Democratic Primaries

Kaleva

(40,372 posts)

109. I don't think you know much about shotguns

Wed Nov 6, 2019, 11:41 AM

Nov 2019

The weight of a Mossberg Maverick 88 and an AR-15 is about the same. The recoil of a shotgun loaded with home defense shells is minimal. Smooth bore shotguns, loaded with slugs, are accurate out to 50 yards. Shotguns with rifled barrels are accurate out to 100 yards and more. Accuracy out to 35 yards is achievable with buckshot.

The only reason I can see why one would choose the more expensive AR-15 style carbine for home defense over a pump shotgun such as the Mossberg Maverick 88 is one expects to get into a firefight with multiple home invaders or engage bad guys at ranges of greater then 35 yards. Situations which are extremely rare and about as common as being struck by lightning.

Based on your comments, I'd think a pistol with magazine capacity of 10-15 rounds would be a better choice for you then an AR-15.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

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Beto was really hurt by "Hell yes we're...... [View all] Prosper Nov 2019 OP

Even people who hate guns started to distance themselves from him. aikoaiko Nov 2019 #1

Not me. BlueStater Nov 2019 #3

"There's zero reasons to own those sort of guns" Prosper Nov 2019 #14

So, if it comes down to your life or that of an attacker customerserviceguy Nov 2019 #37

I think most people could not pull the trigger Prosper Nov 2019 #55

Yours is an accurate example of 'absurdum ad reductio.' Again. LanternWaste Nov 2019 #70

How many times a year does the scenario of "it coming NoMoreRepugs Nov 2019 #78

One can tell if a person is concerned about his and his family's safety by looking at the doors Kaleva Nov 2019 #81

An AR-15 is perfect for home self-defense or defense of others in many situations. aikoaiko Nov 2019 #20

"a single 5.56 round can stop a threatening person" BlueStater Nov 2019 #21

Please allow me to explain a few things so that you might understand my position better. aikoaiko Nov 2019 #24

I don't think "less energy" means much in regards to humans getting hit by them. BlueStater Nov 2019 #32

You're right. No one uses legal machine guns to kill people. aikoaiko Nov 2019 #35

What is your definition of a "common rifle"? Marengo Nov 2019 #58

This, I guess? BlueStater Nov 2019 #62

You must be joking. Are you seriously arguing a tube fed, manually lever action is as effective... Marengo Nov 2019 #64

Pretty sure a human is equally as dead or incapacitated if hit by a bullet from one. BlueStater Nov 2019 #65

The metric is neutralizing the threat, and the AR15 is more effective at achieving that than a... Marengo Nov 2019 #68

You neutralize a threat by putting a bullet in it. BlueStater Nov 2019 #72

Hahahahahaha! "Minor operating differences"???? Marengo Nov 2019 #82

Never claimed I knew much about guns. BlueStater Nov 2019 #85

You admit you are not knowledgeable, but expect to be taken seriously when you posit a... Marengo Nov 2019 #89

They shoot and kill criminals. In this circumstance, that's all you need to know. BlueStater Nov 2019 #93

How can you not understand that in a self defense role the AR is SUPERIOR to a lever action rifle? Marengo Nov 2019 #99

Why are you so obtuse? BlueStater Nov 2019 #110

If volume of accurate and effective fire is your metric of power, the AR is clearly the superior... Marengo Nov 2019 #132

Why do you need "multiple" rounds fired at once to stop a criminal? BlueStater Nov 2019 #139

How often do you shoot? What type of firearm do you shoot? Have you shot an AR platform... Marengo Nov 2019 #140

Another example of one individual armed with an AR15 defeating multiple armed intruders, one... Marengo Nov 2019 #133

More gun-lover BS. Christ, this is not a war zone. Get real. Hoyt Nov 2019 #127

If it were not for folks like you Hoyt, many people probably wouldn't be armed at all... Marengo Nov 2019 #134

More gunner BS, taking things out of context to protect your gunz. Hoyt Nov 2019 #137

The only relevant context is that if folks like you didn't rob others homes, it's likely fewer... Marengo Nov 2019 #142

Is that why you are armed and promote gunz? Hoyt Nov 2019 #144

Having had two of my homes burglarized, in part. Has the possibility of encountering an armed... Marengo Nov 2019 #149

You'll get hit by lightning before you get an answer..I asked the same question..Zip AncientGeezer Nov 2019 #152

It appears most experts say the shotgun is the most effective long gun for home defense Kaleva Nov 2019 #91

A shotgun is heavier, harder to aim, more destructive to things around the target, and has LongtimeAZDem Nov 2019 #103

I don't think you know much about shotguns Kaleva Nov 2019 #109

I own three, and I've been shooting since I was 6. I can handle my SXP with no problem. LongtimeAZDem Nov 2019 #117

Then you would know that what you said previously wasn't accurate. Kaleva Nov 2019 #118

A 12-gauge loaded with slugs would kick the woman in the video I posted through the wall LongtimeAZDem Nov 2019 #119

Why would you have a 12 gauge shotgun loaded with 3" magnum rifled slugs for home defense? Kaleva Nov 2019 #120

If you honestly believe she needs a firearm for home defense, then why would you limit her LongtimeAZDem Nov 2019 #121

Because for the following Kaleva Nov 2019 #123

Best of luck to you both LongtimeAZDem Nov 2019 #126

Everybody's situation is different. There is no one correct answer. Kaleva Nov 2019 #129

I decided on a pistol caliber carbine as the primary for home defense. Marengo Nov 2019 #135

I've considered that myself and might still do so. Kaleva Nov 2019 #143

The ballistics of an AR 15 are similar to the guns available Prosper Nov 2019 #56

The AR-15 can fire anything from .22 cal. to shotgun shells Kaleva Nov 2019 #94

Not "out of the box" ..and certainly not w/out changing uppers & barrels AncientGeezer Nov 2019 #111

It's becomeing more and more popular for people to build the AR-15 they want. Kaleva Nov 2019 #112

It would come assembled..."out of the box" AncientGeezer Nov 2019 #114

There is that option for people with money. To buy one preassembled. Kaleva Nov 2019 #115

Where do you buy your parts....50%...send me a link. AncientGeezer Nov 2019 #122

Start with Palmetto State Armory Devil Child Nov 2019 #148

I know of Palmetto....on their site they don't claim to be 50% lower priced AncientGeezer Nov 2019 #151

My error. Kaleva Nov 2019 #161

Got'cha AncientGeezer Nov 2019 #163

Two men armed with handguns enter an occupied home, woman with AR15 kills one and drives... Marengo Nov 2019 #57

You're just nitpicking. BlueStater Nov 2019 #63

Nope, the example effectively destroys your argument, but I understand your need to minimize it Marengo Nov 2019 #66

How? What did you prove? BlueStater Nov 2019 #71

For a strawman to exist, a valid point must be made. You failed in that regard, and I failed to Marengo Nov 2019 #83

The point was that other, less devastating guns can be used effectively for protection. BlueStater Nov 2019 #86

How does someone who proudly admits to lacking knowledge have the credibility to declare... Marengo Nov 2019 #90

You proved an AR-15 can kill a criminal. BlueStater Nov 2019 #92

Nope, you argued handguns are the equal of an AR in a self defense situation. In the citation, ONE.. Marengo Nov 2019 #98

You have ZERO evidence that the same thing couldn't have happened with a Winchester. BlueStater Nov 2019 #108

LOL Wut? We know exactly how this "played out", and how it did is not favorable to your argument. Marengo Nov 2019 #131

You have a news piece. It's not the same as actually being there and it never will be. BlueStater Nov 2019 #138

They are real-life incidents that suggest your claim of "redundancy" may be unfounded. A claim... Marengo Nov 2019 #141

I totally agree mainstreetonce Nov 2019 #101

I liked his condemning "assault weapons." I get, you like them. Hoyt Nov 2019 #10

I think that the RFing came long before Beto made his comments in the September debate. TexasTowelie Nov 2019 #22

Beto had more advantages than most. Money, media darling, RFK aura, good exposure from senate race. aikoaiko Nov 2019 #38

I'm certain that you would like for me to answer TexasTowelie Nov 2019 #39

I, for one, have no idea what you're talking about. cwydro Nov 2019 #47

Are you talking about the Sirota's criticism about Beto's donations from oil company employees? aikoaiko Nov 2019 #52

Several have asked the same question, Tipperary Nov 2019 #69

Beto's campaign woes were not the result of ratfucking. cwydro Nov 2019 #44

Bullshit. His poll numbers didn't change much after that statement. dalton99a Nov 2019 #2

Exactly! In my book, Beto became an even more attractive candidate after his strong anti-gun stand. InAbLuEsTaTe Nov 2019 #12

Copied " Bullshit. His poll numbers didn't change much after that statement." Prosper Nov 2019 #16

You made the assertion, you provide the evidence. dalton99a Nov 2019 #17

What hurt Beto? Prosper Nov 2019 #18

Pardon me because I try to avoid using this language, TexasTowelie Nov 2019 #34

"Beto O'Rourke unfazed by weak poll numbers" Aritcle published 06/09/2019 01:09 PM EDT Kaleva Nov 2019 #60

But he got no benefit from it..even amoungst Democratic Primary voters..it didn't help AncientGeezer Nov 2019 #150

Reads like something's from an NRA "we're not that bad" propaganda operation. BannonsLiver Nov 2019 #4

This area here is starting to look and sound like 2016 and we know Eliot Rosewater Nov 2019 #8

Beto has got time. He is 47 years old. I thnk there will be more opportunites.. Stuart G Nov 2019 #5

+1 MustLoveBeagles Nov 2019 #6

+1 -K&R onetexan Nov 2019 #30

Agreed. That applause line felt good at time but it wasn't worth it. brush Nov 2019 #7

Absolutely not true. It wasn't an "applause line" nt Laura PourMeADrink Nov 2019 #25

Applause line or not, it wasn't worth it. He's out and there was much hope for him. brush Nov 2019 #42

"wasn't worth it" implies conscious purpose. He expressed Laura PourMeADrink Nov 2019 #51

Beto was struggling in the polls as far back as May Kaleva Nov 2019 #61

No he wasn't. Beto has won the "purity" award for the Dem 2020 primary season. McCamy Taylor Nov 2019 #9

If we don't win DownriverDem Nov 2019 #11

He certainly didn't do himself any favors with that stance. cwydro Nov 2019 #13

Beto is young. He has lots more opportunities, such as being VP onetexan Nov 2019 #31

Time will tell. cwydro Nov 2019 #43

Sheez a bit judgmental aren't we onetexan Nov 2019 #48

Not a judgment, simply an opinion. cwydro Nov 2019 #49

If anything, Beto should have gotten a boost from the more ardent pro-control types. Kaleva Nov 2019 #15

I thought he would too wildflower Nov 2019 #96

Post removed Post removed Nov 2019 #19

Post removed Post removed Nov 2019 #23

Hi TexasTowlie MustLoveBeagles Nov 2019 #28

I'm undecided at this point. TexasTowelie Nov 2019 #33

I always thought that Texas was a long shot for us even with Beto in the race MustLoveBeagles Nov 2019 #41

Wow, bitter much? cwydro Nov 2019 #46

There was absolutely zero bullshit Laura PourMeADrink Nov 2019 #26

+1 MustLoveBeagles Nov 2019 #29

Beto was right to say that. We need to start taking guns and removing them from the streets. LonePirate Nov 2019 #27

'We need to start taking guns' Celerity Nov 2019 #75

Except your commonsense, realistic gun legislation won't solve the problem or even come close. LonePirate Nov 2019 #76

So work to repeal the 2nd Amendment, I hope you are younger than me (I am 23) as I will not see Celerity Nov 2019 #77

He should have stayed out of this one, but was pressured on social media Baked Potato Nov 2019 #36

bullshit. jcgoldie Nov 2019 #40

Evidence? Voltaire2 Nov 2019 #45

It was an act of desperation. hack89 Nov 2019 #50

This. cwydro Nov 2019 #53

Beto has absolutely positively the right frame of mind Prosper Nov 2019 #54

It can't be a radical complaint if it's varified...you said Beto verified it AncientGeezer Nov 2019 #158

I agree with his message and I don't think civilians should own AR-15s, AK-47s, etc. OliverQ Nov 2019 #59

I thank him for saying it. TidalWave46 Nov 2019 #67

Where is the evidence of this claim? Joe941 Nov 2019 #73

There is none. Polls were on Beto's side nationally and in Texas liskddksil Nov 2019 #74

Wait, polls were on his side? Tipperary Nov 2019 #80

This thread is referring to a specific policy of mandatory buybacks that Beto proposed liskddksil Nov 2019 #87

But that support did not translate support for Beto Kaleva Nov 2019 #95

Huh? Tipperary Nov 2019 #97

I don't know how to respond to this one? nt liskddksil Nov 2019 #106

I asked why did he quit. Tipperary Nov 2019 #107

+1. It is revisionist bullshit dalton99a Nov 2019 #88

Democrats have sacrificed WAY too much to bad gun control policies already. k2qb3 Nov 2019 #79

I said it before... myohmy2 Nov 2019 #84

Reality backs that sentiment up Cosmocat Nov 2019 #102

He was hurt by the media because he is not courting robbedvoter Nov 2019 #100

Beto took a bold and long-overdue step forward for rational gun safety dlk Nov 2019 #104

He might be selected vice-president candidate Katalino Nov 2019 #105

welcome to DU gopiscrap Nov 2019 #116

Who knows MustLoveBeagles Nov 2019 #124

No. nt Tipperary Nov 2019 #130

I'll decalre Now... No.....he won't be. AncientGeezer Nov 2019 #159

I know this was political suicide for Beto... sacto95834 Nov 2019 #113

Your view may not be as unpopular as you think MustLoveBeagles Nov 2019 #125

Popular here, except for a few gunners. Hoyt Nov 2019 #128

But it didn't increase support in the Democratic Primary voter base outside of here. AncientGeezer Nov 2019 #153

Ah, go oil your gunz, Old Geezer. You'll get more agreement on the Discussionist. Hoyt Nov 2019 #154

My stuff is fine....I'm obsessive about maintenance... ATV's, trucks, boat, anything AncientGeezer Nov 2019 #155

More out of context links from a gunner. Hoyt Nov 2019 #156

"More out of context links from a gunner." AncientGeezer Nov 2019 #157

So why hasn't Tulsi been hurt by any of her comments?? Blue_Tires Nov 2019 #136

There is a phone conference tonight for Beto suppoters Gothmog Nov 2019 #145

This the first I've heard of this MustLoveBeagles Nov 2019 #146

I miss the call but here is a story about this call Gothmog Nov 2019 #147

Thank you MustLoveBeagles Nov 2019 #162

This message was self-deleted by its author Tipperary Nov 2019 #160