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In reply to the discussion: I'm just SO TIRED [View all]

Tommymac

(7,334 posts)
46. Progress has always been 2 steps forward and at least 1 back.
Tue May 10, 2022, 02:04 PM
May 2022

One generation advances progress, then the next yearns for the 'good old days' and attempts to go fully back to it, but never quite gets there as this locks in the interim step so the 3rd generation starts again from an advanced position compared to Gen 1.

A very good philosophical novel that explains this process very well is 'Lila: An Inquiry into Morals ' by Robert M. Pirsig.

Yes - the same 20th Century philosopher who brought us "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance". In fact Lila is the 'sequel'.

Lila is a much harder read and not nearly as popular as Zen, however if one takes the time to read and comprehend what Pirsig is trying to tell us it is actually the more powerful of the set.

I would recommend reading Zen first to fully understand the foundations of the philosophy Pirsig is attempting to develop, but it is not required.

From Wiki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lila:_An_Inquiry_into_Morals :

Another theme analyzed using the Metaphysics of Quality is the interaction between intellectual and social patterns. Pirsig states that until the end of the Victorian era, social patterns dominated the conduct of members of the American culture. In the aftermath of World War I, intellectual patterns and the scientific method acceded to that position, becoming responsible for directing the nation's goals and actions. The later occurrences of fascism are seen as an anti-intellectual struggle to return social patterns to the dominant position. The hippie movement, having perceived the flaws inherent in both social and intellectual patterns, sought to transcend them, but failed to provide a stable replacement, degenerating instead into lower level biological patterns as noted in its calls for free love.





On Edit: Found this gem (to me), though he has left this world in 2017, Pirsig's Third book is out: "he co-authored ... 'On Quality: An Inquiry Into Excellence: Selected and Unpublished Writings' (2022) along with his wife (now widow) and editor, Wendy Pirsig"

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I'm just SO TIRED [View all] Jilly_in_VA May 2022 OP
Yes Timewas May 2022 #1
You speak for so many of us. NanceGreggs May 2022 #2
THIS 👆🏻👆🏻👆🏻 LenaBaby61 May 2022 #3
I'm with you. brush May 2022 #4
I see myself in your words, Jilly in VA Deuxcents May 2022 #5
You're in good company. onecaliberal May 2022 #6
You're not alone. Diamond_Dog May 2022 #7
Evil never sleeps. SoonerPride May 2022 #8
The exhausted majority... dlk May 2022 #9
I hear you. Take care Joinfortmill May 2022 #10
Me too. Thank you for how you lived your life. kr PufPuf23 May 2022 #11
Since the 60's spanone May 2022 #12
I'm tired dweller May 2022 #13
Me too. May all be uplifted. n/t KatK May 2022 #14
K&R Solly Mack May 2022 #15
I'm there with you, Jilly. brer cat May 2022 #16
Back in the 90's... WinstonSmith4740 May 2022 #17
The difference today Brenda May 2022 #38
True WinstonSmith4740 May 2022 #44
Over 50 years working on social justice, or just cheering it on, & now I wonder what for... Hekate May 2022 #18
I find myself saying those words BigmanPigman May 2022 #19
I hear you Jilly... Texasgal May 2022 #20
I'm just so tired locks May 2022 #21
Agree completely. SleeplessinSoCal May 2022 #22
I hear you AmBlue May 2022 #23
I sometimes wonder... Grumpy Old Guy May 2022 #24
Interesting question. I wonder who might have addressed it. electric_blue68 May 2022 #40
Probably not because it wasn't happening at home LeftInTX May 2022 #51
That is true. Grumpy Old Guy May 2022 #55
They didn't have CNN or MSNBC. They had three radio networks; now we have whatever you want... Evolve Dammit May 2022 #58
I completely identify with you, Jilly. smirkymonkey May 2022 #25
Have you considered soldierant May 2022 #26
Me too...what you said. StarryNite May 2022 #27
+ 1 pazzyanne May 2022 #28
I'm with you Bayard May 2022 #29
That's the key to coping while wnylib May 2022 #30
Progress has always been 2 steps forward and at least 1 back. Tommymac May 2022 #46
As others have said Cheezoholic May 2022 #31
Timothy Snyder, Yale holocaust historian: Grasswire2 May 2022 #32
Welcome to the club. RocRizzo55 May 2022 #33
You speak for me. BadgerMom May 2022 #34
Thank you, I needed someone to voice so well what I've been thinking and feeling. Biophilic May 2022 #35
Right there with you. hamsterjill May 2022 #36
"as if I haven't spent the last 50+ years DOING SOMETHING already!" betsuni May 2022 #37
Sing it, sister! Novara May 2022 #39
I have the stomach to pick up and move to another country, Susan Calvin May 2022 #42
I have nothing more I can add to this thread except a huge K&R! llmart May 2022 #41
This message was self-deleted by its author traitorsgalore May 2022 #43
K and R stage left May 2022 #45
let's start a commune markie May 2022 #47
You speak for me right now nt intrepidity May 2022 #48
Yes. Tired. And dejected that so many Americans are stupid and mean. Jakes Progress May 2022 #49
K & R. I feel you. ancianita May 2022 #50
I'm tired of asking for Democrats to fight harder. LiberalLovinLug May 2022 #52
I'm right there with you, Jilly! slightlv May 2022 #53
I feel it too Piasladic May 2022 #54
We knew this is where the country was headed when that black fella childfreebychoice May 2022 #56
Wow, you better than perfectly described my KPN May 2022 #57
I totally understand and commiserate. When I went to DC in 2001 afrter we invaded Iraq and 3-400,000 Evolve Dammit May 2022 #59
I get it. lees1975 May 2022 #60
How is Alito's declaration going to align with global business interests? WaterSong1951 May 2022 #61
I hear you, Jilly... electric_blue68 May 2022 #62
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