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Democratic Primaries
In reply to the discussion: Harris says busing should not be mandated [View all]still_one
(98,883 posts)88. Why busing didn't end school segregation:
https://www.npr.org/sections/ed/2016/10/06/496411024/why-busing-didnt-end-school-segregation
Audie Cornish
... ... ..
"So why did busing fail?
A couple things happen that make it difficult to sustain busing programs into the '80s and '90s.
One is the tremendous amount of white flight that happens in cities like Boston, so there just simply aren't enough white students to go around to have meaningful school desegregation. This is true in Chicago, in Los Angeles, in New York.
The other thing that happens is busing placed a tremendous burden on black students and on students of color. In most cases, they were the ones that were asked to travel to the suburbs, travel sometimes to hostile neighborhoods. For many parents, that simply isn't worth it after a number of years.
If not busing, what were the other ways that schools tried to desegregate in modern times?
There were a couple of popular plans. One would be magnet schools trying to funnel resources into schools primarily in communities of color that would attract white students back to those schools. Those have received different amounts of success in different communities, but it's been a program that has some merit and has been popular for good reason.
Another would be to simply redraw zoning lines. I think one of the reasons that busing got so much attention is that it seemed very inconvenient. They're talking about busing kids a half-hour out of the city. In many communities, if you simply redraw the zoning lines you can accomplish school desegregation. It's still tremendously controversial, but it can still produce meaningful school integration in places that have tried it.
For schools that have tried rezoning, taking race into account has led to trouble with the law.
Exactly there are two issues. One, the Supreme Court has consistently handed down decisions that say that race can't be the primary factor in drawing these school zoning lines. The court does not want to see race be the deciding factor in these school desegregation issues.
The other factor is simply a matter of political will and how much white parents will go for it. Unfortunately, it's the case that across the country, white parents simply don't want to send their kids to schools with large numbers of African-American or Latino students even if they consider themselves to be liberal in theory, or in the abstract, they are in favor of integration.
When push comes to shove ... they oppose any sort of meaningful school integration.
Can you elaborate? What does that mean and what does that look like?
I think one of the challenges of what the Obama Administration is proposing is the voluntary aspect. I think voluntary is great, but the number of school districts that are willing to take this on? I think the Century Foundation has been doing some research on this. It's something like 1 percent of school districts in the country are attempting these programs. I don't think that's going to scale much beyond 5 percent or 10 percent unless there is real political will put behind it.
I think it's great to offer some cash incentives and encourage people to take this on voluntarily. But the history of the last five decades is that school districts simply won't do this voluntarily and that if we want to see meaningful school desegregation whether that is in terms of socioeconomic status or race it has to be encouraged"
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
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That wasn't it. I grew up in New York City, and busing was almost unanimously opposed....
George II
Jul 2019
#90
He lives in an ivory tower...we stopped pursuing this policy because it made things worse and,
Demsrule86
Jul 2019
#108
Oh so now I am not a liberal because I don't want to lose the election over a 40 year old
Demsrule86
Jul 2019
#185
white flight into other completely separated school districts ended the practice, no way schools
beachbum bob
Jul 2019
#118
In the 80's ...the busing of black children almost resulted in attempted murder as someone
Demsrule86
Jul 2019
#186
These were people opposed to busing...and yes they were domestic terrorists...but the policy was
Demsrule86
Jul 2019
#190
My point was even going into the 80's busing was a divisive failed policy...and in 2007 busing
Demsrule86
Jul 2019
#192
The fact that some resorted to violence to stop busing isn't an effective argument against busing
StarfishSaver
Jul 2019
#193
I knew she would say that soon. She's not dumb enough to leave the murder weapon lying around.
marylandblue
Jul 2019
#6
You find the link. It is history. Liberal democrats and some northern republicans
Blue_true
Jul 2019
#177
Some people ask for links just to stall, divert and make you do additional work
EffieBlack
Jul 2019
#180
Good point. The bill that Biden co-wrote is part of the congressional record,
Blue_true
Jul 2019
#182
Really? I don't think so...she used it to score a hit in a debate when it was no longer
Demsrule86
Jul 2019
#110
Everyone worked with segregationists in those days...they controlled the comittees...but
Demsrule86
Jul 2019
#184
Biden co-wrote a bill to ban the only solution to entrenched school segregation.
Blue_true
Jul 2019
#187
This is quite disappointing because that was exactly what Biden's position was, and he was maligned
still_one
Jul 2019
#8
Care to explain how court ordered and federally mandated were separate things?
StarfishSaver
Jul 2019
#130
Court ordered addressed systematic segregation. Federally mandated was tied to federal funding.
ucrdem
Jul 2019
#133
If that were true Harris just rejected all current consent decrees. They aren't the same thing. nt
ucrdem
Jul 2019
#167
Yep. Apology. Joe deserves apology from Harris, Booker, Linda Flores , moderators who allowed
emmaverybo
Jul 2019
#55
There was an OP here earlier today suggesting that perhaps Joe Biden has a "hearing problem".
still_one
Jul 2019
#19
Could have signs of premature deafness if we subscribe to the medically tone deaf stereotype of
emmaverybo
Jul 2019
#60
Sadly, it's clear that far too many Democrats have no interest in the facts
StarfishSaver
Jul 2019
#44
No. Busing wasn't mandated. Desegregation through school reassignment was
StarfishSaver
Jul 2019
#47
Are you saying it wasn't court ordered? Wasn't the whole thing left up to the courts to determine
still_one
Jul 2019
#82
I've seen some spin on DU. but never "court-ordered doesn't mean mandatory" - type BS
wyldwolf
Jul 2019
#135
I think the argument being made by some is that Brown Vs The Board of Education never said that
still_one
Jul 2019
#143
I think that is a great question. Audi Cornish from NPR suggested a couple, magnet schools,
still_one
Jul 2019
#164
Magnet schools are a good idea, but they didn't work well then because of residential segregation
StarfishSaver
Jul 2019
#165
Thank you for the insights Starfish. There is no doubt that much of the progress made, has slowly
still_one
Jul 2019
#181
The underlying issue is Biden has a solid record on Civil Rights. Not sure why Democrats
emulatorloo
Jul 2019
#136
There was nothing in that Wikipedia reference or LA Times reference that contradicted anything you
still_one
Jul 2019
#96
As a clinical chemist and software engineer, you probably know quite a bit about your field
EffieBlack
Jul 2019
#159
I understand your point Effie, but that's how people learn, of course they have to be willing to
still_one
Jul 2019
#166
Since the district transferred me to a school 5 miles away,how was I expected to get there and back?
MichMan
Jul 2019
#57
How would you like to have been stuck in a separate, but unequal school, so white folks didn't have
Hoyt
Jul 2019
#74
What would have been a better alternative for desegregating the schools in your community?
StarfishSaver
Jul 2019
#111
Brown Vs The Board of Education was an important decision to disallow establishing racial
still_one
Jul 2019
#106
Once it gets into the press it's out of both their hands. It's here to stay I'm afraid.
ucrdem
Jul 2019
#122
They will get asked relentlessly, it will come up in the debates, the NYT will drone on and on
ucrdem
Jul 2019
#129
Bottom line: Harris handed Joe a GE victory by making him the man who killed busing
ucrdem
Jul 2019
#121
Joe offends someone, they owe him an apology. Someone offends Joe, they owe him an apology.
EffieBlack
Jul 2019
#161
I saw her comments regarding this and she did answer it adeptly. She ended with it should be in the
UniteFightBack
Jul 2019
#146