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ancianita

(43,342 posts)
7. Thing is, though, that calling destruction of property 'terrorism' skews the original definition
Sat Oct 7, 2023, 08:42 AM
Oct 2023

of terrorism as destruction to strike fear in humans toward a political end.
MAGA will try to make a case that he's not a terrorist because he tried only to destroy property or strike fear into a business entity.

Maybe for that reason I'm not as impressed by the label here. Because this isn't as easy a terrorism conviction as it looks. Prosecutors will still have to prove that this guy's motive was to kill humans and not just to destroy property.

Glad the FBI probably saved human lives indirectly, and one hopes that saving human lives should be what drives the FBI to prevent property destruction.

MAGA terrorism is real, as Wray has said under oath.
But if a terrorism upgrade in sentencing hasn't been all that successful in Jan 6 sentencings, I'd think that any conviction might be overturned if there isn't more terrorist convictions that have held on appeal through Jan 6 courts. If defense teams can show that prosecution can't prove motive, they can help MAGAts wiggle out of a terrorism charge.

Now the courts have to build a body of precedent -- I can't find the terrorism enhancement sentencing stats yet, so maybe they have -- so that future charges/convictions will hold with MAGA.


Invoking the terrorism enhancement typically adds about 15 years in prison to a defendant’s recommended sentence, sets the minimum calculation at 17 and a half years, and also flips the person charged into the criminal-history category used for serial offenders.

While prosecutors have yet to actually call for the enhancement at a sentencing for a Capitol riot defendant, the terrorism-related provision is playing a significant role behind the scenes.

At pretrial hearings, defense attorneys have indicated that they were unwilling to consider plea deals for their clients because prosecutors would not agree to refrain from seeking the domestic terrorism charges. In other cases, prosecutors seem to have dropped the enhancement, in exchange for cooperation from particular defendants.

Critics say giving prosecutors the authority to pursue or not pursue the massive sentence booster in cases stemming from political protests gives too much power to prosecutors in the process of negotiating a plea.

“It’s just lying there as a cudgel if they want it,” said Karen Greenberg, director of Fordham University law school’s Center on National Security. “It can be used so many different ways.”

Indeed, the range of crimes that can trigger the sentencing enhancement is sprawling. Under current law, 57 offenses are on the list, including such crimes as hostage-taking, destroying an aircraft, using fire or explosives to destroy a buildingband computer hacking that creates a public health or safety threat or impacts national security systems. Some of the so-called predicate offenses are quite obscure, including producing smallpox virus or assaulting a Nuclear Regulatory Commission inspector.


https://www.politico.com/news/2022/01/04/doj-domestic-terrorism-sentences-jan-6-526407

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

It's about time. no_hypocrisy Oct 2023 #1
Let me guess... Hugin Oct 2023 #2
Your guess is as good as mine at this point EYESORE 9001 Oct 2023 #3
A tenuous and circumstantial clue is an attack on Amtrak. Hugin Oct 2023 #4
No, it was Hillary marrying Bill that set him off! machoneman Oct 2023 #8
However they caught him, more power to the authorities, the Surveillance Society always wins bucolic_frolic Oct 2023 #5
K & R malaise Oct 2023 #6
Thing is, though, that calling destruction of property 'terrorism' skews the original definition ancianita Oct 2023 #7
he targeted a train full of employees and their families! mopinko Oct 2023 #9
Fine. As long as the FBI can prove that human death was what he intended. ancianita Oct 2023 #12
Goal posts moved a little. DontBelieveEastisEas Oct 2023 #40
Oh, yeah. I see. I equated "death" with fear. Okay. Yes, they'd have to prove that ancianita Oct 2023 #45
I'm confused, these trains had passangers too Farmer-Rick Oct 2023 #11
Fine. Let's look at another one -- that guy that shot at Planned Parenthood in MT. ancianita Oct 2023 #14
It would fall under terrorism because Farmer-Rick Oct 2023 #17
Okay. Well, I'm not claiming I'm right, but wondering out loud whether or not ancianita Oct 2023 #18
Yea, discussion is always welcomed Farmer-Rick Oct 2023 #23
he's also targeting critical infrastructure. mopinko Oct 2023 #27
True. ancianita Oct 2023 #33
I'm listening to the podcast, called The Alphabet Boys in which the FBI entraps Black Lives Matter mahina Oct 2023 #21
I hear you. ancianita Oct 2023 #34
Word mahina Oct 2023 #57
It's in America's DNA to blow up the threat of black people trying to get a fair playing field. jaxexpat Oct 2023 #37
I don't like over broad use either IbogaProject Oct 2023 #22
I hope judges see it that way. ancianita Oct 2023 #35
Endless excuses for white terrorists IronLionZion Oct 2023 #36
Dude lives with his dad about 500ft from tracks. Probably just got tired of the noise JanMichael Oct 2023 #10
I grew up living 500 ft from train tracks. liberal N proud Oct 2023 #15
I know how quickly you can get use to the noise Farmer-Rick Oct 2023 #25
I live about 250 yds from train tracks ExWhoDoesntCare Oct 2023 #42
Agreed liberal N proud Oct 2023 #66
Don't down play this. He wanted to hurt people, how many is the question. Bluethroughu Oct 2023 #16
Another East Palestine? orthoclad Oct 2023 #31
I would not be suprized. Bluethroughu Oct 2023 #52
Might also be a fired railroad worker Major Nikon Oct 2023 #24
He shoved a metal object where the track breaks direction, it's not rocket science. Bluethroughu Oct 2023 #53
Didn't think that one through vanamonde Oct 2023 #39
Holy shit! Bluethroughu Oct 2023 #13
POS tried to kill people. dalton99a Oct 2023 #19
He looks crazy eyed. Bluethroughu Oct 2023 #54
He lives in an industrial area and the track are a short distance from his home Historic NY Oct 2023 #20
And? So? ExWhoDoesntCare Oct 2023 #44
And so wtf is your problem Historic NY Oct 2023 #51
Mamas dont let your babies grow up to be anarchists onetexan Oct 2023 #26
Don't jump to conclusions eallen Oct 2023 #28
there always are DUers jumping to conclusions onenote Oct 2023 #32
I said a while back that if I ever found myself mahatmakanejeeves Oct 2023 #59
Despite his intentions, the thought orthoclad Oct 2023 #64
He has an agenda ExWhoDoesntCare Oct 2023 #47
I know of cases where this has been done solely for amusement. NT mahatmakanejeeves Oct 2023 #62
I did a search and found several articles and videos MagickMuffin Oct 2023 #29
Trains now. Was the power grid - orthoclad Oct 2023 #30
The linked articles don't say anything about him being MAGA FakeNoose Oct 2023 #38
Is it ForgedCrank Oct 2023 #41
I'm not seeing it yet, either. ExWhoDoesntCare Oct 2023 #48
Here's a good resource tracking extremists Nevilledog Oct 2023 #43
When did the FBI declare "MAGAtry" to be domestic terrorism? wnylib Oct 2023 #46
V much in this queue ExWhoDoesntCare Oct 2023 #49
A simple, easy search does not turn up ANY wnylib Oct 2023 #50
Welp... EYESORE 9001 Oct 2023 #55
I refer you to my #46 where I asked for sources wnylib Oct 2023 #56
This is a copy of the article from Newsweek. mahatmakanejeeves Oct 2023 #58
I may be ignorant, but foolish? EYESORE 9001 Oct 2023 #60
The foolishness was on Newsweek's part, not yours. mahatmakanejeeves Oct 2023 #61
I'll never mention it again EYESORE 9001 Oct 2023 #63
Registered Democrat WalterMatthews1776 Oct 2023 #65
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