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boston bean

(36,932 posts)

47. He could try using common sense.

Reply to uponit7771 (Original post)

Wed Dec 16, 2020, 01:36 PM

Dec 2020

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Ibram Kendi: "...We need evidence that progressives hurt down ballot democrats..." on MJ [View all] uponit7771 Dec 2020 OP

Some folk here act like the many battlefront pols who testified as to their 'Defund', etc.' empedocles Dec 2020 #1

I saw polls that claimed some things weren't popular but not that the unpopularity of an idea was... uponit7771 Dec 2020 #3

thing is, what progressives fight for, they believe in bigtree Dec 2020 #7

I respect progressive's beliefs and what they're fighting for. They just have to learn to win Walleye Dec 2020 #20

they do win bigtree Dec 2020 #22

Unfortunately, it seems we need more than that. Walleye Dec 2020 #28

It is not enough given our system to give us majorities in Congress or the Senate...or on Demsrule86 Dec 2020 #32

Its also not correct BGBD Dec 2020 #55

I am a progressive. The difference between me and some of my fellow progressives is I want to win. Demsrule86 Dec 2020 #34

That's it exactly. The one thing we don't want is to divide this party. Walleye Dec 2020 #40

+1, exactly. Progressive means "Bernie supporter" in R B Garr Dec 2020 #69

Exactly, you describe my view perfectly. msfiddlestix Dec 2020 #82

They have to convince people treestar Dec 2020 #56

Republicans are the ones defunding the police by not supporting state/local. Why weren't we shouting liskddksil Dec 2020 #16

Because it doesn't sound authentic - or work effectively. empedocles Dec 2020 #21

Does anything they tag us with sound authentic? Not to us because we are rational. But the American liskddksil Dec 2020 #23

Because we would lose. If you have explain than, you have already lost. Demsrule86 Dec 2020 #35

That's not explaining that's going on offense. We spend too much time on their terms - liskddksil Dec 2020 #38

+1, ... and if we were defining the opponent first they couldn't hit back hard enough for that uponit7771 Dec 2020 #68

It was visuals and messaging underpants Dec 2020 #2

Looks like the main point of the article is what we "think" might not meet up with reality no matter uponit7771 Dec 2020 #4

NO! The experts have decreed gratuitous Dec 2020 #5

+1, I would accept it if there were a multitude of polling showing these ideas hurt down ballot dems uponit7771 Dec 2020 #9

There are exit polls as well as earlier polls showing this would hurt us...and I have posted some Demsrule86 Dec 2020 #31

There are no exit polls showing down ballot dems who were up outside of MOE losing because of DTP uponit7771 Dec 2020 #53

Get thee to the greatest page malaise Dec 2020 #6

The crazy Qanonsense Rep from Colorado randr Dec 2020 #8

The Biden campaign has solid evidence from party polling. Hortensis Dec 2020 #10

We need to see it, I agree with the article. Dems being told something without seeing the evidence uponit7771 Dec 2020 #11

You say you need to "see," so mean it. "Seeing" means informing yourself. Hortensis Dec 2020 #17

Like the article said, there's no proof of it out there posted for the public showing that DTP was uponit7771 Dec 2020 #43

Here's a quick kick start from the WaPo, Uponit, with names Hortensis Dec 2020 #25

That's still no polling evidence, I think the article is clear uponit7771 Dec 2020 #44

Yes, there is and it's wrong to claim without evidence Hortensis Dec 2020 #46

You've not sited one poll of what's being requested, I disagree with Biden's assessment without uponit7771 Dec 2020 #52

You "disagree with Biden's assessment." Hortensis Dec 2020 #76

You're asking to prove a negative from the person that didn't make the assertion uponit7771 Dec 2020 #77

polling 'evidence' may well show republican's exploiting something someone said bigtree Dec 2020 #18

It's not just Republicans. Hostile LW dissident activists double teamed Hortensis Dec 2020 #19

so, still private citizens speaking out bigtree Dec 2020 #26

We're not talking about private citizens. We're talking about Hortensis Dec 2020 #27

the 'smear' isn't pointing to the origin of the term bigtree Dec 2020 #42

Yeah! a little help would be appreciated. You don't have to say every damn thing. Demsrule86 Dec 2020 #36

THANK YOU !!! Claiming a slogan that kGOP associated with dems was a gating factor in losses of uponit7771 Dec 2020 #59

I tend to believe that the bigger problem was that Bettie Dec 2020 #12

Biden who said from the beginning in the primary he did not want to defund the police won by Demsrule86 Dec 2020 #24

So, were those seats in NY and CA Bettie Dec 2020 #30

We had a good chance to win those seats...we have won every year since Trump was elected...so you Demsrule86 Dec 2020 #37

Well then, you moderates should Bettie Dec 2020 #41

Denial, denial and denial...just stop. It is clear that we need moderates with moderate views Demsrule86 Dec 2020 #13

All of that is still not evidence but anecdote. For instance republicans openly enable racism and uponit7771 Dec 2020 #14

There is polling evidence...but you all don't want it to be true so you won't accept it which is Demsrule86 Dec 2020 #29

That's not polling evidence of DTP being the reason down ballot dems lost when they were ahead uponit7771 Dec 2020 #45

You can google all the polls before and after the election...many saying that defund the police, Demsrule86 Dec 2020 #48

There's not one poll of what I'm requesting IE the reason why the article was written. You can't uponit7771 Dec 2020 #51

Well, Minnesota lost a Democratic House seat because of it. MineralMan Dec 2020 #15

Or it could be this wellst0nev0ter Dec 2020 #60

It was about messaging and "Defund the Police" was the wrong message. Sneederbunk Dec 2020 #33

That's just arguing about window dressing instead of fixing the foundation, which is our structural liskddksil Dec 2020 #39

+1, a lot of responses here are just repeating what the article is sounding off about; anecdotal ... uponit7771 Dec 2020 #50

He could try using common sense. boston bean Dec 2020 #47

Or evidence? There's not one poll anywhere showing DTP etc is reason why down ballot dems who were uponit7771 Dec 2020 #54

It is clear that this slogan hurt down ballot candidates Gothmog Dec 2020 #49

I agree with the author, we need empirical proof that it was a deciding factor on losses not guesses uponit7771 Dec 2020 #57

The GOP ran ads attacking this slogan constantly and they won Gothmog Dec 2020 #61

Then dem infrastructure would've picked up on it and responded right? NO !!! That's what the author uponit7771 Dec 2020 #65

This was a really stupid slogan that cost democrats races they could had won Gothmog Dec 2020 #72

Obvious falacous question aside we agree dtp wasn't the best slogan for winning uponit7771 Dec 2020 #73

You are wrong-tell the candidates who lost that they deserved to lose Gothmog Dec 2020 #79

Seems like there are a lot of "scary" phrases there Bettie Dec 2020 #58

"...Perhaps better framing on the part of Democrats would help..." 👈🏾👈🏾👈🏾 THIS !!! Either dems uponit7771 Dec 2020 #62

These attempts did not work in the real world Gothmog Dec 2020 #64

Then that's infrastructure not progressives !! You're citing is agreeing with the author, its not .. uponit7771 Dec 2020 #66

You are wrong Gothmog Dec 2020 #70

No empirical evidence of it was a slogan that was a gating factor in any of the losses and are you.. uponit7771 Dec 2020 #74

These candidates lost due to this ignrant slogan Gothmog Dec 2020 #80

Why 'Defund The Police' Attacks Were So Potent Against Democrats Gothmog Dec 2020 #63

This is polling of the popularity of sentiment not whether or not said sentiment was attached to ... uponit7771 Dec 2020 #67

Votes are what counts Gothmog Dec 2020 #71

You mean what democrats told them about the slogan right? If no then democrats should have responded uponit7771 Dec 2020 #75

In the real world, the GOP is using the idiotic defund the police in the Georgia senate races Gothmog Dec 2020 #78

In Texas, this dumb slogan cost us seats Gothmog Dec 2020 #81