General Discussion

Statistical

(19,264 posts)

8. It is untested so it would end up before SCOTUS however I do think SCOTUS will find it

Sun Nov 22, 2020, 02:54 PM

Nov 2020

Unconstitutional.

Keep in mind if Presidents can self pardon then it applies to all future Presidents include Democratic ones. It means the President is 100% above the law federally. He can't be prosecuted until he leaves office and he can self pardon himself before he does.

The end state would be all Presidents beyond the rule of law and as a matter of course self pardoning before leaving office to grant themselves unlimited immunity. The office of the Presidency would be subject to no (federal) rule of law.

Not even the rightwingers want to see that. It would be the judiciary massively reducing the power of the judiciary branch and forever elevating the power of the executive branch. The judiciary branch to include SCOTUS. SCOTUS voting to make SCOTUS impotent against the power of the now even more powerful Presidency.

Edit history

Please sign in to view edit histories.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

54 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

Self pardon Questions again. IF Rump self pardons, in last hours of his presidency [View all] bluestarone Nov 2020 OP

Message auto-removed Name removed Nov 2020 #1

No, Trump can't pardon himself. The Constitution tells us so. Add to list Gothmog Nov 2020 #2

The constitution only goes THIS far: elleng Nov 2020 #5

The Constitution does not say that a sitting president cannot be indicted csziggy Nov 2020 #10

It's merely a DoJ guideline, elleng Nov 2020 #14

Yes, but the "sitting president cannot be indicted" part has not been challeged - ever csziggy Nov 2020 #17

It's only a line in a memo about indicting Spiro Agnew. LastLiberal in PalmSprings Nov 2020 #18

Right. elleng Nov 2020 #50

And the (next) Attorney General could revoke it with the stroke of a pen. lastlib Nov 2020 #54

The Question DOES need to be addressed by the SC! ( i feel) bluestarone Nov 2020 #6

Message auto-removed Name removed Nov 2020 #29

AND let's remember StarfishSaver Nov 2020 #49

NEVER even gave this a thought! TY bluestarone Nov 2020 #52

It's not been determined that he can't pardon himself, and the way to test whether he can The Velveteen Ocelot Nov 2020 #3

Agree BUT bluestarone Nov 2020 #9

It doesn't work that way. The court has to have a case before it - The Velveteen Ocelot Nov 2020 #26

ok Gotcha! TY bluestarone Nov 2020 #37

Short answer: Yes. The Velveteen Ocelot Nov 2020 #39

TY very much. Understanding better here. Can i ask of youtwo more questions? (if Rump does not do it bluestarone Nov 2020 #40

Since the power to pardon is in the Constitution and is not limited there, The Velveteen Ocelot Nov 2020 #42

Again TY bluestarone Nov 2020 #43

Isn't part of accepting a pardon admitting to the crime for which the person has been pardoned? LastLiberal in PalmSprings Nov 2020 #19

Not really. The Velveteen Ocelot Nov 2020 #22

No, that is a common myth sarisataka Nov 2020 #23

You've provided great explanations in this thread. Thanks! StarfishSaver Nov 2020 #48

The SC needs to go on record supporting or denying self pardons exboyfil Nov 2020 #4

They don't do that. The Supreme Court doesn't "go on record" about an issue The Velveteen Ocelot Nov 2020 #24

I met to imply that the AG's US Attorney or a Special Prosecutor exboyfil Nov 2020 #27

So be it matt819 Nov 2020 #7

It is untested so it would end up before SCOTUS however I do think SCOTUS will find it Statistical Nov 2020 #8

RIGHT! and bluestarone Nov 2020 #13

Nope onenote Nov 2020 #36

I thought they stated no one is above the law pertaining to his taxes (state of course) bluestarone Nov 2020 #38

You're thinking of the Trump v. Vance opinion onenote Nov 2020 #47

You're right, like usual! bluestarone Nov 2020 #53

OH WHO CARES? essme Nov 2020 #11

If he did everything lawfully and was such a law abiding president why did he self pardon himself kimbutgar Nov 2020 #12

An interesting part is bluestarone Nov 2020 #15

Not so. See #22. The Velveteen Ocelot Nov 2020 #28

I gotta say her and now that i really expect him to test it and bluestarone Nov 2020 #16

this would go to Supreme Court and the chance of it being ruled invalid is enough that beachbumbob Nov 2020 #20

THIS is another GOOD thought bluestarone Nov 2020 #21

I'm sure he won't take that chance, when all he has to do is resign MineralMan Nov 2020 #25

I think you are right exboyfil Nov 2020 #30

Pence will have gotten his reward in being the 46th President, and he's not going to double OnDoutside Nov 2020 #32

No Pressure Needed. MineralMan Nov 2020 #35

Whether a Self-pardon is possible, or President Pence pardons him, the question I posed on Friday OnDoutside Nov 2020 #31

The only argument against it is to keep his viability for 2024 exboyfil Nov 2020 #33

We do know he only looks to win the moment, so I don't think it matters, OnDoutside Nov 2020 #45

Scenario, Trump has Federal pardon, which doesn't actually stop investigation, it beachbumbob Nov 2020 #34

My suspicion is that Biden would be happier if trump takes the pardon. OnDoutside Nov 2020 #44

Let him pardon himself. marie999 Nov 2020 #41

no he can't because self pardon does not pass any logic test... Takket Nov 2020 #46

If election to the presidency is a Get Out of Jail Free card for any future candidate Mr. Ected Nov 2020 #51