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MadameButterfly

(3,964 posts)
65. It is possible that things just have to get bad enough
Mon Mar 17, 2025, 03:12 AM
Mar 2025

for enough people to get it. The voters who need to change wont listen to reason. They have to experience the pain.

Things have been going downhill for a long time. Even when Dems won the presidency, the RW paralized efforts for obvious things like gun control and climate change. The days of compromise died with the 70s. We couldn't keep going on that way. Dems could only slow the damage. Republicans took a wrecking ball in every time they assumed power. This is a logical consequence of all that with Putin really running the show.

I hate to imagine the pain that will be required to turn things around but I DO believe they will turn around. Dictators have a way of over-reaching and causing their own demise. I'm not saying I'm ok with the longevity of Putin's reign, but he could have left Ukraine alone, made treaties for their minerals and grains, even worked with the West, but no, he had to re-create the USSR and in so doing tanked Russia's economy. Hitler couldn't fight on one front, he had to fight on two. Trump is dumber than both of them combined. Elon is drunk with power. These types can't help themselves. They overreach.

Think, Trump could have used the presidency to stay free and taken credit for Biden's economy. Elon could have quashed all the investigations against him and left the rest of us alone, and his Tesla empire would still be intact and he'd be richer than he is now. We can, and we WILL destroy Tesla. There aren't enough MAGATs rich enough to keep Tesla afloat. Threaten SS and not buying a Tesla is easy. A French company is about to replace Starlink in Ukraine. And everywhere else in the world after that. Starlink will go the way of Tesla. Elon said cutting expenditures in the US would be "fun." Destroying Elon Musk will be FUN. Let's do it. He is not popular with MAGAs. He isn't what they meant. He will go down. He is "The Man Who Would Be King". They are the French Revolution, prone to arguments amongst themselves. Their necks will roll, one by one (figuratively speaking--but I don't rule out jail). A kid-like actor saying dumb stuff while wielding a chain saw will not have a lasting victory against people losing their SS. I hope it doesn't come to that but if it does, they will fall. Fast.

I don't like to share my religion, generally, but if you don't believe in God, and all the false proclamations made in his/her name, consider possibly that there is energy. Quantum Physics is a thing. A very small number of psychopaths and oligarchs are very weak, metaphysically speaking. There is a wealth of intelligent, compassionate, loving, ambitious, hard-working people who are emanating energy that will prevail. We don't know how this will take form. I often fall into fear because I don't know how, but history can be surprising.

What were the odds of the end of slavery? It required the North to do badly enough that Lincoln had to do the Emancipation Proclamation. If the North had been victorious early, it wouldn't have been required. If Gettysburg and Antietam had not procured Northern victories, there would not have been the credibility Lincoln was waiting for, for the Proclamation. The courageous battle of Fort Wagner was required at catastrophic losses for Black soldiers, and their commander. The Battle of Atlanta happened barely in time to salvage a Lincoln re-election over General McClellan who would have sued for peace (surrender). It took a series of miracles, a lot of suffering, but right prevailed.

I think there is so much we can't predict. Yes, we must strategize and keep fighting. But we must not lose hope. These people we are dealing with are really stupid. Soul-less. Mentally ill. We are love. We are genius. Buy some route we can't predict, we will win.

Recommendations

2 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

We didn't listen to Marley's Ghost Uncle Joe Mar 2025 #1
Yes. They are changing out the machinery, literally and figuratively, of our Wingus Dingus Mar 2025 #2
Sadly, I think you could be quite correct, Wingus. Irish_Dem Mar 2025 #9
Between this post of yours and that of wingus_dingus, I think you've laid it out too well. erronis Mar 2025 #19
They have zero reason to turn back. Irish_Dem Mar 2025 #22
Good analysis by all...... DENVERPOPS Mar 2025 #43
Yes. Irish_Dem Mar 2025 #44
All of the UBER rich and politicians DENVERPOPS Mar 2025 #45
IDK how it turned out. Irish_Dem Mar 2025 #46
The only thing DENVERPOPS Mar 2025 #50
Yes does suggest the Vets are mostly Trumpers. Irish_Dem Mar 2025 #51
Eloquently framed ID, athough nothing eloquent in the reality. yellow dahlia Mar 2025 #47
I know, where are the CIA, M16, military intel, etc? Irish_Dem Mar 2025 #49
Musk's coders are not just identifying women and minorities to fire, they're rewriting the code for government systems. Lonestarblue Mar 2025 #16
It's really hard pattyloutwo Mar 2025 #58
It's VERY hard. I lean closer to fleeing to Canada, at least to start. At least until my Maru Kitteh Mar 2025 #63
1) Yes, 2) Only a fall if one assumes things, 3) Presumes such a fall would be bad, 4) The final pivot out might be cool Bernardo de La Paz Mar 2025 #3
Well said. A glimmer of hope long-term for an extended period of misery. erronis Mar 2025 #21
It is possible that things just have to get bad enough MadameButterfly Mar 2025 #65
Of course mimitabby Mar 2025 #4
Governments are always for the ruling classes that set them up. bucolic_frolic Mar 2025 #5
It wasn't so quick. Grumpy Old Guy Mar 2025 #6
Maybe, but when we elected Pres. Obama I thought we had turned the corner groundloop Mar 2025 #10
I felt that way too when Obama was elected. Grumpy Old Guy Mar 2025 #18
Unfortunately, Obama's elections were the straw that broke the proverbial back. erronis Mar 2025 #24
That turned out to be a false hope, didn't it. After Obama we've gotten Trump twice. elocs Mar 2025 #57
Yes, yes, yes EverHopeful Mar 2025 #12
The last 2 months has been the culmination of the previous decades. n/t elocs Mar 2025 #32
I don't think maga is actually "miserable", ... yet. But they will turn on Muck first then tRump. Won't be pretty Bernardo de La Paz Mar 2025 #52
And this is going to happen as you say, just wait for the other shoe to drop. And MAGAs haven't seen anything yet. SWBTATTReg Mar 2025 #60
The build up to our fall from a democracy may have taken years, decades, elocs Mar 2025 #29
Excellent summation of key points along the path. Big Blue Marble Mar 2025 #64
It's not the fall of the American Empire oldmanlynn Mar 2025 #7
Why would I want to continue 'the American Empire'? Voltaire2 Mar 2025 #8
Empires usually don't believe they will fall even when the evidence is in front of them. elocs Mar 2025 #34
Fuck empires. I'm just fine with our shitty empire falling apart. Voltaire2 Mar 2025 #11
not everyone appreciates this. barbtries Mar 2025 #13
My 82-year-old husband is in DC at a veterans' protest at the Heritage Foundation. raging moderate Mar 2025 #23
I marched in Raleigh barbtries Mar 2025 #39
You said " But I did not know it would be illegal to post the news in the DU Lounge, so that ended that." notinkansas Mar 2025 #41
I made a joke in the Lounge but it was locked for being political. I thought it was too lightweight for GenDisc Bernardo de La Paz Mar 2025 #54
OK. Thanks for the clarification. notinkansas Mar 2025 #55
We're between a rock & a hard place because filling the streets may ultimately bring elocs Mar 2025 #35
At my age, I will never see the recouping of Democracy as I knew it. 634-5789 Mar 2025 #14
Yeah, I'm 72 and I feel the same. I think we took our democracy too much for granted. n/t elocs Mar 2025 #36
Marley's Ghosts is a very good description of where we are now - haele Mar 2025 #15
America First! becomes America Only! becomes America Alone become America Lonely. . . . . nt Bernardo de La Paz Mar 2025 #17
Very well said! It could be called "Unintended Consequences" but perhaps this destruction is actually erronis Mar 2025 #25
Complacent. Exactly. As Democrats, too many of us have become complacent. elocs Mar 2025 #42
We had all seen evil from a distance... Escape Mar 2025 #20
Yup SheltieLover Mar 2025 #26
Not the fall of the American empire, but the end of the American Century andym Mar 2025 #27
We built an empire after WWII. Voltaire2 Mar 2025 #30
No we didn't-- we did not have tribuatory states andym Mar 2025 #33
Quibble with words, but it ends up being the same thing. elocs Mar 2025 #66
Actually the difference is that Trump is trying to build a new American empire: by adding Greenland, Canada etc andym Mar 2025 #67
Uh, Yeah! I was born to be here now. calikid Mar 2025 #28
You are not alone. Voltaire2 Mar 2025 #31
It will go down in history as... S/V Loner Mar 2025 #37
Embracing Reality Is The 'Hopeful' Path... Reality Is The Reasoned Path Forward... MayReasonRule Mar 2025 #38
Yup, we're never going to be the same country again. But, maybe, if we survive the Rancid Menace Joinfortmill Mar 2025 #40
I'm going to start carrying raw sunflower seeds. haele Mar 2025 #48
The whole world will mourn. A European told me that they liked that America Demovictory9 Mar 2025 #53
Thank you, and everyone else, for your thoughtful posts Wild blueberry Mar 2025 #56
Hope springs eternal and comes from faith in yourself and others wintemark Mar 2025 #59
We need to look toward Europe to uphold democratic governance... AntiFascist Mar 2025 #61
American democracy died on 12/12/00 GoreWon2000 Mar 2025 #62
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