Democratic Primaries

The Mouth

(3,414 posts)

30. Personal opinion? A bit

Thu Jan 16, 2020, 12:21 PM

Jan 2020

Since the facts are disputed as to whether Bernie said *exactly* what was claimed, it becomes a back-and-forth 'he said/she said'. And no candidate can appear to roll over in such a situation; to win ANY Democrat, in ANY situation had better be counterpunching.

You say something bad about me, I'm saying something worse about you; *regardless* of if what you said is true or not. This is how Trump fights. ANY attack, be it a snarky comment or something verifiable by extensive research is responded to in minutes, not fucking hours, with a full attack back.

"Truth" is determined by who wins, who hits hardest, just as "history" is written by those who win the wars.

Elizabeth could not afford to not strike back, no candidate can any more than we should give our soldiers in Afghanistan tutus and sparklers instead of guns and bulletproof vests.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided

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Did Warren end chances for both her and Bernie? [View all] Prosper Jan 2020 OP

I'm not going to answer. I sincerely hope I'm NOT the only one. It's over. Move on. Ninga Jan 2020 #1

Warren isn't the one who brought this up. yardwork Jan 2020 #2

No good comes out of it and that should have been the guiding light. Prosper Jan 2020 #8

No good comes of women allowing themselves to be pushed around. yardwork Jan 2020 #11

I honestly loved the strength she showed at the end of the of the debate Docreed2003 Jan 2020 #23

That's exactly how I saw it. yardwork Jan 2020 #25

She was fearless. sheshe2 Jan 2020 #105

I totally disagree. She just showed that she can't control her anger, putting those old vsrazdem Jan 2020 #27

You mean the stereotypes you're perpetuating right now? BannonsLiver Jan 2020 #33

No, as someone who marched in New York to get the ERA ratified, it pisses me off to no end vsrazdem Jan 2020 #45

SHE perpetuated the myth? sweetloukillbot Jan 2020 #76

what anger did she display in public? Tumbulu Jan 2020 #106

But, he got angry. And that is not a concern. Bummfuzzle Jan 2020 #107

None. She asked him a direct question. He refused to answer and stalked off. George II Jan 2020 #114

Coloring it like that is what keeps the old, false stereotypes in play. BuffaloJackalope Jan 2020 #34

There is no coloring it. That is what she did. Hillary never behaved that way. vsrazdem Jan 2020 #47

Maybe Hillary should have. nt jrthin Jan 2020 #51

And misogyny is what Bernie did. BuffaloJackalope Jan 2020 #52

She got plenty of criticism from people, e.g., for not confronting Trump when spooky3 Jan 2020 #78

Bingo. (nt) ehrnst Jan 2020 #112

Can't control her anger? kcr Jan 2020 #38

Yes, that is why I am so upset about her behavior. That is exactly what people will see, old vsrazdem Jan 2020 #42

Sorry. It's 2020. Women don't need to conform to outdated standards anymore n/t kcr Jan 2020 #43

Sure. vsrazdem Jan 2020 #46

Well kcr Jan 2020 #50

Exactly. Men can blow off but we can't...wtf. nt jrthin Jan 2020 #54

If women raise their voices...why they are angry, shrill...someone here wrote a post about how Demsrule86 Jan 2020 #57

That's not what I saw redstateblues Jan 2020 #127

The only ones who see your stereotype are the ones who want to. LanternWaste Jan 2020 #128

So the fact that Bernie is pretty much in constant yelling mode is ok AJT Jan 2020 #56

Funny how Sanders' anger is never an issue dansolo Jan 2020 #63

Oh it is. But unfortunately, we women are always held to a higher standard. vsrazdem Jan 2020 #64

An implicit admission you hold Bernie to a lower standard. LanternWaste Jan 2020 #129

She held it just fine. He's the one who just couldn't hold back. nolabear Jan 2020 #65

Well that's the way you saw it. I saw it differently. vsrazdem Jan 2020 #66

And so goes America. nolabear Jan 2020 #67

Lol BeyondGeography Jan 2020 #89

Speaking as only one professional woman, I totally agree with you and others spooky3 Jan 2020 #77

+1000. ehrnst Jan 2020 #119

+1...nt SidDithers Jan 2020 #62

+a bazillion spooky3 Jan 2020 #80

+1000 sheshe2 Jan 2020 #95

The results of polling after the debate show that she's gaining speed. ehrnst Jan 2020 #120

Sour grapes much? Wawannabe Jan 2020 #125

No. n/t obnoxiousdrunk Jan 2020 #3

So outright lies by the Sanders camp about deploying neg canvass scripts... moriah Jan 2020 #4

moriah said: "Do not attack the person's preferred choice, instead say you're excited for your cand Prosper Jan 2020 #13

Well, I did 2016 GE canvassing. moriah Jan 2020 #18

I don't think there is a solution. Prosper Jan 2020 #39

I also think it is over for Bernie. The Valley Below Jan 2020 #75

But he does have a sexist past dansolo Jan 2020 #111

Yep, Here in Ohio...I had my daughter wait in the car with her phone-with 911 dialed...I once had a Demsrule86 Jan 2020 #49

good on ya - that must have been tough nt spooky3 Jan 2020 #81

I was terrified...but I always as some here can tell you- have a big mouth... Demsrule86 Jan 2020 #98

I can't imagine. Piasladic Jan 2020 #93

He was really scary...and the dog was big...but it was either a bluff or he thought I would Demsrule86 Jan 2020 #99

We are talking about canvassing...you have to fight fire with fire in terms of ads etc. Demsrule86 Jan 2020 #53

Bollocks. Playing "what if" is why we have clutching pearls and fainting couches. abqtommy Jan 2020 #5

Any "Bernie Supporter" who voted for Trump... Happy Hoosier Jan 2020 #6

Amen! yardwork Jan 2020 #7

+1000 I don't get involved in the Sanders campaign drama on twitter... but I will say this. I do Demsrule86 Jan 2020 #40

... Wawannabe Jan 2020 #126

Let's hope so. We need to nominate Biden or Klobuchar. scheming daemons Jan 2020 #9

No. They just need to stop giving voice to CNN's desperate grasp for ratings. Nanjeanne Jan 2020 #10

No. But, she opened up a festering wound that people will keep scab-picking. MineralMan Jan 2020 #12

+10000. And this is on him...he hired non-Democrats in critical areas of his campaign who really Demsrule86 Jan 2020 #36

So are we blaming this on the "woman" candidate? Why is it assumed that Warren is the one causing still_one Jan 2020 #14

Any Bernie supporter should be ashamed of themselves if they voted for tRump groundloop Jan 2020 #15

WOW! BooScout Jan 2020 #16

Why is your question putting BlueMTexpat Jan 2020 #17

Do you think it helped Warren to confirm that on TV? Prosper Jan 2020 #22

Do you think it helped Sanders to call Warren a liar on TV? He could have ended with a Demsrule86 Jan 2020 #32

Agreed. I thought he could have explained it without saying it didn't happen. Prosper Jan 2020 #41

How on earth did Bernie "put an end" BlueMTexpat Jan 2020 #82

On the debate with Hillary Bernie said people are sick Prosper Jan 2020 #90

I remember that. BlueMTexpat Jan 2020 #91

+1000. ehrnst Jan 2020 #122

"Bernie Sanders Says Superdelegates Should Consider Hillary Clinton's Email Scandal" ehrnst Jan 2020 #115

Berned! George II Jan 2020 #132

The silence is deafening, isn't it? I know that being shown to be wrong stings... ehrnst Jan 2020 #133

The following May after the debate you reference.... ehrnst Jan 2020 #116

What - no retraction now that you've been corrected on your mistake? ehrnst Jan 2020 #131

I think most of this controversy is a media things. I don't think either Bernie/Warren are walkingman Jan 2020 #19

... LexVegas Jan 2020 #20

If they would only vote for Bernie, and not the Democratic candidate The Mouth Jan 2020 #21

Can't agree more. But did Elizabeth help herself? Prosper Jan 2020 #24

Personal opinion? A bit The Mouth Jan 2020 #30

Although I am more sympathetic to Warren, neither comes out of this comradebillyboy Jan 2020 #70

Time will tell. BlueMTexpat Jan 2020 #83

Yes she did. sheshe2 Jan 2020 #97

Anyone who is gunning for her will think anything she says is "hurting herself." ehrnst Jan 2020 #117

This is all just distracting bullshit Bayard Jan 2020 #26

I still support Elizabeth Warren katmondoo Jan 2020 #28

So after years of denial on the part of Sanders and his campaign, are you saying Demsrule86 Jan 2020 #29

Yes, you AND I would most certainly vote for Elizabeth... & Bernie would advocate for her too. InAbLuEsTaTe Jan 2020 #31

So Sanders should be the nominee to avoid a 'rift'...why even have a primary then? How about this... Demsrule86 Jan 2020 #68

Sometimes there's almost a blackmail tone sweetloukillbot Jan 2020 #79

No question and despite all the hype...I do not think he wins the nomination...let's hope people Demsrule86 Jan 2020 #130

Ah blame the woman BannonsLiver Jan 2020 #35

As a woman, I would be damned if I let a man make a fool of me when I know I am right GemDigger Jan 2020 #37

+1,000,000 George II Jan 2020 #44

Is this an example of "blaming the victim"? Victim shaming? still_one Jan 2020 #48

It sure in the hell sounds like it. nt Quackers Jan 2020 #72

go ahead and vote forTrump if you don't like what has been happening here lapfog_1 Jan 2020 #55

No. nt KPN Jan 2020 #58

Bernie supporters voting for Trump lees1975 Jan 2020 #59

No, my guess is that Bernie didn't ruin either her or his chances. LanternWaste Jan 2020 #60

"So what did Warren think would happen if she cost Bernie the nomination?"... SidDithers Jan 2020 #61

Sid...this! If Sanders loses it is on him...not Warren. Demsrule86 Jan 2020 #69

that is kind of odd - and entitled treestar Jan 2020 #71

Yeah - that one doesn't pass the sniff test blm Jan 2020 #94

Bernie has been anointed, don't you know? yardwork Jan 2020 #85

No coronations!!... SidDithers Jan 2020 #86

I don't agree. Warren is the victim in this situation. Blue_true Jan 2020 #73

Sanders action, Warren stands up for herself, Sanders being picked on. Bummfuzzle Jan 2020 #74

About right, IMO. BlueMTexpat Jan 2020 #84

The suggestion that Warren could "cost" BootinUp Jan 2020 #87

Lol. As usual, the woman is being held responsible for the man's behavior and its ramifications. Squinch Jan 2020 #88

I think you can look at this thread... boomer_wv Jan 2020 #92

Disagree 100% with you. Zolorp Jan 2020 #96

End? No... but definitely handicaps. N/T JustFiveMoreMinutes Jan 2020 #100

Unless Sanders said "women should not run for Prez," the whole thing is not worth Hoyt Jan 2020 #101

Boy you guys are seriously grasping today. Bernie is Bernie's worst enemy. MrsCoffee Jan 2020 #102

She did end it for Bernie for sure NYMinute Jan 2020 #103

No, but the truce is over. RandySF Jan 2020 #104

It would really take the cake if were Bernie not to win the nomination he blamed Warren. This emmaverybo Jan 2020 #108

Did Bernie call her a liar on national TV? A-Schwarzenegger Jan 2020 #109

Nah... Senator Sanders is doing whistler162 Jan 2020 #110

To be fair, Bernie fled NY and all the civil unrest for rural Vermont early in the 60's ehrnst Jan 2020 #121

That's funny Hav Jan 2020 #113

Bernie is just as involved, and is the author of his own outcome... ehrnst Jan 2020 #118

This is truth - Warren did NOT bring this up. lark Jan 2020 #123

Funny a Sanders supporter is blaming Warren Wawannabe Jan 2020 #124

Elizabeth Warren made a huge blunder commenting on stage Algernon Moncrieff Jan 2020 #134