Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News Editorials & Other Articles General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search
 

Manifestor_of_Light

(21,046 posts)
205. Radfems DO NOT HATE transwomen. They have a right to exist.
Sat Jul 11, 2020, 12:51 AM
Jul 2020

I have a problem with the ones who tell women how they should act, how they should look, and take away the label "women" from the XX female (AFAB--assigned female at birth).
Nobody I know is trying to deny trans women medical treatment, IF THEY ARE AN ADULT. I don't think children under 18 should be given hormones for sex change when this will make them sterile and cause medical problems.


#1, #3--Softball does not measure specific time, distance or speed, unlike track and field. A transgender high school girl in Connecticut, Terry Miller, has shattered the state track records for girls, prompting two girls to sue. A quote from one of them:

“It’s very frustrating and heartbreaking when us girls are at the start of the race and we already know that these athletes are going to come out and win no matter how hard you try. They took away the spots of deserving girls, athletes … me being included.”
So said Selina Soule, a junior from Bloomfield High School who “missed qualifying for the 55-meter in the New England regionals by two spots. Two spots, she said, that were taken by biological boys,” according to an article published on Intellectual Takeout:
Had the boys who identify as girls not been allowed to compete, Selina would have placed sixth, qualifying to run the 55 in front of college coaches at the New England regionals.
Instead, she placed eighth, watching the 55 from the sidelines after qualifying in only the long jump, an event in which the transgender athletes didn’t compete. …


#2---Since when do trans women "lose their muscle mass"? You really think a man who takes estrogen is going to lose the average 26 extra pounds of muscle mass he has compared to a woman? You got any data about how much weaker these transwomen become when they are not getting testosterone from their testes?

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s00421-006-0351-1
From a study of hand grip strength comparison between untrained men and elite female athletes: The present findings show that the differences in hand-grip strength of men and women are larger than previously reported. An appreciable difference still remains when using lean body mass as reference. The results of female national elite athletes even indicate that the strength level attainable by extremely high training will rarely surpass the 50th percentile of untrained or not specifically trained men.

https://www.livescience.com/52998-women-combat-gender-differences.html From the cited article:
But in one way, the sex difference is stark: Men are physically stronger than women, on average. A study in the Journal of Applied Physiology found that men had an average of 26 lbs. (12 kilograms) more skeletal muscle mass than women. Women also exhibited about 40 percent less upper-body strength and 33 percent less lower-body strength, on average, the study found.

The researchers found that height and weight differences between men and women could explain only about half of the difference in strength. ReseAnd a 2006 study in the same journal revealed that men had much stronger grips than women — the difference was so big that 90 percent of the women scored lower than 95 percent of the men. The team also looked at highly trained female athletes who excelled at sports requiring a strong grip, such as judo or handball. Though these women did have a stronger grip compared with other women, they still performed worse than 75 percent of the men on this task.

In general, men are also faster than women. The fastest woman in the world, Florence Griffith Joyner, ran the 100-meter dash in just 10.49 seconds in 1988, and that record remains unbroken. Yet her fastest time wouldn't have even qualified her for the men's 2016 Olympic competition, which requires competitors to finish the 100-meter sprint in 10.16 seconds or less.archers reporting in 1993 in the European Journal of Applied Physiology found that men's brawn could also be attributed to a larger cross-section in individual muscle fibers.


#6--This is very relevant when talking about gender dysphoria. There are many comorbidities, like anxiety, depression, body dysmorphic disorder, eating disorders. If a child is anxious, depressed, and searching for an identity, the answer is NOT to permanently and radically alter their body through hormones and surgery. The comment below talks about this.

https://digest.bps.org.uk/2018/01/17/most-children-and-teens-with-gender-dysphoria-also-have-multiple-other-psychological-issues/

Here's a comment on the above article from a parent who has lived with a child with rapid onset gender dysphoria.
When your daughter all of the sudden says she’s a boy at age 12 without a single symptom of gender dysphoria prior to that (this is called Rapid Onset Gender Dysphoria – ROGD), you start to take this seriously and not as a political cause, a civil rights movement, or an interesting scholarly debate.

These findings demonstrate what I have lived. Kids are being diagnosed with anxiety and depression now more than ever before. It’s these kids that are struggling with fitting in, with being perfect, with hating their bodies that find the siren song of trans.

Thankfully, we saw our daughter’s depression (and flirtation with an eating disorder) just before her claim she was transgender. In the US, psychologists typically follow the APA treatment guidelines of affirmation therapy and so her licensed therapist affirmed her as a boy and recommended a gender expert to start her on testosterone and plan her future surgeries. We quit therapy.

This is real. This is what is happening in nice, normal, non-bigoted, loving homes all across the world.

After a year of family suffering with no professional help and simply removing her access to transgender promotion on You Tube (Miles McKenna was her favorite vlogger) and some family bonding, she came to the realization on her own that she was not transgender. I can guarantee that had we kept her in therapy and affirmed her belief, that she would be transitioning to male.
Here are her words, “I realized that I just wanted a reason for the way I felt, that the second I found this seemingly possible solution, I grasped onto it and wouldn’t let go. It seemed like the perfect solution; it came with something to fight for as well. There were others like me, and it felt good to finally belong somewhere. I was finally a part of something bigger than myself. It seemed perfectly imperfect. But now I was realizing that this was not the solution. I was suddenly grateful that I had not transitioned. It would have ruined me.”

Wake up. There is a terrible mistake and a terrible consequence to medicalizing children with such a paucity of data. Forget data – there is NO reliable diagnosis. The assumption that children are infallible in their understanding of who they are is ludicrous.

As a PhD Neuroscientist, I am well aware that the brain, especially the cortical structures that foster reasoning and judgement, are not fully developed until approximately age 25. No one should be providing experimental medicines with known side effects (some irreversible) to children with an neurophysiologically un-diagnosable, theoretical, undefined “condition” of feeling like they are “in the wrong body.”

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

Cancel Rowling soothsayer Jul 2020 #1
This - she's a bigot n/t FreeState Jul 2020 #27
What a stupid letter JonLP24 Jul 2020 #2
That seems to be the general consensus. N/T lapucelle Jul 2020 #3
And don't forget these (courtesy of Daniel dale) soothsayer Jul 2020 #4
If you can't see twitter, it's trump urging to: soothsayer Jul 2020 #6
+1 Nevilledog Jul 2020 #7
I find some of the names attached to that letter bewildering. lapucelle Jul 2020 #10
Me too. Mike 03 Jul 2020 #15
Yeah, that jumped out at me too. Miguelito Loveless Jul 2020 #17
His understanding of the alt-right and the rise of fascism hasn't really kept up with reality. WhiskeyGrinder Jul 2020 #21
Maybe He Thinks RobinA Jul 2020 #143
"Both sides" of what? WhiskeyGrinder Jul 2020 #145
Right And Left RobinA Jul 2020 #176
"Wait until you hear about racism and sexism." fleur-de-lisa Jul 2020 #5
Exactly! mountain grammy Jul 2020 #114
Telling it like it is. oasis Jul 2020 #126
Do not even use the term Cancel Culture Sanity Claws Jul 2020 #8
"Cancel Culture" Miguelito Loveless Jul 2020 #18
Holding people responsible is right Sanity Claws Jul 2020 #23
Oh, I agree with you Miguelito Loveless Jul 2020 #34
You'd be able to run them down faster snort Jul 2020 #43
Hold on a minute... lame54 Jul 2020 #22
haha. You are so right. Sanity Claws Jul 2020 #25
"Cancel Culture" is a right-wing shibboleth. backscatter712 Jul 2020 #102
+100000 Celerity Jul 2020 #199
The only ones who cry about this are those who suck. JNelson6563 Jul 2020 #9
Imagine being sad when you have to hear the little people's objections to your views. WhiskeyGrinder Jul 2020 #11
I've always respected Chomsky janterry Jul 2020 #12
What does it mean to "value all speech"? WhiskeyGrinder Jul 2020 #20
There is a difference between... lame54 Jul 2020 #26
+1 Nevilledog Jul 2020 #31
Cancel culture is practiced by those that are afraid janterry Jul 2020 #46
Cancel culture is simply a passive method designed to avoid the consequences of free speech LanternWaste Jul 2020 #49
I agree with you cabot Jul 2020 #53
Bullshit... lame54 Jul 2020 #59
I hate wind turbines. I'm a radical environmentalist and leftist. hunter Jul 2020 #70
Disagree strongly. Caliman73 Jul 2020 #71
Very well said. Doodley Jul 2020 #84
Yep. No need to pay bigots to spout their bigotry. Nt lostnfound Jul 2020 #104
So when Rowling spouts TERF nonsense, what should we do? Cuthbert Allgood Jul 2020 #39
We ShOuLd VaLuE It WhiskeyGrinder Jul 2020 #50
Whatever you do gird your loins before daring to dissent on the one of her Twitter threads TubbersUK Jul 2020 #62
My money is mine - I tend to avoid buying things from people that piss me off. backscatter712 Jul 2020 #113
She Should Not Be Punished RobinA Jul 2020 #147
Why shouldn't transgender people mass respond? Humanist_Activist Jul 2020 #153
She's not being punished for her speech. People are pushing back on a platform that allows such WhiskeyGrinder Jul 2020 #164
Rowling's Disagreement RobinA Jul 2020 #179
"Sure, just like David Duke's disagreement with Black people is one way of looking at an issue, WhiskeyGrinder Jul 2020 #180
Block her vile hate speech. Voltaire2 Jul 2020 #178
One imagines that if we value speech, we then realize the consequences of that speech. LanternWaste Jul 2020 #48
Well, except for the speech deemed "cancel culture" kcr Jul 2020 #103
Wow. This is really stupid. You are free to say things. People are free to not like what you say. Squinch Jul 2020 #13
Yes - such a pompous, inane letter IMO - read it twice & can't find any substance in it n/t TubbersUK Jul 2020 #19
Dummies JustAnotherGen Jul 2020 #14
Ummm, no... Miguelito Loveless Jul 2020 #16
As a person that has read her tweets/essay repeatedly FunkyLeprechaun Jul 2020 #58
She just likened transitioning to "conversion therapy" Miguelito Loveless Jul 2020 #61
If you watch the BBC Newsnight excerpt FunkyLeprechaun Jul 2020 #72
I recall her being defended by the cast Miguelito Loveless Jul 2020 #121
"She just likened transitioning to "conversion therapy"" Doodley Jul 2020 #85
I am aware of no reputable Miguelito Loveless Jul 2020 #119
What process are you talking about? Doodley Jul 2020 #127
of dosing 2 and 4 year olds with hormones. Miguelito Loveless Jul 2020 #170
No, I don't know of that process either, but the process of reinforcing that a Doodley Jul 2020 #182
Again, I have seen no credible evidence that Miguelito Loveless Jul 2020 #183
Are you kidding me? Doodley Jul 2020 #184
In the video of the Tavistock Centre FunkyLeprechaun Jul 2020 #132
Thank you for bringing it to my attention Miguelito Loveless Jul 2020 #169
One point though Miguelito Loveless Jul 2020 #171
Thanks for a well reasoned post. nt delisen Jul 2020 #66
You're welcome FunkyLeprechaun Jul 2020 #75
did jk rowling write this WhiskeyGrinder Jul 2020 #69
Thank you romana Jul 2020 #81
This is a big oof. "TRAs?" Really? Sophia_Of_PlanetX Jul 2020 #90
My answers FunkyLeprechaun Jul 2020 #94
Re: Sophia_Of_PlanetX Jul 2020 #95
Fallon Fox, MtF trans, seriously injured Tamikka Brents and destroyed her career. Manifestor_of_Light Jul 2020 #201
The Federalist is a Conservative, Pro-Trump Propaganda Site. Also, Responses Below... Sophia_Of_PlanetX Jul 2020 #204
Radfems DO NOT HATE transwomen. They have a right to exist. Manifestor_of_Light Jul 2020 #205
Every TERF I've seen online or IRL absolutely hates trans women and wants them not to exist. Sophia_Of_PlanetX Jul 2020 #206
Thanks. Like you, at first, I was disappointed cabot Jul 2020 #99
Have you looked at the 'TransTrain' Documentary? janterry Jul 2020 #133
I haven't FunkyLeprechaun Jul 2020 #135
We knew a family in FL janterry Jul 2020 #136
Anybody who believes Proud Liberal Dem Jul 2020 #186
The tavistock therapists believe there is a push. janterry Jul 2020 #191
You aren't Trans Proud Liberal Dem Jul 2020 #187
I'm not trans, that's right FunkyLeprechaun Jul 2020 #189
10 years of therapy?! Proud Liberal Dem Jul 2020 #198
Buck himself said therapy took a while FunkyLeprechaun Jul 2020 #200
Therapy is always part of the process Proud Liberal Dem Jul 2020 #203
Her Opinions RobinA Jul 2020 #148
Sounds good to me n/t Devil Child Jul 2020 #24
Sounds good to me too. Owl Jul 2020 #101
WTF happened to Rowling??? NT Bleacher Creature Jul 2020 #28
She's been TERFing for years. WhiskeyGrinder Jul 2020 #29
She's upset because she's down to her last 14.3 million Twitter followers poor thing TubbersUK Jul 2020 #35
Her two major fan groups Miguelito Loveless Jul 2020 #37
Cancel the cancel culture? soothsayer Jul 2020 #30
"Cancel" is not censorship. hunter Jul 2020 #32
JK Rowling wrote some absolutely genius kids' books & oversaw their wonderful movies. ... Hekate Jul 2020 #33
Based on the recent backlash, Rowling's signature is most likely an exercise in self-service. lapucelle Jul 2020 #41
Which begs the question: what are they all reading into it, and what are we? Hekate Jul 2020 #65
Many of them are of an era that has a different concept of liberalism and progressivism than the WhiskeyGrinder Jul 2020 #67
I don't think that is what is meant by illiberalism. lapucelle Jul 2020 #78
Rowling has already been cancelled by most of us obamanut2012 Jul 2020 #36
*sigh* Miguelito Loveless Jul 2020 #40
There you go, being reasonable! Maeve Jul 2020 #56
A number of my heroes have disappointed me over the years Miguelito Loveless Jul 2020 #60
... CatLady78 Jul 2020 #195
Agreed Miguelito Loveless Jul 2020 #196
Exactly.nt CatLady78 Jul 2020 #197
Sociopathic and evil? That seems a bit ridiculous. tritsofme Jul 2020 #44
Agreed. Miguelito Loveless Jul 2020 #63
What we're seeing is the death of nuance. musicblind Jul 2020 #108
Yes! betsuni Jul 2020 #116
I have criticized Rowling Miguelito Loveless Jul 2020 #124
This message was self-deleted by its author CatLady78 Jul 2020 #193
she is sociopathic and evil obamanut2012 Jul 2020 #138
Right...how very silly. tritsofme Jul 2020 #173
See, the 'evil' part is the problem with your statement. musicblind Jul 2020 #107
A list of people and things Donald Trump tried to get canceled before he railed against 'cancel cult soothsayer Jul 2020 #38
*Some* people and entities Trump has tried to get canceled soothsayer Jul 2020 #42
I actually agree on Bill Maher JonLP24 Jul 2020 #45
I do not support any cancel culture janterry Jul 2020 #47
I think it is the other way around JonLP24 Jul 2020 #51
Beautifully put: Mike 03 Jul 2020 #54
This is not what those against cancel culture think janterry Jul 2020 #88
I Am Utterly Against RobinA Jul 2020 #149
I remember when the ACLU used to fight for all speech janterry Jul 2020 #86
Exactly. musicblind Jul 2020 #109
Hmmm... OneGrassRoot Jul 2020 #52
Things have gone too far when someone states an leftyladyfrommo Jul 2020 #55
In 1977 the American Nazi party planned a march leftyladyfrommo Jul 2020 #68
First coming to term with it... it's a symptom rather than a cause ck4829 Jul 2020 #76
Mobs don't like anyone who makes them feel stupid. leftyladyfrommo Jul 2020 #83
Rightwingers have been trying to silence me my whole life. I see no reason to copy their methods struggle4progress Jul 2020 #57
A list of those signing the letter.. jalan48 Jul 2020 #64
The blessed "published" might examine their motives. hunter Jul 2020 #73
Salman Rushdie, New York University jalan48 Jul 2020 #74
My attention is not limited to names. hunter Jul 2020 #77
LOL-I'm sure you have. jalan48 Jul 2020 #79
Salman Rushdie might ask my advice. hunter Jul 2020 #80
Boylan has already apologized for signing, LMAO. WhiskeyGrinder Jul 2020 #96
I am opposed to the cancel culture and will boycott anyone who disagrees with me! Doodley Jul 2020 #82
This message was self-deleted by its author geralmar Jul 2020 #87
Some examples of what the letter might be talking about. Jim__ Jul 2020 #89
. WhiskeyGrinder Jul 2020 #92
. Jim__ Jul 2020 #105
What a disingenuous post. WhiskeyGrinder Jul 2020 #110
Talk about disingenuous. Have you even read the letter? Jim__ Jul 2020 #118
I have read the letter. It commits the common -- and disingenuous -- error of treating "all sides" WhiskeyGrinder Jul 2020 #137
Can we have an end to cancel cancel culture? meadowlander Jul 2020 #91
+1 Owl Jul 2020 #100
They lost me with their claim of "the intolerant climate that has set in on all sides." VOX Jul 2020 #93
You are correct about the right. They aren't the same, but we can't become them. musicblind Jul 2020 #112
We have the right to protect ourselves. These scum want us dead. backscatter712 Jul 2020 #123
Tolerance is not a moral precept. It is a peace treaty. backscatter712 Jul 2020 #115
Sorry it has to fit into a single tweet Steelrolled Jul 2020 #97
Political correctness evolved into cancel culture because of social media. betsuni Jul 2020 #98
Those who complain about "Political Correctness" just want to say the n-word in "polite" company... Humanist_Activist Jul 2020 #139
No. It was a term used by the Left first. betsuni Jul 2020 #140
No, I'm talking about current context, just like how this letter is just a transphobe... Humanist_Activist Jul 2020 #142
"elitists" betsuni Jul 2020 #146
Generally people who never have to worry about juggling rent and groceries, who have access... Humanist_Activist Jul 2020 #150
As if all intellectuals and smart people are rich. betsuni Jul 2020 #152
Uhm, do most of these people have to work 50+ hours a week to be able to make rent every month? Humanist_Activist Jul 2020 #155
LOL! betsuni Jul 2020 #156
Do you have something of substance to contribute? n/t Humanist_Activist Jul 2020 #158
Um, it's not about me. betsuni Jul 2020 #159
Post removed Post removed Jul 2020 #161
LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL "ELITIST" LOL betsuni Jul 2020 #162
Didn't Bill Maher already do this ? It's usually some random unknowns JI7 Jul 2020 #106
I *LOVE* Cancel Culture qwlauren35 Jul 2020 #111
People are trying to catch us up on our divisions. herding cats Jul 2020 #117
Cancel culture isn't about change or social justice. musicblind Jul 2020 #120
+1 cabot Jul 2020 #122
You can't change everyone's mind . It just turns into those who are victimized having to be the ones JI7 Jul 2020 #125
Excellent post. Music Man Jul 2020 #129
+1 betsuni Jul 2020 #130
Excellent post. Thank you. Owl Jul 2020 #134
There's that one deal about casting the first stone that comes to mind. gulliver Jul 2020 #128
Wow, Chomsky? That's going to burst some people's bubbles. BannonsLiver Jul 2020 #131
As you can see, the bus is already backing up over him. Behind the Aegis Jul 2020 #181
He's a transphobe. Dr. Strange Jul 2020 #185
Methinks thou doth protest too much Steinem and Chomsky Beringia Jul 2020 #141
Zephyr Teachout signed the letter. How does she fit in? N/T lapucelle Jul 2020 #144
She comes from a white elitist family, why wouldn't that be a good fit Beringia Jul 2020 #151
I had no idea she is from an elitist family. lapucelle Jul 2020 #154
First paragraph of Early life section of her Wiki page, Humanist_Activist Jul 2020 #157
That doesn't make her family "elitist". lapucelle Jul 2020 #163
Just because she is a progressive and allies with Cortez, doesn't mean she has not Beringia Jul 2020 #160
Also I am grappling with this issue myself recently Beringia Jul 2020 #165
How is her family "elitist"? lapucelle Jul 2020 #166
I use the definition of someone who has professors as parents Beringia Jul 2020 #167
It isn't like it was decided upon by committee gollygee Jul 2020 #168
"Cancel culture?" WHY does every frickin thing have to be so Kashkakat v.2.0 Jul 2020 #172
Cancel culture is just a mob in internet form Sympthsical Jul 2020 #174
There's not much I disagree with in that letter... SKKY Jul 2020 #175
What's cancel culture? Polybius Jul 2020 #177
Severely depressing Proud Liberal Dem Jul 2020 #188
Salman Rushdie signed it treestar Jul 2020 #190
Good point. betsuni Jul 2020 #192
Nothing says "canceled" like a de facto contract on your life. N/T lapucelle Jul 2020 #194
cancel culture melman Jul 2020 #202
Cancel the cancellations gulliver Jul 2020 #207
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»J.K. Rowling, B.Weiss & N...»Reply #205