialists dont always agree among each other what the content of socialism is, but at the very least it contains the state control of the means of production, such as factories, offices, resources and firms. In the more advanced form of socialism, ownership is transferred to the workers. Bernie Sanders has sympathies for it as part of his 12-point proposal for the country, where he pushed for the opportunity for workers to set up worker-owned cooperatives (Sanders 2014). But it is questionable how far he will push it. When push comes to shove, he is a supporter of a social democratic Scandinavian-style welfare state in the form of better education, healthcare and social service provisions for the general population (Leibovich 2007) rather than the confiscation of companies from the private sector.
http://www.newrepublic.com/article/121680/bernie-sanders-democratic-socialist-not-just-socialist
So perhaps it's better to consider his policies themselves. Sanders wants a level playing field, where everyone born in America actually has the same opportunity for success, instead of "a government of the billionaires, by the billionaires and for the billionaires," as he puts it. He rails against the influence of the Koch brothers and other wealthy political donors and corporations on both Republicans on Democrats, ensuring that the rich stay rich and making sure the working class remain exactly that. While many Democrats claim to be in favor of leveling the playing field, few use the rhetoric Sanders does. He has suggested things like breaking up the largest banks and frequently refers to the United States as an oligarchy.
Writing earlier this year on the "fear-mongering" over Sanders' politics, Penn Spectrum columnist Larry Liu noted the "confusion in America what socialism really is":
For starters, socialists dont always agree among each other what the content of socialism is, but at the very least it contains the state control of the means of production, such as factories, offices, resources and firms. In the more advanced form of socialism, ownership is transferred to the workers. Bernie Sanders has sympathies for it as part of his 12-point proposal for the country, where he pushed for the opportunity for workers to set up worker-owned cooperatives (Sanders 2014). But it is questionable how far he will push it. When push comes to shove, he is a supporter of a social democratic Scandinavian-style welfare state in the form of better education, healthcare and social service provisions for the general population (Leibovich 2007) rather than the confiscation of companies from the private sector.
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Public ownership of the means of production is the one defining element of all socialist models.
NuclearDem
Oct 2015
#38
re: "a socialist who believes that socialism should be arrived at through the democratic proces"
thesquanderer
Oct 2015
#40
Did I say anything about "Pure" socialism? Here, in the USA, we don't have pure capitalism.
Walk away
Oct 2015
#71
A major aspect being overlooked here is that Bernie's message is POPULIST and that
appalachiablue
Oct 2015
#97
What you described--capitalists who believe in a regulated economy and a strong welfare state
NuclearDem
Oct 2015
#34
You are correct. He calls himself a socialist without using the "Democratic Socialist" modifier.
FSogol
Oct 2015
#51
It's a convenience. Bernie's not shy about the term Socialist, but I've also seen him
99th_Monkey
Oct 2015
#79
I don't (and don't think others should) attack him for that, but there is a huge segment of the
FSogol
Oct 2015
#82
It is when it's constantly pointed out to diminish, scare, negatively influence...
whatchamacallit
Oct 2015
#52
Welcome to the primaries - YOU seem to equate "socialist" with communism by saying "red bait"
karynnj
Oct 2015
#57
This is the quality of debate you get from Sanders supporters. You can't even talk about how
stevenleser
Oct 2015
#66
Saying he's a socialist is not red baiting, putting it in ALL CAPS kind of is.
Bread and Circus
Oct 2015
#74
Red-baiting requires harrasement, persecution, or deouncement due to perceived communist or
Agnosticsherbet
Oct 2015
#76
Many of the responses to you are hilarious, and those are just the ones I can read.
stevenleser
Oct 2015
#88
So I'll assume that you also approve of saying that LGBT people have a 'homosexual agenda' because
Bluenorthwest
Oct 2015
#110
Hussein is Obama's real middle name but you know what it means when people use it...
lame54
Oct 2015
#96
I'm gay and I have an agenda and yet to talk about the homosexual agenda is in fact gay baiting
Bluenorthwest
Oct 2015
#106