2016 Postmortem

Persondem

(2,101 posts)

185. Bernie lurches rigtward as well. He calls for bombing and a ground war just like Clinton

Fri Nov 20, 2015, 06:02 PM

Nov 2015

But as usual his ideas are not as developed, so Clinton looks worse by comparison because she has a more developed proposal. What do you think Bernie means by ME countries have to put some "skin in the game"? Clinton didn't say anything about using US troops. The only difference is that Clinton would consider a no-fly zone.

Clinton says she is against lower and middle class tax increases and that is a rightward lurch??? Bullshit.

Sanders has NOTHING on his campaign website about single payer. He is running away from it because calling for trillions in new taxes is a non-starter for a presidential candidate. And if you believe differently you are very politically naïve.

So nothing about Bernie's rightward lurches???? What a hypocrite.

As usual ... another anti-Clinton post long on bluster, bold text, and indignation yet very short on substance. This is getting to be a habit for you folks.

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Clinton Sheds Progressive Façade with Bold Rightward Lurch [View all] RiverLover Nov 2015 OP

She can't get the Progressive vote, so in_cog_ni_to Nov 2015 #1

No kidding. RiverLover Nov 2015 #3

Exactly. in_cog_ni_to Nov 2015 #156

Why would ANY right leaning US citizen vote for her when they can just have a republican? sibelian Nov 2015 #34

Exactly. in_cog_ni_to Nov 2015 #72

her platform covers a TINY proportion of the Republican base... TINY. sibelian Nov 2015 #89

You got that right...Hillary is becoming a parody of herself. InAbLuEsTaTe Nov 2015 #103

Perhaps she's anticipating widespread disgust with GOP candidates Volaris Nov 2015 #193

"Last I heard, the true Liberals /Progressives are anti-war, so she doesn't have those votes." Elmer S. E. Dump Nov 2015 #209

Thank you! in_cog_ni_to Nov 2015 #154

It's a really dangerous strategy - SHE COULD LOSE relying on them. sibelian Nov 2015 #160

Shhh! Aerows Nov 2015 #181

Ha! She's hunting rabids.... SammyWinstonJack Nov 2015 #198

Figured someone would get that one Aerows Nov 2015 #202

That's been the ongoing problem for the party for years now Scootaloo Nov 2015 #228

Because the smart ones know that controlling Congress through gerrymandering and gridlock... dogknob Nov 2015 #264

Declaring a 'no-fly zone' over Syria would place the U.S. on a collision KingCharlemagne Nov 2015 #57

Considering the nest of vipers she was speaking to... Oilwellian Nov 2015 #132

Are they going to rig the voting machines... CoffeeCat Nov 2015 #233

OMG...a nightmare waiting to happen. WWIII, without a doubt. n/t in_cog_ni_to Nov 2015 #157

Doesn't the self-destruction in the R's make more moderate conservative R's in play? HereSince1628 Nov 2015 #71

It hasn't in any election before. No reason to think it suddenly will this time. jeff47 Nov 2015 #113

"Doesn't the self-destruction in the R's make more moderate conservative R's in play?" in_cog_ni_to Nov 2015 #158

Yes, but the tea-party just wants to destroy the federal gov't. HereSince1628 Nov 2015 #174

But aren't you talking DLC ideas in your post? jwirr Nov 2015 #208

My recollection of it is it is rather older than that HereSince1628 Nov 2015 #211

Created in 1985 by Al From and used by Bill Clinton in his jwirr Nov 2015 #213

I'm not buying the notion... CoffeeCat Nov 2015 #234

they go after GOP votes differently: Clinton mimics Pub positions, MisterP Nov 2015 #129

The GOP won't vote for her AgingAmerican Nov 2015 #142

I much prefer Bernie's way! in_cog_ni_to Nov 2015 #159

RIGHT WING WARMONGER AlbertCat Nov 2015 #192

Morphing has always been her forte orpupilofnature57 Nov 2015 #2

Actually I'm very surprised, I thought for sure she would wait.... daleanime Nov 2015 #4

I thought the same. RiverLover Nov 2015 #7

Either that, or she's getting pushback from her donors. n/t winter is coming Nov 2015 #30

Most of those high dollar donors in particular exist in a very tight bubble. Enthusiast Nov 2015 #41

and those donors know how the game is played... CoffeeCat Nov 2015 #230

I got nothing too. Beware, CoffeeCat, Enthusiast Nov 2015 #240

Luckily, I have... CoffeeCat Nov 2015 #247

Hillary could run on the Republican ticket and win INdemo Nov 2015 #26

I suggested that at the start of the nomination process.... daleanime Nov 2015 #35

Hey, I wouldn't go that far... Herman4747 Nov 2015 #131

she could beat the crazies INdemo Nov 2015 #139

Her GOP tactics: Lying about who gets tax increases/breaks cprise Nov 2015 #178

That was before Paris gave her a tragedy to exploit n/t arcane1 Nov 2015 #151

The weathervane is leading the way. People are afraid - she jwirr Nov 2015 #210

A Democrat voting for Hillary is what we all say about Republican voters... tecelote Nov 2015 #5

And a vote to destroy more brown lives globally. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Nov 2015 #6

Did you listen to Sanders's speech about ISIS? It wasn't exactly pacifistic. Buzz Clik Nov 2015 #61

Doesn't that depend on what the alternative is? ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #8

Nope. That's why we have to get Bernie the nomination. peacebird Nov 2015 #9

While I can understand why you think ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #12

Because if we are going to spend ever more on war, & less on Americans the pres may as well be R peacebird Nov 2015 #14

Okay. You just go with that silly sentiment ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #17

Hopefully people will realize Bernie is by far the better person for the job, &give him the nom! peacebird Nov 2015 #54

And if people come to a different conclusion? ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #109

Yes. I choose Bernie. peacebird Nov 2015 #175

You are willing to waste your vote by writing in Bernie on the G/E ballot? Okay! ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #179

As I have already stated in the past. If Hillary gets the Nom then the DLC/thirdwayers have won peacebird Nov 2015 #189

I think whatever you decide is your business... CoffeeCat Nov 2015 #250

And if people come to a different conclusion? ... AlbertCat Nov 2015 #194

OH stop acting like there aren't Bernie supporters that haven't said ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #241

OH stop acting like there aren't Bernie supporters that haven't said ... AlbertCat Nov 2015 #242

LOL ... Re-read the post you responded to ... Then, take a bow! n/t 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #243

Re-read the post you responded to AlbertCat Nov 2015 #244

Or you can just exercise a measure of self restraint ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #246

And really is it your job to police a message board... CoffeeCat Nov 2015 #252

LOL ... Except on the internet ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #256

It's equivalent of walking down the street... CoffeeCat Nov 2015 #259

No it's not! ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #261

For many of us... jack_krass Nov 2015 #221

"I'll deal with that if/when it happens" AlbertCat Nov 2015 #262

Clinton has made no effort to make us think she won't continue the status quo that has rhett o rick Nov 2015 #173

Beyond the primaries ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #177

I see it as do or die for the 99% in the primary. We need to fight like there is no tomorrow rhett o rick Nov 2015 #187

Is that a Yes or a No to my question? ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #196

This message was self-deleted by its author tex-wyo-dem Nov 2015 #248

No. peacebird Nov 2015 #190

Beyond the primaries ... AlbertCat Nov 2015 #195

I was addressing that narrow segment of DU that has said will not vote for HRC, ever. n/t 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #197

I'll be honest 1SBM... tex-wyo-dem Nov 2015 #249

Well ... Thank you for your honestsy ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #255

"Different", in what way? Can you really say that with confidence? tex-wyo-dem Nov 2015 #257

Different in what way? ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #258

Maybe not in the crazy teabagger sort of way... tex-wyo-dem Nov 2015 #263

Well ... Yeah, except for some "socially progressive bones" ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #265

Really? Ok, now you're being cheeky... tex-wyo-dem Nov 2015 #267

Is she to the right of Bernie? ... Absolutely, but to put her on the same page as republicans ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #268

I won't be party to it....I am not a lemming Demeter Nov 2015 #53

Would HRC be a better alternative than ANY of the republican candidates? n/t 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #106

No Demeter Nov 2015 #121

Okay ... We are done. n/t 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #128

Agree, she is adopting their ideology AgingAmerican Nov 2015 #147

More than that, she's destroying the Party and the concept of democracy Demeter Nov 2015 #148

DWS/Hillary are taking a calculated risk to gain her the Democratic nomination AgingAmerican Nov 2015 #149

And that GE loss will be blamed on "The Left" for not surrendering n/t arcane1 Nov 2015 #152

This time it will be very obvious just whose fault it is AgingAmerican Nov 2015 #153

No peacebird Nov 2015 #191

+1. closeupready Nov 2015 #123

I've heard this before: Sanders or no one else. Buzz Clik Nov 2015 #62

The really silly part about this is ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #107

Not true... tex-wyo-dem Nov 2015 #260

Bernie Sanders is the best ethical choice we have Android3.14 Nov 2015 #11

No ... I do not agree that is Bernie the "only ethical" choice. 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #13

What is silly is changing "best ethical" to "only ethical" in a reply. nt TheBlackAdder Nov 2015 #22

Ok, BUT .... Buzz Clik Nov 2015 #65

It's not even that complicated ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #95

Oy. Buzz Clik Nov 2015 #97

Yes. I will give him/her that ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #105

I didn't change what the OP said ... The OP went back and edited .. 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #94

They said best, not only nt Luciferous Nov 2015 #38

NO they didn't ... not in the original post that I replied to. n/t 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #96

Misquoting someone from a very short post is incredibly bad form. Bohunk68 Nov 2015 #47

And it is worst form to criticize someone, with i9ncomplete facts ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #98

Not anymore. jeff47 Nov 2015 #114

best, not only; Best, Not Only; BEST NOT ONLY! Divernan Nov 2015 #48

How about going back and read the post's edit history? ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #102

You could have changed your post within a minute as well, Divernan Nov 2015 #122

Really ... Why should I change MY response to his/her initial question? 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #130

Hey I shamed you into cleaning up your language! That's progress! Divernan Nov 2015 #133

You think way too much of yourself. n/t 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #138

The only ethical choice, by my lights Doctor_J Nov 2015 #64

Mine too. Enthusiast Nov 2015 #93

"pounced on"? ... LOL ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #92

A non-vote is by definition not a vote. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Nov 2015 #33

Okay. Then, CHOOSING against one's self-interest. n/t 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2015 #87

I do agree with you on this. Despite what many say, Hillary is not a Republican. tecelote Nov 2015 #37

Ahh, the slow death route: MattSh Nov 2015 #63

EXACTLY ! TIME TO PANIC Nov 2015 #184

Trump vs Clinton: Mussolini vs Nixon, so I may hold my nose and vote Nixon zazen Nov 2015 #40

Exactly. tecelote Nov 2015 #42

Adults must sometimes vote AGAINST the greater evil. is what I plan KingCharlemagne Nov 2015 #59

Exactly. tecelote Nov 2015 #111

Here campaign will be rolling out a new slogan next week: "Country First" Scuba Nov 2015 #10

COMMON DREAMS...that explains things brooklynite Nov 2015 #15

Yes awful progressives and liberals. The scourge of America Armstead Nov 2015 #74

No objection to progressives -- just over the top writing brooklynite Nov 2015 #81

It's a sickness, she can't help it Demeter Nov 2015 #16

Clintons' current net worth (personal, not foundation) is +$80 million Divernan Nov 2015 #50

She's obviously been blessed. Cheese Sandwich Nov 2015 #134

Is she saying we can't afford safeinOhio Nov 2015 #18

Unnecessary counterproductive wars of choice. Enthusiast Nov 2015 #45

Hard to take any article that considers an attack on raising the taxes on the middle class Amimnoch Nov 2015 #19

So you don't think some of the $645 BILLION spent annually by our pentagon RiverLover Nov 2015 #20

Odd tangent. I have issue with the tax on the middle class and that somehow equates to the Amimnoch Nov 2015 #24

My point was to highlight Clinton using the republican response ag universal hc rather than RiverLover Nov 2015 #29

Then you probably won't like this tangent either. Do you know that Single payer A Simple Game Nov 2015 #55

I know, right? arikara Nov 2015 #135

That's exactly it. Hammered... RiverLover Nov 2015 #136

The middle class will get their tax hike back 5-10 times over in healthcare and education Doctor_J Nov 2015 #28

Oh you are just so darn cute with your hypocritical indignation. Amimnoch Nov 2015 #43

That's your answer to the cost being offset? frylock Nov 2015 #145

Taxing the middle class is a straw man fasttense Nov 2015 #73

At this point a middle.class.tax increase will SwampG8r Nov 2015 #101

How astute. Thank you for the enlightenment that I no longer exist. Amimnoch Nov 2015 #108

You are proving my point SwampG8r Nov 2015 #110

Oh you exist alright fasttense Nov 2015 #269

Such unmitigated bullshit. Substituting a cheaper tax for a more expensive premium-- eridani Nov 2015 #222

anyone who thinks she's a liberal is a thundering idiot Doctor_J Nov 2015 #21

Anyone who thinks Bernie can accomplish any of the false promises he's making is a thundering idiot. Amimnoch Nov 2015 #51

I still don't know what she has done zalinda Nov 2015 #77

Check out my response to Frylock below yours for the Senate details. Amimnoch Nov 2015 #162

List of 3 of Hillary's accomplishments in Congress. frylock Nov 2015 #146

Besides being the first EVER ex-FLOTUS to have her own post presidency political career, and Amimnoch Nov 2015 #161

Was instrumental; was a leader; was a central and driving force; blahblahblah frylock Nov 2015 #165

Thank you! I was pretty sure you had nothing to come back with. Amimnoch Nov 2015 #166

Your old man? frylock Nov 2015 #167

There, fixed for your delicate sensitivities. Amimnoch Nov 2015 #168

You didn't fix shit. frylock Nov 2015 #169

Come on Frylock Amimnoch Nov 2015 #170

Naw, we're done here. frylock Nov 2015 #171

Jury results: TacoD Nov 2015 #172

This post should be an op. SunSeeker Nov 2015 #219

Mahalo Amimnoch! Cha Nov 2015 #227

Thank you for your leadership Secretary Clinton philosslayer Nov 2015 #23

Now that Sanders has become a non-factor, she can move to the center in preparation for Freddie Stubbs Nov 2015 #25

That would still be further left than she would govern. Cassiopeia Nov 2015 #32

The center of the right Armstead Nov 2015 #76

btw, to those who thought Bernie's success would force Clinton to actually move left Doctor_J Nov 2015 #27

+1 /nt RiverLover Nov 2015 #31

Hillary's remarks about single payer and taxes nauseated me. Enthusiast Nov 2015 #36

and? rtracey Nov 2015 #49

Thank you! U of M Dem Nov 2015 #68

you really are missing my point rtracey Nov 2015 #112

Aha! U of M Dem Nov 2015 #125

no rtracey Nov 2015 #137

Kicked and recommended! Enthusiast Nov 2015 #39

Once A Neocon - Neoliberal -- Always A Neocon - Neoliberal cantbeserious Nov 2015 #44

She's awful (nt) bigwillq Nov 2015 #46

It's a Big Club, and We Ain't in It. gordyfl Nov 2015 #52

The bolded adage s/b “If you can’t BEAT them, join them" dorkzilla Nov 2015 #70

The laughable mask is off. CharlotteVale Nov 2015 #56

Good demwing Nov 2015 #58

Yawn. This kind of mudslinging in unbecoming of progressives. Buzz Clik Nov 2015 #60

Hillary's platform is unbecoming of democrats Doctor_J Nov 2015 #66

More mudslinging and this time with insults. QED. Buzz Clik Nov 2015 #67

this post is full of gravitas ibegurpard Nov 2015 #80

Here's the thing: Buzz Clik Nov 2015 #85

you're the one supporting her positions ibegurpard Nov 2015 #88

No, I don't. I only have to cast a vote. Buzz Clik Nov 2015 #90

You are what are. 99Forever Nov 2015 #118

Hillary supporters whine a lot about every story. Nt Logical Nov 2015 #229

Hillary is the neoliberal candidate. N/T U of M Dem Nov 2015 #69

Yeah! Third Way!!!!!1111 Buzz Clik Nov 2015 #91

Yep RiverLover Nov 2015 #99

The "lessons" are exercises in rhetoric from one set of ideologues. Buzz Clik Nov 2015 #104

The long-prevalent anti-red propaganda- U of M Dem Nov 2015 #127

Told ya so.... humbled_opinion Nov 2015 #75

Hillary 2016! ibegurpard Nov 2015 #78

I will support and vote for my candidate.. mountain grammy Nov 2015 #79

+1 Enthusiast Nov 2015 #100

So she regrets the Iraq war vote but is pusing for more war in the process d_legendary1 Nov 2015 #82

It's the definition of insanity. RiverLover Nov 2015 #86

The new Republicans comes to mind d_legendary1 Nov 2015 #126

I didn't think the return of Sybil would be this fast Bread and Circus Nov 2015 #83

I'm shocked!!!1!!11! Cosmic Kitten Nov 2015 #84

Warp-speed, exit platform right Hepburn Nov 2015 #115

Hillary taunts progressives with "Who ya gonna vote for?" Ino Nov 2015 #116

ugh. PoliticalMalcontent Nov 2015 #215

Let's not forget this classic... Indepatriot Nov 2015 #232

K/R UglyGreed Nov 2015 #117

This message was self-deleted by its author olddots Nov 2015 #119

I was surprised Common Dreams published this and yet we will continue to see Hillary supporters Todays_Illusion Nov 2015 #120

I am not going to vote for her. closeupready Nov 2015 #124

She's a Republican now AgingAmerican Nov 2015 #141

And even if someone said 'no, she's not', I don't think she cares which party closeupready Nov 2015 #143

In a nutshell nolabels Nov 2015 #245

She doesn't have convictions AgingAmerican Nov 2015 #140

Well, that didn't take long. First debate Progressive. Push comes to shove - strong right lurch. EndElectoral Nov 2015 #144

Hillary is thinking beyond the primaries to the general election. Beacool Nov 2015 #150

if you support her policies ibegurpard Nov 2015 #164

It's always been a facade. And, a pretty unconvincing one. Tierra_y_Libertad Nov 2015 #155

She wasn't fooling *anyone*. Her supporters are DU's most conservative. nt Romulox Nov 2015 #163

"Massive right wing lurch" upaloopa Nov 2015 #176

Did you even read the article? It gave examples of her move to the right. totodeinhere Nov 2015 #180

"From her call for a major air and ground war against ISIS to her attack on single-payer" upaloopa Nov 2015 #182

I don't agree with you but at least now I know where you are coming from which I didn't before. totodeinhere Nov 2015 #207

"she'll be the most hawkish Democratic nominee since the Iraq War began." Ed Suspicious Nov 2015 #183

Bernie lurches rigtward as well. He calls for bombing and a ground war just like Clinton Persondem Nov 2015 #185

Utter BS. Outrageous for you to say such a vile, outright untruth. RiverLover Nov 2015 #203

Here are the quotes from Sanders Persondem Nov 2015 #223

And he never mentions troops on the ground. Why kill our young Americans just to create more RiverLover Nov 2015 #237

Only the GOP candidates want US boots on the ground. nt. Persondem Nov 2015 #251

Along with Hillary. She & the GOP have much in common. Like this article points out. RiverLover Nov 2015 #254

Perhaps you don't know the difference between special ops and regular troops. Persondem Nov 2015 #266

Kicked and recommended. Uncle Joe Nov 2015 #186

.... RiverLover Nov 2015 #201

It was my pleasure. Uncle Joe Nov 2015 #217

Thank God, she's going to fight terrorism by demanding that no one be able to encrypt their phones. Warren DeMontague Nov 2015 #188

Give her a break. After all, she was attacked by sniper fire and is probably suffering from PTSD. Live and Learn Nov 2015 #199

Façade? You mean there are actually chumps that bought that crap? 99Forever Nov 2015 #200

This Is Who She Is, And THIS Is What Our Democratic Party ChiciB1 Nov 2015 #204

I will never vote for her. azmom Nov 2015 #205

but how else will Central America be subjected to throat-slashing cartel oligarchs?! MisterP Nov 2015 #226

Her comments on health care and taxes are bullshit. blackspade Nov 2015 #206

F#CK THIS SH#T SHRED Nov 2015 #212

"I don’t think any sensible person would disagree that the invasion of Iraq led to......." seafan Nov 2015 #214

She's losing the progressives, so she's going after the disgruntled Republicans. YOHABLO Nov 2015 #216

Is this who we have become? wouldsman Nov 2015 #218

It feels to me like this Hillary Push has finally crushed the fight for the soul of the Party RiverLover Nov 2015 #238

Kick and R BeanMusical Nov 2015 #220

Once a war monger, always a war monger RoccoR5955 Nov 2015 #224

The more she "changes" the more she stays the same. BeanMusical Nov 2015 #235

Hillary Drafting Young Donors for 2017 ISIS Ground War LS_Editor Nov 2015 #225

The polls show Bernie doing better against the Republicans than Hillary does. JDPriestly Nov 2015 #231

Kick and R BeanMusical Nov 2015 #236

Thanks for the kick, Bean!! RiverLover Nov 2015 #239

Even a bat could see through that one. nt Zorra Nov 2015 #253