Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News Editorials & Other Articles General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search
Joe BidenCongratulations to our presumptive Democratic nominee, Joe Biden!
 

lapfog_1

(31,904 posts)
56. So here is the actual problem with any M4A
Fri Sep 27, 2019, 12:40 PM
Sep 2019

yes, the total costs will go down.

yes, our middle class (and to be fair) upper class taxes will go up.

so... what gives? Costs are going down, taxes are going up, where did the savings go...

To corporate profits!

What SHOULD happen is that we all (all of us that work, union job or white collar or minimum wage) should get a huge raise to offset our higher taxes... and, hopefully, the quality of service should be at or near the same as our company or union provided group insurance...

But does anyone actually believe that corporate america will pass along those savings in health care costs to their workers... much like Walmart providing a living wage to their workers instead of telling those workers about social programs that "they should take advantage of" thus passing the cost of those workers on to the rest of us?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

For sound bites in Right Wing attack adds in the General Election? bluewater Sep 2019 #1
That is exactly what I thought when Stephie was going after Warren last night rurallib Sep 2019 #9
That seems to have been the aim in all the debates thus far Bettie Sep 2019 #11
Stephanopolis and tweety probably get a big bonus for getting those words out of her mouth lostnfound Sep 2019 #10
So Chris Matthews, former Chief of Staff to Tip O'Neill, is a Right-Winger? brooklynite Sep 2019 #16
+1 Celerity Sep 2019 #34
He also praised Flight Suit Bush on "Mission Accomplished" day and obsessed about Hillary's.... RhodeIslandOne Sep 2019 #44
I mean qazplm135 Sep 2019 #52
It's too bad "who's paying for the military waste?" RhodeIslandOne Sep 2019 #67
It's also verboten to voters qazplm135 Sep 2019 #68
Not if it's framed as wasteful spending that actually hurts our service members RhodeIslandOne Sep 2019 #69
You're talking about tiny things qazplm135 Sep 2019 #70
And if everyone is afraid to address it, it will never get fixed. RhodeIslandOne Sep 2019 #71
Lots of people who were liberal in 1987 ain't so liberal now. Act_of_Reparation Oct 2019 #80
Yup DBoon Sep 2019 #30
She Should Just Say Mexico Will Pay For It DrFunkenstein Sep 2019 #57
She clearly states that overall costs will go down. No mystery that blm Sep 2019 #2
Why did Warren refused to answer question? Gothmog Sep 2019 #19
point me to where she uses actual numbers like that qazplm135 Sep 2019 #55
+1 Docreed2003 Oct 2019 #76
yup. trying to push her onto the third rail. mopinko Sep 2019 #3
To make it clear that her "big ideas" come with big costs -- and risks -- too. Hoyt Sep 2019 #4
Its an old GOP game to brand people as "tax and spend" Democrats... jcgoldie Sep 2019 #5
People need to see how much their employer chips in for their health insurance. House of Roberts Sep 2019 #6
Well, supposedly, the "market" forces taken over at that point...they compete for workers. With CTyankee Sep 2019 #22
Well increasing healthcare costs are a big part of wage stagnation. Hassin Bin Sober Sep 2019 #29
and how much vanishes "pre tax" from their own pay DBoon Sep 2019 #31
I don't see how they could force that forthemiddle Oct 2019 #74
No employer paying minimum wage is giving employees health insurance now. House of Roberts Oct 2019 #75
Because running from it is how we got here in the first place DrToast Sep 2019 #7
because she knows it would be in a repuke campaign ad for Trump Skittles Sep 2019 #8
M4A won't pass Congress regardless madville Sep 2019 #12
I am proud to say I pay about 17% in taxes mntleo2 Sep 2019 #13
How long will Warren dodge on health care and taxes Gothmog Sep 2019 #14
Political advice for Dems from Jennifer Rubin BeyondGeography Sep 2019 #15
Why will Warren not answer a simple question?? Gothmog Sep 2019 #18
If you want to show Team Biden what a winning message looks like BeyondGeography Sep 2019 #21
Really? Gothmog Sep 2019 #26
Joebamacare trailed M4A 49-44 in the last Q poll BeyondGeography Sep 2019 #38
How is Warren doing with African American voters? Gothmog Sep 2019 #41
Why won't Biden answer a simple question? Fiendish Thingy Sep 2019 #32
Because Biden's plan can be adopted in the real world Gothmog Sep 2019 #35
Message auto-removed Name removed Sep 2019 #17
Because it is the cornerstone of progress. NT TidalWave46 Sep 2019 #20
This message was self-deleted by its author elocs Sep 2019 #23
Societal Savings are not tax revenues and this plan will not work in the real world Gothmog Sep 2019 #27
If only there was another country in the real world who had succeeded in implementing UHC... Fiendish Thingy Sep 2019 #33
How much will Warren's plan cost and how will she pay for it Gothmog Sep 2019 #37
Yes, if any issue is framed a certain way, Fiendish Thingy Sep 2019 #45
At some point the CBO will have to score any bill Gothmog Sep 2019 #46
Some people The Mouth Sep 2019 #39
This message was self-deleted by its author elocs Sep 2019 #47
It was the perfect storm, really The Mouth Sep 2019 #48
This message was self-deleted by its author elocs Sep 2019 #59
Well, I don't want to refight 2016 The Mouth Sep 2019 #65
Warren is avoiding the reality that middle-class Americans would have to pay more in taxes Gothmog Oct 2019 #78
It was a major concern of Matthews because he makes approximately 5 million dollars a year Uncle Joe Sep 2019 #24
I like this ad from Mayor Pete Gothmog Sep 2019 #25
They want to Mondale her. andym Sep 2019 #28
This. aikoaiko Sep 2019 #36
Exactly. Many people consider themseles 'middle class' The Mouth Sep 2019 #40
Why won't she defend taxation? DrToast Sep 2019 #49
Has Amy ever defended taxation? crazytown Sep 2019 #53
Did you just try to "But her emails" the discussion? DrToast Sep 2019 #58
Senator Klobuchar crazytown Sep 2019 #62
You can attack my preferred candidate DrToast Sep 2019 #63
nor you crazytown Sep 2019 #64
She already said she'd raise taxes on the 1%. Doremus Sep 2019 #42
"raise taxes on the top 1%." mitch96 Sep 2019 #43
Remember George Lakoff's "Don't Think of an Elephant" DrFunkenstein Sep 2019 #50
Why is she afraid to have that fight? DrToast Sep 2019 #54
because you have to win more than your side to win a presidential election qazplm135 Sep 2019 #51
So here is the actual problem with any M4A lapfog_1 Sep 2019 #56
73% of people favor [the] public option that would keep private insurance in place. Gothmog Oct 2019 #79
It's a rightwing thing. dawg day Sep 2019 #60
This whole discussion about any candidates' health care "plan" northoftheborder Sep 2019 #61
I agree BeyondGeography Sep 2019 #66
I remember when Warren supported Obamacare Gothmog Sep 2019 #72
Obamacare Has Made People Healthier Gothmog Oct 2019 #73
Will Medicare-for-all hurt the middle class? Warren and Sanders struggle with questions about its im Gothmog Oct 2019 #77
Support for a public option has been increasing, and for Medicare-for-All has been decreasing Gothmog Oct 2019 #81
Latest Discussions»Retired Forums»Democratic Primaries»Why is it so important to...»Reply #56