History of Feminism

seabeyond

(110,159 posts)

124. "Instead, my reaction is to question my own feelings." this is the problem.

Mon Aug 20, 2012, 11:22 AM

Aug 2012

this is the issue. this is why i really really want you to look in the eyes and challenge. you are allowed to be rude. we are raised to not be rude. but, you get to if you want. you do NOT have to be the "nice girl". this is why i was so pissed with the waiter rubbing his crotch on my 13 yr old niece and my older friend sat there and said nothing. i was so fuckin pissed off at her. speak the fuck up. do NOT be embarrassed adn if you are, tough shit. for the NEXT girl. and then i was pissed off at niece and her friend cause they lowered head and stayed quiet. i told her. do you THINK i would have kept my mouth shut. do you THINK i would have worried about embarrassment. shout it the fuck out if you have/want to.

same with your daughter and the boys in class.

we have to teach our girls, from example, to not lower eyes and stay quiet. that is their BEST defense.

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women, please tell your experience. some men do not get it. 19, 10pm, college campus [View all] seabeyond Aug 2012 OP

No recent stories ismnotwasm Aug 2012 #1

it did not feel right. seabeyond Aug 2012 #2

It's messed up isn't it? ismnotwasm Aug 2012 #3

it is. messed up. it says a hell of a lot that a woman seabeyond Aug 2012 #4

The latest one... the guy that lives in this complex... I made the mistake of speaking to him. redqueen Aug 2012 #5

Stuff like this has not happened to me since I was a teenager. MadrasT Aug 2012 #6

this is a very interesting post madrast. seabeyond Aug 2012 #7

I forgot the perennial favorite... MadrasT Aug 2012 #12

ya ya ya. lol. i got that one. my fav is going from virgin, to lesbian, to slut all in a moment seabeyond Aug 2012 #13

Another... MadrasT Aug 2012 #15

I'm not the one whining, manipulating, and begging for it. seabeyond Aug 2012 #16

My "NO" is getting much firmer and much more formidable. MadrasT Aug 2012 #23

I used to worry about hurting their feelings seabeyond Aug 2012 #24

"It's just sex. What's the big deal?" CrispyQ Aug 2012 #89

This: CrispyQ Aug 2012 #21

media's influence, the boys-will-be-boys mentality seabeyond Aug 2012 #22

Guys can convince themselves . . . caseymoz Aug 2012 #25

"... they treat the female like a soda machine that just stole their change." redqueen Aug 2012 #32

actually this scenario feels more like the "nice" guy thing. but i am nice. in reality seabeyond Aug 2012 #33

Not as weird as you might think caseymoz Aug 2012 #35

interesting casey. thanks. nt seabeyond Aug 2012 #39

but basically, what you are giving us an example of is male privilege. nt seabeyond Aug 2012 #40

There's definitely male privilege . . . caseymoz Aug 2012 #46

i think you gave an example of objectifying. to not see the woman as a person seabeyond Aug 2012 #47

No, the man knows the woman is a person caseymoz Aug 2012 #72

you are taking objectification way to literally. it would be the man sees the woman on the "tool" seabeyond Aug 2012 #77

study... Dehumanizing seabeyond Aug 2012 #79

I'll have to look at this carefully. caseymoz Aug 2012 #95

showing overt sexuality automatically score below zero in status with some people, male or female, seabeyond Aug 2012 #96

With some people that's true. caseymoz Aug 2012 #105

It's happening to men more, because men are now increasingly portrayed as sex objects as well. redqueen Aug 2012 #102

Pretend or believe. caseymoz Aug 2012 #106

This message was self-deleted by its author redqueen Aug 2012 #107

What is offensive is that this very old, well-established concept redqueen Aug 2012 #108

There are more examples . . . caseymoz Aug 2012 #109

Yeah, objectification is just ... like ... a myth. redqueen Aug 2012 #110

Snark??? Honest, no. caseymoz Aug 2012 #112

"Difficult to read" = snark. It very much IS NOT difficult to read. redqueen Aug 2012 #113

You said you didn't have the patience. caseymoz Aug 2012 #115

jumping in late, but I get his questions about objectification zazen Aug 2012 #134

The National Organization for Women has been trying to raise awareness on this issue for years. redqueen Aug 2012 #135

I have a PhD and have been a radical feminist since 1986, zazen Aug 2012 #140

The argument put forth was that if a man talks to a woman, he can't be objectifying her, redqueen Aug 2012 #142

side of the brain as tool, to "be used" not a thing. we probably need ot be more clear so a man is seabeyond Aug 2012 #144

Willful blindness. n/t MadrasT Aug 2012 #141

OMG, and this is so reinforced by PUA bullcrap. redqueen Aug 2012 #41

yes. i am assuming casey is explaining yet not validating and that it is SOME men. cause it seabeyond Aug 2012 #42

Yeah, definitely not all men (it's so annoying having to constantly reaffirm we're not man-haters) redqueen Aug 2012 #44

for me this is the flip side of the coin. this is when MEN declare ALL men because it works for them seabeyond Aug 2012 #48

My, my. I knew we'd agree on something. caseymoz Aug 2012 #36

"heterosexual males are more on the same wavelength. The physical features desired ... redqueen Aug 2012 #37

I really think MadrasT Aug 2012 #38

LOL, no kidding. redqueen Aug 2012 #43

We don't have to that 'feminism 101' crap here do we? ismnotwasm Aug 2012 #67

This message was self-deleted by its author caseymoz Aug 2012 #71

This message was self-deleted by its author MadrasT Aug 2012 #73

*I didn't call *you* a denier. MadrasT Aug 2012 #75

My sincere apology then. caseymoz Aug 2012 #94

Yes, they do play on it with men caseymoz Aug 2012 #70

Guys have 'generally' desired different features based on the fashion of the times. redqueen Aug 2012 #74

when we were gorillas way back when, the BUTT, had everything to do with it. so evo had to create seabeyond Aug 2012 #76

I'm also skeptical of the theory . . . caseymoz Aug 2012 #86

Obviously, preferences are learned caseymoz Aug 2012 #84

"massive amounts on cosmetic surgery" yes ... viagra, balding, weight loss. seabeyond Aug 2012 #85

And this is because our population is aging. caseymoz Aug 2012 #93

i do not agree with your first conclusion, but, this is fun discussion. seabeyond Aug 2012 #97

Yes, men have alway aged. caseymoz Aug 2012 #114

I tried and completely failed to get some of this across over in the men's group Warren Stupidity Aug 2012 #8

Thanks for trying. MadrasT Aug 2012 #9

appreciate it. it really is pretty well known, so i was surprised to hear anyone come across seabeyond Aug 2012 #10

As somebody else here remarked, it threatens a sense of entitlement. Warren Stupidity Aug 2012 #14

required to be escorted by a male relative seabeyond Aug 2012 #17

"Sort of discouraging." redqueen Aug 2012 #11

That's really what it seems like, rq. MadrasT Aug 2012 #45

It is SO spot on. redqueen Aug 2012 #49

pretty girls in high school were so mean to them... and all the geek girls saying 'hey guys? seabeyond Aug 2012 #51

I was not a nerd, but not popular, either. CrispyQ Aug 2012 #88

that would be interesting. i never thought much about it way back then. seabeyond Aug 2012 #90

very good. i forgot. so when men say it is just the way they are, it is bullshit. it is created seabeyond Aug 2012 #50

We have a culture that caters to 11-year-old-men. CrispyQ Aug 2012 #87

i am so with you on this post. watching daily show the other night. some athlete had an erection seabeyond Aug 2012 #91

It's like Alice and the looking glass. MadrasT Aug 2012 #92

Lots of incidents when I was younger. One from more recently. CrispyQ Aug 2012 #18

"Fucking bitch!" ... wowwowowow... lol. no way. seabeyond Aug 2012 #19

I get more of it NOW, as a middle-aged, overweight woman. redqueen Aug 2012 #20

My reply to "Smile!" is "Dance!" eShirl Aug 2012 #78

ha ha. that is funny. i like. nt seabeyond Aug 2012 #80

LOL love it! Scout Aug 2012 #81

I'm going to try that next time. CrispyQ Aug 2012 #83

One semester I had a class that went until 10 pm, too. 2labslib Aug 2012 #26

i just made sure i walked out with someone and parked in the closer lots. i was a swimmer so would seabeyond Aug 2012 #28

Dad has three kids, all girls. He gets it. N/T 2labslib Aug 2012 #30

3 girls will do it. and seabeyond Aug 2012 #31

Thank you! 2labslib Aug 2012 #34

You were not over-reacting! CrispyQ Aug 2012 #101

I went back to college in my 50s HockeyMom Aug 2012 #27

there is that consideration also..... nt seabeyond Aug 2012 #29

As a man... Z_California Aug 2012 #52

this is sad, that you would refuse to try to understand where a womans sense of danger may play seabeyond Aug 2012 #53

Fuck this is exhausting. MadrasT Aug 2012 #55

it has to be done purposely or so programmed with entitlement and privilege that there is just the seabeyond Aug 2012 #56

Another apology Z_California Aug 2012 #57

hey, that was quite a while ago and giving a heads up pertaining to a thread of men not understandin seabeyond Aug 2012 #58

A parking lot is not a pick up joint. redqueen Aug 2012 #62

that is troll trying its pathetic best to troll Warren Stupidity Aug 2012 #98

i certainly thought that. i have had food for thought though. it seems an autoreaction to what is seabeyond Aug 2012 #99

Is it really so difficult to understand the difference between treating someone like a person, redqueen Aug 2012 #54

Fine Line Z_California Aug 2012 #59

what would happen, god forbid, if you actually listened. maybe even googled women safety and see seabeyond Aug 2012 #60

Nonsense. redqueen Aug 2012 #61

I get it Z_California Aug 2012 #63

hey... i love this post. i think if given a chance you would find MOST ALL of us on mens side. seabeyond Aug 2012 #64

No, thank you Z_California Aug 2012 #65

the thing is, i am a very friendly person and chat with everyone in public and not really seabeyond Aug 2012 #66

Well it's a fact. Some women just don't get it. redqueen Aug 2012 #68

that is why i will take on girls and women, too. for them to own theirs. you are right on redq seabeyond Aug 2012 #69

My experience is that being a single guy is one of the easiest of all the human experiences LanternWaste May 2013 #145

Chatting up a girl in a public place is one thing gollygee May 2013 #146

Ah yes. The nice guy. ismnotwasm Aug 2012 #82

i knew there was a post i wanted to come back to. this was it. seabeyond Aug 2012 #100

I can't imagine myself imposing on a stranger in that way. MineralMan Aug 2012 #103

thanks MM. of course you would consider it. every man i know is aware seabeyond Aug 2012 #104

Remember the crap spewed about Rebecca Watson? redqueen Aug 2012 #111

Creepy guy staring at me on the elevator this morning. redqueen Aug 2012 #116

there are men that purposely work on making women uncomfortable. look him in the eye, and say WHAT? seabeyond Aug 2012 #117

It makes me feel queasy even thinking about doing that. redqueen Aug 2012 #119

do it a couple times. gets easy. especially if there are others in the elevator. he is COUNTING seabeyond Aug 2012 #122

This guy I'd talked to before, he seemed nice. redqueen Aug 2012 #125

eeeew. seabeyond Aug 2012 #127

It sounds like he's off some sort of medication he should be taking ProudToBeBlueInRhody Aug 2012 #136

and most all of us women have experienced men that think they can say whatever the fuck they want seabeyond Aug 2012 #137

I'm responding specifically to the situation redqueen discussed ProudToBeBlueInRhody Aug 2012 #138

thank you for the clarification. appreciated. seabeyond Aug 2012 #139

Could be. Could be a head injury, those can also radically change a personality. redqueen Aug 2012 #143

I love this approach MadrasT Aug 2012 #121

one has to figure it out. i guess i figure the odds is not in favor of a beating and yes public, seabeyond Aug 2012 #123

We have as much right to vocally and loudly object to unwanted behavior MadrasT Aug 2012 #118

You are so right MadrasT. redqueen Aug 2012 #120

"Instead, my reaction is to question my own feelings." this is the problem. seabeyond Aug 2012 #124

I know... and I told her she should have said something. redqueen Aug 2012 #126

but that has to be stopped. and the only way is to let him know it is not acceptable. seabeyond Aug 2012 #129

Well at one point I did ask him, "So how is your wife?" redqueen Aug 2012 #131

ha ha ha. seabeyond Aug 2012 #132

oh, and seabeyond Aug 2012 #133

I'm a total bitch and I don't care... luvspeas Aug 2012 #128

guys out there who get a woodie from watching women's discomfort in these situations. seabeyond Aug 2012 #130

screaming GET THE FUCK AWAY FROM ME elehhhhna May 2013 #147

ha ha. that is great. i was a "nice" girl back then. i could do it now. nt seabeyond May 2013 #148